Socials - Why don't you come?

[LadiesFan]

I would like to attend a social just to put faces to names.... but I am single with no children, and none of my family are here in Texas.

LF

[Reincarnated]

John_TX, How can LE raid a social at a restaurant when all we are doing is eating dinner? How would they know who is on the board and there vs. just someone there with their family eating dinner?

Why would LE know about a private event at a private venue that is a private club and registered with the state that way?

I don't think you have ever been to a social John, nor understand what goes on there. I have been to over 50 socials in Austin and SA and Houston and never heard of one being "raided" because there is nothing wrong with having drinks, lunch or dinner and talking, which is all that goes on at the socials.

[John_TX]

Originally Posted by Reincarnated

John_TX, How can LE raid a social at a restaurant when all we are doing is eating dinner? How would they know who is on the board and there vs. just someone there with their family eating dinner?

Why would LE know about a private event at a private venue that is a private club and registered with the state that way?

I don't think you have ever been to a social John, nor understand what goes on there. I have been to over 50 socials in Austin and SA and Houston and never heard of one being "raided" because there is nothing wrong with having drinks, lunch or dinner and talking, which is all that goes on at the socials.

i have been to socials, but not an ASPD/ECCIE sanctioned social so to speak. i went to ones hosted at the Escapes venues in Houston, if you remember "Amazing John" before he got busted by the feds. he had a party room in the back of the Escapes on Westheimer at Beltway 8 next door to the 24 hour fitness (Escape 5 i think).

while i was not personally at the social i understand CK1942 was arrested at a social. if not at the social, it had to do with the social, either before or after the fact. you'd have to ask him.

the question you have to ask is not how can LE do a raid. the question is will LE do a raid. people know that LE can do the raid and detain, ID, and maybe even perform a chicken-shit arrest on someone, and/or run people for warrants. they can drag people away in handcuffs to jail or simply run everyone off. they can get names and faces. if your social is at a public venue, i.e. a strip club, restaurant, or anywhere else where the general public is invited, and God-forbid a TABC licensed establishment, the police can enter without a warrant and perform a premise check. even at a private club, LE can simply wait outside and stop cars as they leave for suspected "traffic" violations and get your real ID. then they can get a database of all persons who attended the social.

LE doesn't care if the charges stick or not. that is the responsibility of the local DA. remember we are coming up on elections in the next 2 years for Sheriff, Prosecutor's offices, etc. people want to look tough on crime. this kind of raid will make the papers and news. LE can make the arrest and get good press. months later when the DA declines to file, after you've spent money on an attorney, it won't make the news.

LE can perform a raid and not arrest anyone if they do not feel like it. you are confusing the two. also a few years back, the Sheriff's or Constable's in Harris County raided the St. James strip club on a weekend night with from what i hear about 100 cops. they detained everyone and ran everyone's ID and anyone with warrants went to jail. they arrested some girls and guys for performing lewd acts in the private rooms. people were arrested, and those that were just there legitimately watching the show and doing nothing illegal were detained and had their ID's run and names written down. what are you going to do, refuse to identify yourself? that's a sure way to end up in jail.

don't think for a minute that LE is not reading this board and that they are so stupid that they have no idea when or where a social is going on. for all you know, board members on here are undercover LE agents that neither you or i know anything about.

[ck1942]

Old News. (And not a secret, either.)

John is obviously referring to the event in Houston which, in December 2009, got compromised by the venue owners. Some politico ordered vice to bust us. (Extraneous note: those who may recall events at the time will recall a Mayoral election underway; after the results of the election, the chief of police resigned.)

Vice told the licensed "after hours'" venue that their liquor license would be compromised by LE if they didn't let LEOs in undercover to see what was going on. We had used the venue way too often, and thus the venue was vulnerable. Since the venue was collecting all of the door fee, their door folks had our list and the hosts were inside enjoying. I don't know how long any of the several LEOs were inside, but the results of their investigation are clear enough to me.

At approx. 8:20 pm I was walking a lady out to her car when three people appeared at the door who I did not know. They gave false handles and I told the door guy not to let them in. We were due to end the event at 9 pm.

About 20 minutes later the bulk of the 25 vice came in, masked!, told the roughly 130 people inside to move in certain directions and separated 15 people and gave each a clip board with a form to fill out. Of the 15, 12 were taken downtown. 2 were agency girls here illegally and they were deported. Of the remainder, to my personal knowledge, one has pleaded out (deferred adjudication) and ALL of the rest of the cases have been dismissed.

Except for those above, no other guest, and NONE of the organizers were questioned, had the ID taken nor photographed nor anything else by LE.

So much for John's "facts" and statements.

We organizers were obviously lax in not manning the door. We learned something very important from that. Not soon enough, obviously, but adjustments have been made for for future events in Houston and elsewhere.

Lots of rumors out there about the Houston bust, but the above is 100 percent factual to the best of my knowledge and I have reviewed each of the arrest reports and also followed up on them as well.

We have since then, had several gatherings in Houston, more than 15 in San Antonio, a half-dozen in Austin (there will be another Austin event in November), and I have attended more close to 10 events sponsored by others in Houston, Corpus and elsewhere. With nary an issue, because those who attend closely follow the rules.

Obviously few of the 65 guests at the ninth annual SA Hollow Weenie Masquerade last night accepted whatever the risk as minimal.

Venues are chosen for a variety of needs, privacy, size, food and drink. There's a mix of very private and very public places. Some years ago we even had a event on The River Walk, which included a whipped cream "pie eating" competition. We were in a rather raucous, but very public, establishment.

Those who understand the elements involved in attending any event and who do attend obviously understand both the risk and the reward. And accept both as such.

Those who want to avoid any events are free to do so. We have never twisted anyone's arms to attend or not.

= = = = = =

As for blanket statements that LE can pretty much do whatever they want to do, there is a small element of truth in that. But LE ain't stoopid. They don't waste precious resources trying to gather intel or make arrests when at the end of the day those activities pay off with zero or close to zero results.

I have always, starting in 2002, assumed that any social could be compromised by LE and, as well, that in SA, at least, LE always could know where and when an event would be held.

To my personal knowledge, LE has been visibly present at only one venue in all of that time, and that was when we had the manager call them to remove some drunk (not one of ours) hanging around the front door.

LE tends to follow the book. The LEOs who swept into the Houston venue pretty much did not want to be there. They were firm, but very respectful, they had their intended several targets, and they told the rest of us to please leave the establishment while they did their business and that we could return if we wanted to. As if any of would want to.

But the organizers went back in after LEOs left, collected the $400 in cash and 70+ toys (the event was Christmas fund-raiser for toys for kids, including the cash) and later delivered that to a shelter that was very grateful.

= = = = = =

As for ck

"one of those admins who was very much accused of deleting negative reviews of providers in exchange for free services. i distinctly remember CK running an online protection racket where many girls were protected from negative reviews by him."

pure bullshit! If you have any personal knowledge of such activity, post the names and dates, etc.

All moderators are targets for such "I heard" crap, and making any blanket statement demeans the entire community.

Busty Girl never condoned any such activity and those who were accused were investigated and if found guilty of such activity were removed from staff.

[nuglet]

Originally Posted by Reincarnated

John_TX, How can LE raid a social at a restaurant when all we are doing is eating dinner? How would they know who is on the board and there vs. just someone there with their family eating dinner?

It's easy when there is a printed guest list. and they don't really need "PROMISSION" to investigate gatherings that are constantly organized by the same person, with the same agenda. I doubt the "FAMILIES' were there just having dinner at a "non ASPD" PARTY... YEAH, RIGHT, NON aspd.. pffst.

Why would LE know about a private event at a private venue that is a private club and registered with the state that way?

duh, private venues don't register with the State, much less their events.
And you ask "how would they know..... Well bragging has a downside if you want it to be "private"

Because when CK had these events (still has) the security was as good as swiss cheese. Everybody that is curious, (like LE that reads his posts) can find all they need to know.
His discretion and methods were/are extremely weak, thus the big bust in Houston.
He quickly tried to "excuse" himself as the weak link, but most know better. Socials can be held safely, but it requires experience, GOOD common sense and discretion instead of braggadocio. Not a strong suit in that case. He walked away clean, with plenty of finger pointing at others, but there were several people that regret their decision to take it for granted the event(s) were held by someone that held safety as a criterion.
But as he ages, hopefully that risk will diminish. He still has a cadre of sycophants, but you notice fewer and fewer are willing to put their civie reps on the line.

[nuglet]

Originally Posted by ck1942

Old News.

John is obviously referring to the event in Houston which, in December 2009, got compromised by the venue owners. BS, typical to blame anyone but yourself. Some politico ordered vice to bust us. Oh yeah, you were such a BIG DEAL they were after poor little you. (Extraneous note: those who may recall events at the time will recall a Mayoral election underway; after the results of the election, the chief of police resigned.)

Vice told the licensed "after hours'" venue that their liquor license would be compromise if they didn't let LEOs in undercover to see what was going on. NONSENSE!!! We had used the venue way too often, There's your problem... TOOO OFTEN and thus the venue was vulnerable. VULNERABLE DUE TO YOUR LACK OF DISCRETION. Since the venue was collecting all of the door fee, their door folks had our list AND YOU WONDER HOW IT WAS COMPROMISED.. GEEZE. and the hosts were inside enjoying. INSTEAD OF TAKING CARE OF BUSINESS AND REPS. THAT'S HOW YOU SHIFTED THE BLAME INSTEAD OF TAKING IN ON THE CHIN LIKE THE INSTIGATOR YOU WERE.

At approx. 8:20 pm I was walking out a lady to her car when three people appeared at the door who I did not know. They gave false handles and I told the door guy not to let them in. We were due to end the event at 9 pm. As the organizer, that was YOUR JOB. But you ducked an ran.. typical

About 20 minutes later the bulk of the 25 vice came in, masked!, told the roughly 130 people inside to move in certain directions and separated 15 people and gave each a clip board with a form to fill out. Of the 15, 12 were taken downtown. 2 were agency girls here illegally and they were deported. Of the remainder, to my personal knowledge, one has pleaded out (deferred adjudication) and ALL of the rest of the cases have been dismissed.

We organizers were obviously lax in not being at the door. GEE! YA THINK? We learned something very important from that. Not soon enough, obviously, but adjustments have been made for for future events in Houston and elsewhere.

Lots of rumors out there about the Houston bust, but the above is 100 percent factual to the best of my knowledge TO BE BEST OF YOUR KNOWLEDGE... THAT EXPLAINS A LOT and I have reviewed each of the arrest reports and also followed up on them as well. OH Did you? exactly HOW did you follow up? read the papers? pffst!

We have since then, had several gatherings in Houston, more than 15 in San Antonio, and I have attended more close to 10 events sponsored by others in Houston, Corpus and elsewhere. With nary an issue, because those who attend closely follow the rules.
YOU Know it's just a matter of time before you sacrifice folks again. and when it happens, I bet you manage to "skate by".

Obviously few of the 65 guests at the ninth annual SA Hollow Weenie Masquerade last night accepted whatever the risk as minimal. Which is a CS way of passing the buck... "they accepted the risk.... so it's NO YOUR FAULT" pathetic.

Venues are chosen for a variety of needs, privacy, size, food and drink. There's a mix of very private and very public places. Some years ago we even had a event on The River Walk, which included a whipped cream "pie eating" competition. We were in a rather raucous, but very public, establishment.

Those who understand the elements involved in attending any event and who do attend obviously understand both the risk and the reward. And accept both as such. So inviting trouble ISN'T "your" problem is it.?

Those who want to avoid any events are free to do so. We have never twisted anyone's arms to attend or not. Really nice scape goat excuse. "It's not MY fault" I didn't get caught.. how very very convenient.

= = = = = =

As for

"one of those admins who was very much accused of deleting negative reviews of providers in exchange for free services. i distinctly remember CK running an online protection racket where many girls were protected from negative reviews by him."

pure bullshit! If you have any personal knowledge of such activity, post the names and dates, etc. I have some direct info, but will not pass it on due to the fact it would require outing your "PET" girls.

All moderators are targets for such "I heard" crap, and making any blanket statement demeans the entire community.

Busty Girl never condoned any such activity and those who were accused were investigated and if found guilty of such activity were removed from staff.

Well, partially true.. They were removed when ASPD shut down. Hmmm.. who was the main admin to get shelved... hmm CK1942 comes to mind, then the complete demise of a good forum.. Congrats for such a job well done there buddy.

[ck1942]

Nuglet, thanks for your comments; interesting that you have a private stock of facts at your command but that you choose not to share them. Interesting, too, that your knowledge of security is so absolute.

As for me being fired at aspd, well, after Amber died, it was reported that her wish was that DB run the place and we are told that her wish was that I be an ordinary member. Which is what happened. Her board, her rules. I spoke with her the Friday prior to her death and she didn't voice any complaints about my involvement in the board as moderator since 2001.

As for my later banning after that, well, the family obviously had some sort of issue with me (which, btw, I have never been told in person, nor by proxy. So much for common courtesy).

Since the demise of ASPD, ck1942's involvement with the greater community has been expanded, not diminished. If ck1942 is not present on a board, no great loss from my personal pov.

Folks reading all of these posts can make up their own mind on who ck1942 is and what his ethics might be, be that based on meeting ck1942 in person at an event, at an informal lunch or, for the fewer, in person bcd.

Or even from hearing about ck1942 from those who might know him in person, or from those who say they know him in person.

Anyone who wants to ask me anything may do so via PM or email.

My hobbying has pretty much been an open book since 2001.

I need make no apologies nor any excuses for my hobbying, or for my support for the hobbying community.

[nuglet]

Originally Posted by ck1942

Nuglet, thanks for your comments; interesting that you have a private stock of facts at your command but that you choose not to share them. Interesting, too, that your knowledge of security is so absolute. UNLIKE YOU, I WILL NOT RISK REPUTATIONS, AND I DON'T CARRY TALES. I KNOW YOU WOULD SHARE THEM TO SAVE YOUR REAR, YOU KNOW THE FACTS I HAVE.
YOU RENTED MY VENUE AND CAUSED A GREAT DEAL OF PROBLEMS AMONG MANY OF THE ATTENDEES.
YOU WERE TOLD TO LEAVE DUE TO YOUR COMPLETE LACK OF SIMPLE COMMON SENSE.
I HIGHLY RESENTED YOUR LACK OF RESPECT FOR EVERYONE'S SAFETY INCLUDING MINE AND MY FAMILY AND MY VENUE. WHY DO YOU THINK YOU WERE NEVER INVITED BACK? COINCIDENCE? NO!! YOU WERE, AND CONTINUE TO BE A THREAT TO SAFETY FOR THESE FOLKS.

As for me being fired at aspd, well, ( okay, "excuse inserted here") after Amber died, it was reported that her wish was that DB run the place and we are told that her wish was that I be an ordinary member. Which is what happened. Her board, her rules. I spoke with her the Friday prior to her death Great!!! YOUR version of testimony from a deceased person.... and she didn't voice any complaints about my involvement in the board as moderator since 2001.
WELL STATED AND FINALLY HONEST! "HER WISH WAS THAT YOU BE AN ORDINARY MEMBER.... AS IN NOT RUNNING ANYTHING!!!

As for my later banning after that, well, the family obviously had some sort of issue with me, GEE, I WONDER WHAT THAT COULD BE,??(which, btw, I have never been told in person, nor by proxy. HOW COULD YOU BE IN DOUBT? (So much for common courtesy.) shame shame on the her for not getting a referral for you from a dying person!! geeze!!!!You're right, HOW INCONSIDERATE OF HER? THINKING ABOUT HER OWN IMPENDING DEMISE, she should have been more courteous!!

ck1942's involvement with the greater community has been expanded, not diminished. OH YEAH, WE KNOW HOW WONDERFUL YOU ARE AND WHAT A CONSUMATE PLANNER... If ck1942 is not present on a board, no great loss from my personal pov.

Folks reading all of these posts can make up their own mind on who ck1942 is and what his ethics might be, be that based on meeting ck1942 in person at an event, at an informal lunch or, for the fewer, in person bcd. THANKS FOR YOUR PERMISSION TO MAKE UP OUT OWN MINDS. MIGHTY GENEROUS OF YOU SIR. I THINK GETTING INTO ETHICS WITH YOU IS LIKE WRESTLING WITH PIGS.. YOU BOTH GET DIRTY AND IT PISSES OFF THE PIG.

I need make no apologies nor any excuses for my hobbying, or for my support for the hobbying community.

YOU'RE CORRECT, YOU NEED NO EXCUSES FOR "YOUR HOBBYING OR SUPPORT, THE APOLOGIES WOULD BE NICE FOR THE DAMAGE YOU'VE DONE TO : BOARDS, INDIVIDUALS, REPUTATIONS, AND WRECKS YOU'VE LEFT STREWN ALONG THE ROADSIDE.

[nuglet]

[quote CK1942=John is obviously referring to the event in Houston which, in December 2009, got compromised by the venue owners. Some politico ordered vice to bust us. ( oh yeah, you were SOOOO high profile and important, they just HAD to nail you.... oops, I mean your party... some how,, NOT YOU!!! How convenient. (Extraneous note: those who may recall events at the time will recall a Mayoral election underway; after the results of the election, the chief of police resigned.)/quote]

I ran a Swingers club in Austin through 3 elections, Police, Mayor, etc etc and yet somehow, WE NEVER HAD A PROBLEM. That's because I was concerned about OUR GUESTS safety and didn't "BEND" the rules for MY BENEFIT. SAD SAD ATTEMPT CK AT SLIPPING THE BLAME ONCE AGAIN.!!!

[Reincarnated]

Nuglet, your out of line and that party was not put on by CK. If you have ever seen CK's list, there are no names. You should know what happened in Houston and the huge effort to shut down the many places there.

Moderators I suggest you shut this post down if those can not play nicely...
I hobby because I like the people, and CK is one of those who has always been there to support me when I needed it and he has always been above reproach in his dealing with me and everyone else I know. Im sure most of the board would agree.

Thank you CK.

[Reincarnated]

PS. Nuglet, loved your place off of N. Lamar...

[Spacemtn]

The title of this thread is "Socials, why don't you come?", not who does a good or bad job hosting or who was banned from where for why.

I appreciate everyones comments and their efforts to keep fellow members safe, but that is not the topic here. It is simply "Why don't YOU come?" If you want to discuss other things, start your own thread. Let's get back to the topic.

Spacemtn
AustinModStaff

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by ck1942

As for my later banning after that, well, the family obviously had some sort of issue with me (which, btw, I have never been told in person, nor by proxy. So much for common courtesy).

You did provide a service for a number of years and should have been given a direct and honest assessment of why they were replacing you. personally I've always simply assumed that the direction you took the boards was simply too far opposite of the perceived direction the family wanted to go in the future to be adaptable.

I do believe however that there came a time, years earlier, when your leadership and guidance began to put far too many members in jeapordy from outings, threats, attacks on the board and the reposting of all BCD/LockerRoom Info by former members with a huge grudge to bear. At that point, for the good of the community as a whole, I believed you should hhave stepped aside....

Since the demise of ASPD, ck1942's involvement with the greater community has been expanded, not diminished. If ck1942 is not present on a board, no great loss from my personal pov.

Folks reading all of these posts can make up their own mind on who ck1942 is and what his ethics might be, be that based on meeting ck1942 in person at an event, at an informal lunch or, for the fewer, in person bcd.

I've known CK for many a year.... From before his involvement as a Mod and Administrator as well as Social Host....

I've shared many a meal as well as drink with him and partied at many of the same parties. We were a few of the handful that attended the first SA Socials.

But this world of ours, if not kept in focus, can easily tarnish the best of us and I truly believe and have said it many a time over that I thought CK had simply lost his way. He has been TOO involved for TOO long and is TOO close to TOO many of the ladies he caters to.

That the benefits and attention that come from the women as a result of the things he could do simply overwhelmed him to the point of changing his focus. I experience a similar amount of attention in the GC Community from managers, waitstaff and Strippers....

Would I go to a Social sponsored by CK tomorrow if invited?

Yes I would. Early, before too much alcohol has flowed and certain personalities get amplified... I primarily go to meet other guys I want to know and occasionally stumble across a lady I want to see as a result...

Would I bring a female guest or two as I have many times in the past?

Yes I would.

Because I know how to keep myself safe and can accept responsibility for my own actions. As everyone should and that is a main thrust of what CK "SAYS"... although from personal experience, what is "SAID" does not always lend itself to what is actually supported and encouraged". In all honesty many of them get way too out of hand for my tastes....

Do I disagree with how he runs his events or determines who is a valid member deserving of an invite?

Yes I do.

The Socials he runs are not "Community Oriented". They are heavily slanted to promote Indies and a few Agency gals. He allows ladies that attend to determine whether or not a prospective male member is active enough to deserve an invite. There is a large and ever growing section of the "community" that are not a part of what he puts together. There is nothing WRONG with that other than to state they are community oriented.

I fell of the Invite list as a result of my unwillingness to provide CURRENT references from "established" providers. I also believe it irked a number of ladies that I brought young pretty strippers to introduce to the guys that got a lot of attention. Everyone I DID bring however was a player known to others and cleared by CK....

over the years CK has turned me onto ladies as well as shared ladies I have turned him on to. I would have not issues making an introduction to him tomorrow....

Since I abhor and stand against screening to do so would be highly hypocritical of me. I am a lot of things to a lot of people but rarely accused of being a Hypocrite.

And in all honesty, After hundreds and hundreds of reviews as well personal introductions to hundreds of members of ladies that play and countless number of male as well as female members that know I am legitimate, my ego gets in the way. I quit "proving" myself to anyone many years ago.

I believe the system as run does cost ladies prospective business.... had I not met Maddie at a Luncheon I would never have seen her for example based solely on her reviews nor would she have probably responded to a PM from me about getting together based on my posting style.

Anyway....

I agree with Nuglet that more could have been done to keep what happened in Houston from occurring and that none of this would be an issue if early in the process there had been a simple... "I fucked up" and none of the rest of the spin..

But the bottom line is that CK DOES continue to put on popular events and for a lot of guys and gals there is a value there.....

Until someone else is willing to step up it's not like you have options....

And as one that stages similar events... None of you remotely know or understand the work that goes into one of these...

Or even from hearing about ck1942 from those who might know him in person, or from those who say they know him in person.

Anyone who wants to ask me anything may do so via PM or email.

My hobbying has pretty much been an open book since 2001.

I need make no apologies nor any excuses for my hobbying, or for my support for the hobbying community.

That is just my personal opinion.

We all know what that is worth right?

Originally Posted by Reincarnated

Moderators I suggest you shut this post down if those can not play nicely...

This can be a rather passionate and emotional topic for some but there is nothing here that borders on people not playing nicely....

[Sir Hardin Thicke]

Question is "why don't I come to socials," and the short answer is I've never been invited. However, considering my stature in this community I may have to go incognito with a beard and glasses.

[nuglet]

Sir Hardin'
When (not if) there is a social, I'll be sure you are invited. Manners mean everything..