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guest081712 · 04-18-2010, 09:09 AM

i agree with you 100% foreverman!
I have been in this "hobby" for at least 15 years in some form or other
ie. (Phone chat lines, massage parlors, agencies, to the modern day online of e.com,eccie.net, backpage,craigslist,) and it most defintely is an addiction. It has affected me personally both good and bad financially,emotionally, and in everyday life.
BTW this is a great post and very interesting to read the insights you
gentlemen have.

NormalBob · 04-18-2010, 09:18 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by FOREVERMAN

I agree that this is an evolution from magazines-to-present day activities.

The hobby is no different in my opinion. I look for a way to enter into a fantasy for a length of time to escape the pressure of every day life.

Therefore, it is my opinion that this is an addiction no different than any other.

I'm with you on so much of this post.

I don't want you to think I'm disagreeing about the wide applicability of your personal observations.

I would nuance the final sentence to broaden the pool of those it applies to though.

The Hobby is different from other addictions because it starts with a very real human need. Smoking does not. Drugs do not.

In a way, this can make the hobby more insidious to some because the bright red line between healthy and unhealthy behavior is much more difficult to perceive.

I also think that means the "zero-tolerance" option for smoking and drugs don't apply well as a result.

I'm convinced that to some extent, hobbying has been healthy for me and I concede that my addiction level pace may not be healthy.

While I see the impact on my savings, I don't see any psychological damage. What I do see psychologically is that I'm better than I was in September.

Quote:

But I think the primary question is - if society is puritanical and prude, and we are all members of society, what quality about our personalities allow us to buck the conventional values? We're not amoral. I don't think any of us would go out and murder people or drown puppies for fun. I guess I'm just curious what it is that makes us different.

As a freedom loving person, it comes naturally to me that my thoughts and acts do not need to be consistent with the broader society.

My hobby relationships occur at a consenting adult level. It offends me to think that anyone outside that bedroom believes their opinion should have any influence on our actions (of course my bride is an exception given her vested interests in my relationships).

Hobbying is the exact opposite of murdering someone because the latter is the active denial of another person's freedom while hobbying can potentially be seen as a celebration of responsibly executed freedom.

Plus, puppies are love. That's a lot closer to the hobby experience then murder.

guest081712 · 04-18-2010, 09:39 AM

Actually you can be addicted to many different things...
it's not really what is being done,used,etc.
You can be addicted to sex,shopping,drinking,drugs,ga mbling,the internet,
etc,etc. What Tiger and David Duchovny, to mention a few is very real.
(Although I don't know if Tiger would have gone to therapy if he
wasn't married!). I actually went to several sessions for sexual addiction
several years ago and did a lot of reading and learning about it.
It has not stopped me from continuing these activities and is a conscious
effort to do so. Whenever I tell myself that I would like to stop or "retire"
I find myself thinking(psychological) and acting (meeting or "dates) on these and continue to do so.
I just love meeting and being with beautiful women!

NormalBob · 04-18-2010, 09:45 AM

I went to SA about 15 years ago.

It taught me enough to know that it can be an addiction but the point I'm making is that it is different from many other types of addictions. You are making the point that it is similar to some types of addictions.

I agree with you.

I also have come to realize that what I was experiencing was not an addiction as much as it was dysfunctional behavior brought about by the denial of what I legitimately needed and deserved.

If you take a good person and put them into a situation of harsh scarcity, most will adapt and behave differently in response.

summerwaves · 04-18-2010, 12:51 PM

This lifestyle is no different than swinging or meeting someone out and going for a roll in the hay afterwards. Single people do. Married people do it. Drunk people do it! Sad people do it. Mad people do it. Horny people do it. Lonely people do it. Stressed out people do it. Every walk of life and profession does it. People that say the "don't do it", do it (and usually "do it" the most and after a few drinks to use as an excuse for "doing it")! I think this avenue simply makes "doing it" easier and more convenient, and without really having to say the obvious, it helps out a lot of people in need and who are struggling to get by.

rooster · 04-18-2010, 01:33 PM

I really cringe when I see the term "addiction" used in these discussions. It is often used too broadly and too casually.

Even among Mental Health professionals, there is a LOT of disagreement about whether there is such a thing as true "sexual addiction." Many of them do not really think that there is.

I've spent a bit of time on a Therapist's couch, and by PURE coincidence, he happened to be a very prominent and experienced Certified Sexual Therapist also. It was not why I was seeing him, but I certainly took the opportunity to discuss some of my related concerns about myself with him. His belief, which is common in the field, is that while there is certainly lots of "sexually compulsive and obsessive behavior", it is not true addiction.

My own belief, which has come from MUCH introspection after having the above discussions, is that it is human nature to continually desire stimulation and escape. My two ways of accomplishing this for most of my life have been through Music and Intimate Experiences (both real and imagined). Sex is my "drug of choice", and I will go to a lot of effort to get it. At times, even compulsively or obsessively. But I do not think I am addicted.

And I don't think any of you are either. You may be "addicted", in a very loose sense, to stimulation, and sex may be your preferred stimulant, but it is unlikely that it is seriously damaging your life the way true addictions like alcohol and drugs can. But be on guard for the temptations to cross over the line occasionally into harmful obsession or compulsion. Moderation in all things. Yeah... right.

jackfengshui · 04-18-2010, 01:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by rooster69

I really cringe when I see the term "addiction" used in these discussions.

I concur. I am as much "addicted" to hobbying as I am to my family, my work, good food, travels, etc. In other words, it is now an integral part of my life. It is important for me emotionally, but it does not dominate my everyday living or devastate me financially.

guest081712 · 04-18-2010, 07:59 PM

Thank you NB for your last post.
The knowledge and quote has hit home for me and taken to heart.

conner11 · 04-18-2010, 09:16 PM

What a great thread. If I ever had a great reason to retire from the hobby, it'd be this -- I really don't want to be associated with the "fools" here that are trying to justify hobbying as an "ok" thing to do.

Foreverman seems to be the only one brave enough to say that it's an addiction. I'm with him. Time to get out.

Later everyone.

jackfengshui · 04-18-2010, 09:20 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by conner11

I really don't want to be associated with the "fools" here that are trying to justify hobbying as an "ok" thing to do.

Please keep the discussions on a civil level and refrain from using insults.

summerwaves · 04-19-2010, 07:41 AM

That was cruel, Conner11. What makes you better or more intelligent than anyone else? I do not say this with sarcasm. I really want to know why you separate yourself from the others here. Do you think they are in denial but you are not?

Everyone has their reason for being here. Not everyone is the same. Not everyone has an addiction. Not everyone is married. Not everyone thinks hobbying is wrong and is trying to justify their behavior. It's the right thing to do for many. Not everyone has someone to turn to or talk with other than those who come here.

So, why is hobbying not OK? Is it OK for some but not others? Is it morally wrong for everyone? Are casual hook-ups OK? Is there any difference between casual hook-ups/swinging/ and hobbying? Is the hobbiest a different person than the swinger or guy who picks up a drunk (or sober) woman in a bar for a one night stand?

cnym · 04-19-2010, 08:01 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summerwaves

That was cruel, Conner11. What makes you better or more intelligent than anyone else? I do not say this with sarcasm. I really want to know why you separate yourself from the others here. Do you think they are in denial but you are not?

Everyone has their reason for being here. Not everyone is the same. Not everyone has an addiction. Not everyone is married. Not everyone thinks hobbying is wrong and is trying to justify their behavior. It's the right thing to do for many. Not everyone has someone to turn to or talk with other than those who come here.

So, why is hobbying not OK? Is it OK for some but not others? Is it morally wrong for everyone? Are casual hook-ups OK? Is there any difference between casual hook-ups/swinging/ and hobbying? Is the hobbiest a different person than the swinger or guy who picks up a drunk (or sober) woman in a bar for a one night stand?

Summer, I salute you

offshoredrilling · 04-19-2010, 09:31 AM

och

mmmmm glad I backed out of what I was going to say

not

rooster · 04-19-2010, 01:28 PM

My sincere thanks to Summerwaves for replying before I got a chance to see Conner's post. It will keep me from saying anything overly rude in response to him.

Conner, I ask only one thing: please make good on your promise/threat to leave hobbying. If your beliefs about this are truly as strong as you state in your post, it will certainly be of benefit to you. But don't assume that your issues apply to everyone else. And name-calling has no place here.

As you said in closing: LATER! Hopefully.... much.

NormalBob · 04-19-2010, 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by summerwaves

Is there any difference between casual hook-ups/swinging/ and hobbying? Is the hobbiest a different person than the swinger or guy who picks up a drunk (or sober) woman in a bar for a one night stand?

In my case, this hobbiest isn't as good-lookin' as the guy who can get strange at a bar.

Either that or those guys have a later bed time then I do.