Does Friendship exist in the hobby?

[theindanguy]

I am fairly new to this place and to this hobby. Recently, I have seen few girls multiple times cause I liked them once and wanted to hang out. After the initial encounter, I have met few of them just to talk and share. Sometimes, just to hang out and have lunch or dinner with no $ being exchanged. I have taken few out just to buy gifts. Again no $ for their time.

Few of them have opened up and told me about their family, kids, friends etc. I like that as I feel its a personal thing and need not be shared with me. But again, I take everything with a pinch of salt.

We are all different people and have different reasons to be here. We all have our demons. But end of the day, we are all human.
As humans, we long for companionship, camaraderie, friendship, in the true sense of these words. Sex is probably the last thing we need to survive (or maybe the first after a few shots!)

Maybe I am being stupid or a hopeless romantic. Maybe I am being taken for a ride here. I don't know. And honestly, I don't care as I feel life is too short to keep mulling over things that have no definite answer.

I just wanted to share my thoughts with you all. If any of you have any thoughts on this, any advice; I would appreciate it. Thank you.

[CaptainKaos]

First, sex is the first thing we need to survive; without it we don't reproduce.

Second, you should do what makes you comfortable, but keep in mind this isn't a dating site.

[JRLawrence]

Originally Posted by theindanguy

I am fairly new to this place and to this hobby. ………………...

Few of them have opened up and told me about their family, kids, friends etc. I like that as I feel its a personal thing and need not be shared with me. But again, I take everything with a pinch of salt.
………..

This site is not about dating, or finding you a girlfriend. Get real guy. These girls have feelings, and so do you. But when you pay for sex, it is not on a personal level - so don't make it so, or you will be fucked up in the head. Be nice to the girls, but it is not personal. For that, you have to look elsewhere where you are NOT looking to get your rocks off: you are looking for a partner and a friend - and you don't fuck with your friends, or you won't have any.

Got it, you have to treat your friends with respect!

You need sex, and can't wait to have a possible future wife decide if she is ready or not, be patient with her and get your rocks off somewhere else - or relieve yourself before a date with her. Ladies, need to feel secure and protected and it takes some longer than others.

The hobby ladies understand more than you think. Do you understand what you want? Do you have goals in life? Where do you want to be in ten years, with your family, job, health, education, etc. i.e., How are you going to change yourself?

JR

[Johnny4455]

Respect these ladies. Seek sex from them. Avoid getting to know them as a friend. If you want a girlfriend or mistress look elsewhere.

Respect theses ladies.

That's my view based on my experience

[JayceeRivers]

I believe whole heartedly a friendship can exist. In fact ,unless the woman in question is as cold as a Canadian winter or the gentleman is less than pleasant to be around, it is hard not to develop some sort of feelings. Generally these stay in the friendship arena (thankfully)

Reproduction drives us to intimacy, yet intimacy releases dopamine. Dopamine combined with basic psychology, such as a visual representation and repetition, will inevitably cause "like" "Love" "adoration" and other such positive emotions associated with friendship.

A bit demeaning of a analogy but consider Pavlov's law. The dogs salivating at the sound of a bell. Understand that on some if not most occasion's we are both attaining this release of dopamine. I have met many a gentlemen who have fallen in a falsified love with their provider. Of course this does wear off eventually. However with the proper knowledge and outlines of what can and cannot be it fairs to reason that a friendship is inevitable provided both partners in the situation are likable to each other.

alternately one might wish to consider the psychy of the individuals as well. For instance, I personal do minimal socializing outside of the "hobby" By choice. So I develop friendships within to sate my natural need to integrate and socialize. There are elements of trust, business and of course the intricate issues of when the friendship impedes the business or the business impedes the friendship.

So in my opinion are friendships likely and realistic in the hobby? Absolutely. However both parties have to be open to the elements of trust.

Do I generally state it is a good idea? yes and no. Trust is something earned. Too often in this business either side can be taken advantage of. More often than not it is the gentleman with the kind open heart that finds himself abused of his finances, time and overall caring. It is vital to take ones time and be sure that the friendship is mutual. Be cautious of being taken advantage of. Always keep in mind both parties are human, they both feel, they both desire, they both need.

[theindanguy]

@JRLawrence:
Thank you for your response. Yes, I have been fucked in the head before and it took great courage and willpower to come out of it. I think you are right. This is not the right place for me to be in.
I need to ponder over your questions. This is the constant battle within me over what I want today versus what I would my future to be. I am young and I like to have fun. I earn enough to save and splurge. But I feel its time for me to re-prioritize.

[DestinyInKC]

Yes it can happen I have made some very good real life friends in this hobby.. whom even if I retired or they stopped seeing providers I would stay in contact with them.

It makes the sex even better too (if thats even possible lol!) when you know you have truly made a good friend!

[Lubeman]

Treat them with respect but don't get to close you might be asking for trouble. For the most part this is business .

[theindanguy]

@Destiny:

I am happy that you made friends! Yes, I have not been able to have sex with some of the girls, though we hugged, kissed and made out. Sex doesn't feel right to me when we are beyond that. Maybe I am a fool. I don't care.

I know this is a business and we hobbyists are in it for the short time companionship. But sometimes stuff happens and it goes beyond. I guess its human nature.

[theindanguy]

@Lubeman:

I treat everyone with the same respect and care that I would expect from them. Sometimes, I get screwed over. But its okay. I understand that everyone has reasons, compulsions and circumstances that are sometimes beyond their control.

[Unique_Carpenter]

But I see you struggling with confusion on the matter.

For hobby friendships:
Jaycee presents a detailed view. All of which is valid.
Destiny presents a brief but equally valid view.
And, JR and other guys have valid contra views.

However, there are all sorts of different levels of "friendship". I would think that in our hobby world, some folks can get easily confused, which is JR’s point, which you have admitted, and which Jaycee mentions can also happen.
However (sorry guys), but this is not strictly a one way or the other situation, even if the odds are against a "real" friendship developing. The concept simply needs to be taken in context, on a per person basis, as applies to our hobby world. Jaycee’s presentation, where she details various nuances (excellently by the way), has sections of which it appears to describe a situation similar to what that you fell into. And, she has other sections that allow friendships to develop. I was tempted to present similar ideas, but that would have been redundant. And, Destiny frankly states the benefits; yes the fun is more enjoyable.

Perhaps some of your confusion relates to how you view friendships outside (as well as inside) the hobby for appropriate context. In my real world, I have business competitors that I know very well, and they clearly fall into a classification of frenemy. We will pirate each other’s clients, but we also pick up each other’s bar tabs from time to time if we’re both going after a third competitor. My point being, again: Context.

Thus, for inside the hobby, and although I mention that JR and others have valid views, this does not foreclose the concept of a friendship developing, as Jaycee and Destiny have mentioned. Jaycee states the key element: “both parties have to be open to the elements of trust”. For our hobby world, I will repeat with a potential friend. But there's a quite different level of friend that I will multi-hour with. This gets into the hobby ATF definition, which (again I agree with Jaycee), takes quite some time to develop.

To close, note that even a true friendship outside the hobby can have pitfalls. Thus, once again, context, and on a per person basis. Last, I consider myself fortunate to have a couple long term friendships that originated within the hobby.

[DestinyInKC]

Originally Posted by theindanguy

@Destiny:

I am happy that you made friends! Yes, I have not been able to have sex with some of the girls, though we hugged, kissed and made out. Sex doesn't feel right to me when we are beyond that. Maybe I am a fool. I don't care.

I know this is a business and we hobbyists are in it for the short time companionship. But sometimes stuff happens and it goes beyond. I guess its human nature.

Just be careful hun. There are some lovely ladies out there, but there are also some not so lovely ones.

[JRLawrence]

Originally Posted by JayceeRivers

I believe whole heartedly a friendship can exist. In fact ,unless the woman in question is as cold as a Canadian winter or the gentleman is less than pleasant to be around, it is hard not to develop some sort of feelings. Generally these stay in the friendship arena (thankfully)

Reproduction drives us to intimacy, yet intimacy releases dopamine. Dopamine combined with basic psychology, such as a visual representation and repetition, will inevitably cause "like" "Love" "adoration" and other such positive emotions associated with friendship.

A bit demeaning of a analogy but consider Pavlov's law. The dogs salivating at the sound of a bell. Understand that on some if not most occasion's we are both attaining this release of dopamine. I have met many a gentlemen who have fallen in a falsified love with their provider. Of course this does wear off eventually. However with the proper knowledge and outlines of what can and cannot be it fairs to reason that a friendship is inevitable provided both partners in the situation are likable to each other.

alternately one might wish to consider the psychy of the individuals as well. For instance, I personal do minimal socializing outside of the "hobby" By choice. So I develop friendships within to sate my natural need to integrate and socialize. There are elements of trust, business and of course the intricate issues of when the friendship impedes the business or the business impedes the friendship.

So in my opinion are friendships likely and realistic in the hobby? Absolutely. However both parties have to be open to the elements of trust.

Do I generally state it is a good idea? yes and no. Trust is something earned. Too often in this business either side can be taken advantage of. More often than not it is the gentleman with the kind open heart that finds himself abused of his finances, time and overall caring. It is vital to take ones time and be sure that the friendship is mutual. Be cautious of being taken advantage of. Always keep in mind both parties are human, they both feel, they both desire, they both need.

Wow girl, you must have studied psychology!


JR

[duckrangler]

Take this or not, it's not quite worth what you've paid for it, your milage WILL vary...

While I've been involved in "the hobby" for quite a while now, I don't participate very often, and post here even less often. But over the years, I have made a number of friends, both female and male.

As for the male friendships, to be honest, I don't keep in touch with them as often as I should. My bad... Ill health over the last 4 or 5 years, and crazy work hours before and since, have taken their toll on ALL of my friendships, both in and out of the hobby.

Regarding female relationships I've made, I've only had one really bad experience, though I believe that I'm now seeing the results of a disappointing experience as well. But the good friendships have FAR outweighed the bad. One, in particular, who is active here, has become a very good friend over the last year or so, though we first met some 5 or 6 years ago. Another lady here on this board is also a friend, and there's one lady who is very much UTR, I consider both her and her husband among my best friends. I've been to their home on numerous occasions, even helping their children with their homework. And while they're still in the hobby, there are also a few friends with whom I've kept in touch after they've retired.

The one bad experience, I'd place the blame about 50/50 on myself, but paying off a car was WAY less expensive than a divorce. The dissapointing experience, the lady was addicted to drugs, and much of our relationship was while she was in jail or prison. Once out of prison, I helped get her into a halfway house, and she was doing much better for a couple of years, off of drugs, with a good job and going back to school, but now appears to have "fallen off the wagon," She had moved away from KC to be closer to family & get away from "bad influences," but now she's talking about moving back to KC and starting in the hobby again. I'm fairly certain that she's doing drugs again, and the only time I hear from her lately is asking for money.

It's completely natural for a guy who's being intimate with a woman to want to extend that intimacy past the physical act. I've read that the reason some guys get involved in the hobby is that they don't have anyone to talk to in real life. But remember that these ladies are professional, and for the really good ones, they understand it, and will make you believe that they care. Please don't misunderstand me, so really DO care, but you won't be able to tell the ones who care from those who don't.

For these ladies, it's a business transaction, and you should respect it as such, and respect the ladies who are performing a very valuable, and very difficult service. You shouldn't push any boundaries, and respect and decisions they make.

If you're VERY lucky, over time you will develop a relationship and even a friendship. But even at that, you need to remember her boundaries, and how you first met. Again, don't push her boundaries.

If you're going into this looking for friendship, you will probably tend to attract women who are good at manipulating men. You need to do your thinking with your "big head" and not the little one. Welcome any friendships you make, but keep your wits about you.

As I've said, I consider myself to be VERY lucky to have made the friendships I've made, and the good have far outweighed the bad.

Mark

[i'va biggen]

Friendship abounds till your money runs out.