Thoughts/advice needed (probably from the ladies)

[Cpalmson]

I think if a provider makes an unsolicited (pun not intended) call/text to a client, I think the client has every right to ask/inquire (respectfully/diplomatically) if a donation is required. I think ahobbyist2's planned response is exactly spot on.

[jfarmer]

Originally Posted by Cpalmson

I think if a provider makes an unsolicited (pun not intended) call/text to a client, I think the client has every right to ask/inquire (respectfully/diplomatically) if a donation is required. I think ahobbyist2's planned response is exactly spot on.

I agree

[Naomi4u]

My regulars call me all the time to "just chat" which is fine. If they ask would you like to grab something to eat... I am expecting to be paid for my time. If they ask "Naomi, do you want to get together today" and I am available to meet. I will agree but when I arrive I will expect to be compensated for my time. I never call or text my clients to ask if they want to hangout.. I never "fish" for business... it is tacky and desperate.

Providers do NOT have sex with their clients for free and if they do... well.. that's them Stupid on their part but If I were the guy, I'd keep going back for the free sex. LOL!

On a serious note, When you go to the doctor.. You don't ask "Is this business or pleasure?" We are professionals. If he wants free sex he should get a real relationship not an escort.

The best providers can be award winning actresses. They know how to act. Just because you didn't get the impression that she was insulted doesn't mean she wasn't. Trust me I know. I am a provider myself and network with ladies around the world .. the last thing they want you to do is ask them for free nookie or even imply such.

I have hot clients I'd do for free but will I tell them "Oh you don't have to pay me."? Hell no! "Place the donation on the
dresser just like everyone else" Sorry guys I like to keep things honest on here. A little bit of honesty goes a long way and will keep you from making a fool out of yourself.

[Guest052611]

I agree that lines should be drawn.
Im still pretty new, but when I got the call, it was preceeded with certain key phrases. Like: " not looking for a sugar daddy", "dont see you as a customer", "feel different around you", etc..
But of course, after scheduling a big (paid) visit in January, and 2 dinner-only dates in December, things got uncomfortable. She swares up and down that it hasnt, but the calls stopped all together.
I learned my lesson the hard way. Of course, now I have a hot visit available now for January, lol.

[Laurentius]

Unfortunately, this sort of ambiguous communication is fairly common; but don't take it too personally.

Providers are predominantly female, and women often communicate somewhat differently than men. Instead of saying "Go get me a wrench!" they'll say "Would you like to get me a wrench?" or even "It would be nice if I had a wrench."

To a woman saying either of the latter, as far as she is concerned she HAS told you to get her a wrench. But what the man heard was, in the first instance, a very conditional statement and in the other an expression of wishes that might optionally be met.

Many women whose livelihood depends upon communicating effectively with men learn to say "Go get me a wrench!" and many men whose livelihood depends on communicating with women learn that subjunctive and conditional statements by women shouldn't always be interpreted that way.

Either way, this sort of approach is very common among providers, even top-notch ones and highly intelligent women.

I had it happen to me recently. A lady who knows we will be attending the same event in midsummer sent me something that implicitly conveyed the premise she and I would be hanging out together during the event, and asking if I'd be able to stay late enough to keep her company that evening.

From any non-provider, that communication would have clear meaning.

But coming from a provider, it has different meaning.

Because I have some degree of familiarity with the lady, I understood what that meant. It meant hanging out during the day would be free since we'd both be there anyway, but she'd like me to pay her for an overnight. Of course, just to be on the safe side (I don't read minds), I clarified. And, sure enough, I was right.

She just doesn't like direct communication like that because it seems confrontational to her. Furthermore, if I had simply said "We can hang out during the day if you'd like but I have someplace else to be at X o'clock" that would have been a very non-hurtful rejection of her services. Because like it or not, at a certain level we are dealing with human beings and feelings CAN get hurt.

Either way, this kind of thing is very common.

You are best to assume that she has invited you to pay her for another session.

Is that appropriate?

General opinion is mixed. Personally, I have no compunction about advertising MY business services and even calling people directly -- including current customers. People have 5 million things on their minds other than me an a million other budgetary priorities. I want to be at the top of their list.

So, if it is okay for ME to call someone up and offer them a service ... it would be pretty hypocritical for me to say a provider couldn't do it.

It would, however, be nice if the communication could be a bit more direct: "You're a good customer and I enjoy your company. How would you like to come see me for X hours for Y dollars?" THIS, even my man brain, can comprehend.

Turning "Let's hang out and watch a movie and then fool around afterwards" into something that computes into bringing an envelope is a far from automatic thing in my man brain; but some ladies expect guys to make that sort of connection.

It can lead to misunderstandings.

It is safest to assume a provider is expecting payment unless explicitly stated otherwise. If she throws your envelope back at you, you'll have your answer. (And more trouble on your hands than you think.)

It is also safest to NEVER bring an envelope when dealing with a civie. If you leave her an envelope make sure no meat cleavers are nearby or you might need some very delicate head re-attachment surgery. (*chuckle*)

[Eccie Addict]

I understand your statement Naomi that providers can be award winnong actresses but let me ask you this when we ask that they make it clear when they call us then they say yes they just want us to come see them then I doubt they are insulted. If they were then I'm pretty sure they would say no. I can also tell you right now that just because I got s booty call from a provider doesn't mean I expect it every time, that's called respect There is a well known provider on here that can attest to that about me at least. Unfortunately if she did every other guy out there would want it too.

So you're saying none of you providers have civilian male friends? You're saying that the ones that do become friends with a hobbyist are stupid? Maybe I am just naive. I thought for sure that providers were human as well.

Also on the doctor statement, you'll never see a doctor call a patient soliciting work. And I also know for a fact that doctors do at times do work for free. Are they stupid for doing that? It's not always business. Sometimes you do things because you want to and it makes you happy. I've done this many times in my line of work and it makes me happy to do so. That does not make you stupid.

[Naomi4u]

Ooh Laurentius I like you!

[Naomi4u]

Originally Posted by Eccie Addict

I understand your statement Naomi that providers can be award winnong actresses but let me ask you this when we ask that they make it clear when they call us then they say yes they just want us to come see them then I doubt they are insulted. If they were then I'm pretty sure they would say no. I can also tell you right now that just because I got s booty call from a provider doesn't mean I expect it every time, that's called respect There is a well known provider on here that can attest to that about me at least. Unfortunately if she did every other guy out there would want it too.

Honey I can't speak for other ladies but for me this is a business. I don't give free services and I question ladies that do. This is not social services/The food stamp office/All you can eat (no pun intended)!

If she says she just wants you to come and see her.. then of course go and see her! If I were a hobbyist and a provider wanted to see me and didn't expect anything in return I'd go too!!!! However If I were in the mood and I REALLY wanted to see her I would bring some cash just in case. That would be the smart way to go. Just don't go there hoping she'd give it up for free. Save yourself the embarrassment. Just because it happened with one.. doesn't mean it happens with all.

So you're saying none of you providers have civilian male friends? You're saying that the ones that do become friends with a hobbyist are stupid? Maybe I am just naive. I thought for sure that providers were human as well.

I have a regular that calls me all the time. This regular has access to my PERSONAL facebook account. He texts me all the time .. we are really close friends. If this guy stopped paying me I would STILL be his friend. I would go above and beyond for this guy because he's just that great. He invites me to his house alllll the time but still pays me for my being there. I have another regular that does this.

Fact of the matter is, These men respect my time. They did not meet me on match.com, eharmony.com... they know i have a life. I do not mix my personal life and my business life. If I really like you YOU will know I like you I treat all my friends the same way but business is business.

You don't go to your doctor saying "you're too businesslike", "You're just in it for the money" because DUHHH that is their busines! That is how they make their living. Every provider deserves this respect. If the lady REALLY likes you and decided to befriend you she should never bring up money.

Also on the doctor statement, you'll never see a doctor call a patient soliciting work. And I also know for a fact that doctors do at times do work for free. Are they stupid for doing that? It's not always business. Sometimes you do things because you want to and it makes you happy. I've done this many times in my line of work and it makes mr happy to do so. That does not make you stupid.

My dear I said I personally don't fish for clients. It is tacky and an act of desperation. That is the way I look at it.

You need to get the whole free thing out of your head my love.. most ladies her expect to be paid for their time. So your argument that some doctors work for free wouldn't stand a chance.

I have an SO and most ladies with SO's will tell you that it is just business. I hate to kill the hard-on but this is just truth. I understand some people would like to live in their little fantasy land.

[guest042011]

Nothing is FREE! EVER! Don't ask, you'll insult her or ruin the relationship altogether.

It DOES NOT happen!

Now..........if it does.............you are the most unique individual in the hobby I've ever heard of.

tra

[Guest011914-1]

I agree completely..if she contacted you out of the blue and wants to play just be direct and ask her if this is a playdate or worling date. Directness is always the best way. You can be polite but direct.

Originally Posted by Eccie Addict

So a provider never calls someone for a booty call? Is it not insulting to call a hobbyist asking him if he wants to see her (which by the way our answer is always gonna be yes) only for him to find out she is calling him to make some money. Should we always treat a provider as if it is business only cause I happen to know for a fact that it isn't always business when a provider calls me.

Just my thoughts on the subject. I've had providers call me for pleasure and business. I've never gotten the impression that they felt insulted when I asked for them to be clear. I don't think she would be very happy if I came over and after we had our fun she found out o didn't have what she really wanted. I do agree with the guys that it's all in how you ask.

[hotlips_houlihan]

Originally Posted by Naomi4u

I don't give free services and I question ladies that do.

Why would you question what another lady does? Perhaps she would prefer to spend a booty call with somebody she is familiar with, has a connection with, and knows she won't have any problems with? I'm sure sometimes it's easier than dealing with an ex. He's an "ex" for a reason. Why complicate things with him by giving him some nookie? Why jump through hoops and pick some guy up somewhere? "I" personally don't call clients for booty calls either. But if another lady does it, I don't question her reasoning. Frankly, it's none of my business. But some ladies actually get horny too, and don't have an SO to fulfill her needs. So what's the problem?

Originally Posted by Naomi4u

My dear I said I personally don't fish for clients. It is tacky and an act of desperation. That is the way I look at it.

Tacky and desperate? So when WalMart/Target/Walgreens/Best Buy sends out weekly mailers, you think that's tacky and desperate as well? Granted, it's a different type of business, but the same philosophy. It's called marketing.

I can't speak for all ladies, only myself. So here is my take on it. Tacky and desperate are all of the "look at me threADs" some of these ladies post. If I contact a gent I have previously seen, it's because I liked him. I had a good time. I wouldn't mind having another good time. It's not tacky or desperate and "most" men feel honored that I remembered them, our time together and are flattered that I want a repeat.

This is a business. But a business unlike any other. You have to befriend every client to a certain degree, or you will never get through the appointment, let alone a repeat one.

But to answer the OPs question.....there is nothing wrong with clarifying what her desires are-in a respectful manner, of course. But chances are, she is looking for compensation.

Meg

[Valerie]

Nothing in this world's for free love...

[charlestudor2005]

What do you thing the answer it going to be on a whore board???? Of course, everyone is going to say she wants a donation. The providers here couldn't imagine otherwise and the hobbyists don't believe it ever happens.

I suggest you return a text that says, "I don't have the money now," and see how she responds.

[China Doll]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

What do you thing the answer it going to be on a whore board???? Of course, everyone is going to say she wants a donation. The providers here couldn't imagine otherwise and the hobbyists don't believe it ever happens.

I suggest you return a text that says, "I don't have the money now," and see how she responds.

The SECOND part of your post contains something worth reading. The first part leaves something to be desired. I guess I should know to expect that kind of language from you by now, Charles. I guess a little piece of me is always hoping that you'll change back to the old self who was more respectful to the ladies. Optimism to the point of foolishness, I think.

I should probably clarify something. Technically I do believe it is ok for the gentleman to make a clarification if he feels he needs to. However, I would advise you all to only consider deeming this necessary in the circumstance in which she asks you for a rendezvous. This may seem obvious, but I have had my fair share of free appointment requests, and such requests cannot be made without insulting me. Perhaps surprisingly, I am not as insulted by the blow to the value of my time as I am insulted by the implication that my life is so carefree that I have the extra time to place a value on! In any case, every lady is different, and there are a million and one ways in which insult can be perceived from a few simple words.

I also need to clarify that so far, Charles' response really is the best one. You're not insulting her by assuming things, and you're giving her the opportunity to give you a deal and/or give you a freebie. Just don't hold your breath for the latter!

[LAVixian]

I believe she expects a donation... however, I think it's unprofessional of her to contact YOU for an appointment... if I contact someone first, I will not expect them to pay me.. too personal in my opinion.