Waterloo!

[Longermonger]

Minority party suffers crushing loss.

[john_galt]

What is so amazing about the MINORITY party suffering a loss? What is amazing is that the opposition was bi-partisan which can't be said about the marxists who twisted arms, blackmailed, and bribed to get a win. I mean if this bill was so good (think about this) if this bill was so good then why couldn't it win without the sleazy tactics? Don't tell me politics. There a good many republicans (McCain, Snowe, Collins to name a few) who like to vote for liberal democratic programs. If even they didn't vote for this then maybe there is something wrong with it. You know like being fined for not buying healthcare or your employer being fined for you deciding not to buy health insurance. Little things like that. Half the people in the US do not like abortion and half support it. The democratic majority of about 240 only has 12 who are pro-life? Only 5% of the democrats are pro-life! How can they say they represent the people!!! I'm not saying that half of the republicans are pro-choice but it is about 30% by their votes. You may laugh now but I'm sure we will be given the spectacle of how bad of winners the democrats are. Look how bad they behave at funerals.

[Guest090920]

The health care reform bill may be the best thing to happen to this country in 60 years, however, not for its ability to reform health care. It may replace the need for a constitutional amendment for term limits. If this plan doesn't work, every member of congress who voted for it will be sent home in November! I can't think of a better thing to improve this country than sending every incumbent home to get a real job, join social security and buy their own health care under the bill they just shoved down our throats! This is going to be fun to watch!

[Guest052813-01]

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j4a9iVRb0l4

http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=Wa...1&geocode=CITY

http://www.mapquest.com/maps?city=Wa...6&geocode=CITY

http://www.answers.com/topic/battle-of-waterloo

http://www.rasmussenreports.com/publ..._tracking_poll

In actuality, it was the minority who won. Only 28% of the country supports this piece of crap, and it was forced down our throats against our will. Even the other major entitlement programs were passed, over the initial objections of the GOP, with strong bi-partisan support - this bill had no bi-partisan support, other than for its defeat.

And, in the end, Stupak and his gang of 12 may have sold out their beliefs for funding for three airports in his district, because the "executive order" will be challenged in court and lose, as no executive order can override federal legislation.

No matter, once the Bamster affixes his signature to this, 37 states will sue the federal government for the unfunded mandates (based on the tenth amendment of the Constitution being violated - States' rights clause) and the ACLU will sue on the point that the government is forcing citizens to purchase insurance or be fined/taxed (violation of the 14th amendment - due process clause).

And, one more piece of electoral math: in order to repeal this bill, the elections in November 2010 would have to produce veto-proof majorities in both parties - that means 287 seats in the House and 67 seats in the Senate would have to belong to the GOP. The number in the House is possible, since all 435 seats are up for grabs, but unlikely. However, there are only 33 seats in the Senate up for election - and the GOP would have to win 26 seats that are held by Democraps or Independents. There are not that many seats up for election by the Dems this time around. So the chances of this bill being repealed before 2013 is unlikely. But, it will be easier to repeal the bill as long as the electoral map falls to the GOP after the 2012 elections (Obama is ousted and the GOP holds a majority in the house and filibuster-proof majority in the Senate), because once 2014 rolls around and these mandates are implemented, the Dems will be able to use the "GOP wants to take away your health care" argument when talk of repealing is brought up.

[Guest052813-01]

Originally Posted by scorpio31

I can't think of a better thing to improve this country than sending every incumbent home to get a real job, join social security and buy their own health care under the bill they just shoved down our throats! This is going to be fun to watch!

I hate to be the bearer of bad news, but all former members of Congress (the opposite of progress, BTW) have their own pension plan that is separate from Social Security, they get a generous severance package that includes any unspent contributions to their campaigns to spend on personal expenses, and they are members of the congressional health insurance plan, which in no way resembles this piece of crap they just passed.

[lacrew_2000]

I doubt a repeal will ever work.

The 37 states considering a lawsuit are now 36, as Kansas has already chickened out.

The details are sketchy...but it looks like my employer would pay a $2,000 fine to drop me. They pay around $8,000 a year to keep me. Multiplied by many hundreds, sooner or later they will drop us all. I will then have to buy the government insurance (no group rate available to me, I'm stuck with it). I will pay around $12,000 for it...with around $2,500 subsidy, which kicks in the $2,000 fine for my company).

Ok, I was paying $4,000 on my end of it, so now I pay $8,000 more out of pocket....effectively increasing my tax burden by 50%.

If you make over $200,000, your medicare taxes are doubled.

If you are on medicare, the deductable just increased.

If you itemize health costs, the threshold just went up from 7.5% of income to 10%.

Ladies, if you use a tanning salon, 10% tax on that goes into effect.

It really sucks to be middle class right now.

That's just the cost side - I don't even want to think about the rationing.

I know, I'm an uncaring grinch...but look at how well this plan is doing in Hawaii, Tenn, and Mass....they already have it in place, and it is failing.

There had to have been a better way. Have any of the votes on this bill been during a weekday? Or even during daylight hour? That alone tells me all I need to know.

[dirty dog]

Guys although what you say may be true, your obvious hatred is just playing into Mongers hands, I sure he is sporting a little chubby right now, because he thinks they have taken control of the world, just remember he is always trolling and your just giving him the opportunity to "kick you in the shins and run away", thats how his kind operate.

[lacrew_2000]

Well I guess I'm not ready to be kicked in the shins just yet. I've already heard a radio ad from a candidate promising to repeal this...I doubt it will get repealled, but the whole mess is going to get gummed up in court, and with the states filing lawsuits - Florida and Virginia have already filed their suits.

The 'benefits' of this thing don't kick in until 2014, so nobody's getting any freebies yet either, so I don't quite understand all the gloating, either.

They can pass whatever they want; but, it has to be kinda sorta constitutional. My prediction: When people figure out their premiums won't go down by 3,000 percent (to quote the president), and start to see the tax implications of this, they will wonder what the heck we even needed this for (remember the 32 million uninsured is made up of young people, who will suddenly be paying a premium for the first time), and the lackluster public support for this will fall even lower. The November elections will be a bloodbath for the Democrats also. The whole mess will be pieced up and slowly fixed, through the courts, and follow on legislation.

[dirty dog]

By the way crew, the benefits don't kick in until 2014 but the taxes begin immediately. The IRS hired people just for this event to get the codes prepared so that taxes can be implimented as soon as possible.

[BiggestBest]

This is just the first shot in an inevitable class war. And if you think the guys with the money are going to take this lying down, then you haven't been watching US politics very long.

It all comes down to "what can I get for me and make someone else pay?" vs "the ones with the money make the rules".

My money is on "the money".

[Guest052813-01]

Originally Posted by dirty dog

By the way crew, the benefits don't kick in until 2014 but the taxes begin immediately. The IRS hired people just for this event to get the codes prepared so that taxes can be implimented as soon as possible.

Actually, DD, the reconciliation bill contains the legislation that hires the extra IRS agents to collect the fees/penalties/taxes. There is a problem with the reconciliation bill - it contains some "fuzzy math" that moves funds set aside for Social Security over to the funding of the Medicaid increases. As this involves Social Security, a little known codasyl in the Faber constitution called the "Byrd rule", after that long-standing, KKK member Sen. Robert Byrd (D-W. Va.), states that any funding bill sent to the Senate from the House affecting Social Security does not fall under the rules of reconciliation and, therefore, is subject to the 60 vote threshhold to bring cloture to the debate. Which means it would be subject to amendments and being sent back to the House for debate and possible conference committees.

And I am proud of my hatred and vitriol coming through. I want to destroy as many of these Democraps as I can, defeat these bastards at every turn, and send them all back to the fiery nether-regions from which they came. The sooner we eliminate them, the better (in a political sense, of course). If the Democraps thought November 1994 was bad, they haven't seen anything until this fall.

[BiggestBest]

Originally Posted by fritz3552

And I am proud of my hatred and vitriol coming through. I want to destroy as many of these Democraps as I can, defeat these bastards at every turn, and send them all back to the fiery nether-regions from which they came. The sooner we eliminate them, the better (in a political sense, of course). If the Democraps thought November 1994 was bad, they haven't seen anything until this fall.

I am going to assume you are referring to the elected Democrats (and not the ones reading this thread).

[Guest052813-01]

Originally Posted by BiggestBest

I am going to assume you are referring to the elected Democrats (and not the ones reading this thread).

I am referring to any elected official that supported this piece of crap. In Congress, the Executive branch, the local government, whomever decides to run for an elected seat, etc. They should all be eliminated (politically), defeated, thrown back into the chasm of ooze from which they emerged.

[dirty dog]

Yeah but your just making Longer as happy as a pig in shit, I am sure he's jerked the gerkin 3 or 4 times while reading this thread.

[john_galt]

You know Longer may have a chubbie in his hand at the moment but in a few short years he will find himself holding a flaccid organ that no Viagra will cure. Mark Twain once said that a lie will go around the world before the truth can get it's boots on. In the long run the real Americans will be triumphant (for Monger; that is the 76% who oppose the tyranny in DC). Like Bull Run, Pearl Harbor, and 9/11 the US takes a hit like this hellthcare bill in order to get it's head right.