Economic collapse

[bushmasterM4]

Any one concerned about a possible Economic Collapse of the US?
*
My parents left latin America in search of a better life and both my father and me found success but things are looking bleak with more bad news coming out every day.
My income and hobby funds have steadily decreased compared to how much I was playing just two years ago. I see a regular string of girls and business seems to be down overall for them. Granted they can always count on horny older men like me to come to them but I am not sure how long I can keep this up with my family obligations and bills. Just 5 years ago I could walk out of training and land a job making*good money*but know my medical group has more applicants than they can deal with. I wanted to share with everyone the following I got from the economiccollapse blog. Anyone getting prepared for hard times ahead?
*
The following are 30 signs that the U.S. economy is about to go into the toilet....
#1 An increasing number of unemployed Americans have become so desperate that they have started to look for work overseas.* For example, the number of Americans that are submitting applications for temporary work visas in Canada has approximately doubled since 2008.* Other Americans are willing to learn foreign languages and travel to the other side of the world if that is what it takes to land a decent job.* Just consider the following quote from a recent USA Today report....
Job placement firms are reporting a surge in American worker interest in booming economies such as Hong Kong, Singapore, China and, increasingly, India. Hunt Partners, an executive search firm, estimates that it's getting 50% to 100% more unsolicited résumés from Americans looking for Asia-based positions today than before the recession.
#2 When Barack Obama first took office, the official U.S. unemployment rate was 7.6 percent.* Today it is 9.1 percent.
#3 The number of Americans that are concerned that they will lose their jobs continues to hover near record highs.* According to Gallup, 30 percent of all employed Americans are worried that they will soon be laid off.
#4 After three straight years of very high unemployment, you can feel frustration and desperation in the air almost everywhere that you go.* Many unemployed Americans are now at the end of their ropes.* The following is from a testimonial that was recently posted on The Atlantic....
The most difficult part of the job search is:
1. that I don't live near a factory or outsource outlet in China, India, or Malaysia.
2. trying not to appear desperate for a job when I am, in fact, quite desperate for a job.
3. that I am subject to everyone's advice on how to get a job, but no real job leads.
4. that I am reminded that having a good job is not an entitlement.
5. that when I become depressed from my job search, I'm told told to cheer up or else give a bad vibe to prospective employers ... yet when I become happy through non-search related activities, I am reminded that I should be looking for work
7. that when I confide to friends and family that I have "given up" to pursue more fruitful interests, *it elicits a crushing look of disbelief, disappointment, and disgust
8. waiting for permission to give up.
#5 The percentage of American men that are employed continues to plummet.* In July, only 63.5 percent of all men in the United States had a job.* Since 1948, that number has only been lower one time (63.3 percent in December 2009).
#6 Back in the 1950s, manufacturing accounted for about 28 percent of U.S. GDP.* Last year, it accounted for just 11.7 percent.* Meanwhile, manufacturing now accounts for about 25 percent of GDP in China and they now actually have more factory production each year than we do.* Sadly, Barack Obama is pushing for even more trade agreements that will send millions more of our jobs overseas.
#7 The percentage of Americans that are working low paying jobs continues to relentlessly march upwards.* Back in 1980, less than 30% of all jobs in the United States were low income jobs.* Today, more than 40% of all jobs in the United States are low income jobs.
#8 According to John Williams of shadowstats.com, after you add in all short-term discouraged workers, all long-term discouraged workers and all Americans that are working part-time because they cannot find full-time employment, the real unemployment rate should be approximately 23 percent.
#9 We are starting to see another huge wave of store closings and layoffs.* For example, the parent company of Payless stores has announced that it will be permanently closing 475 stores.* Borders is in the process of closing every single one of its 399 stores.* Also, Bank of America has just announced that it will be closing about 600 branches, and that could result in the loss of about 30,000 good jobs.
#10 Median household income has fallen for three years in a row.
#11 Americans are really starting to rack up consumer debt once again.* According to Time Magazine, U.S. consumers are on pace to collectively add 54 billion dollars in credit card debt in 2011.
#12 Student loan defaults are rising very sharply. Just consider the following excerpt from a recent New York Times article....
The share of federal student loan defaults rose sharply last year, especially at for-profit colleges and universities, where 15 percent of borrowers defaulted in the first two years of repayment, up from 11.6 percent the previous year.
#13 According to a chart in The Economist, whenever the number of newspaper articles in the Financial Times and the Wall Street Journal that mention the word "recession" goes over 1,500 in a particular quarter, the U.S. economy almost always goes into a recession.
#14 The U.S. housing crash just continues to get worse.* The index of home builder sentiment put out by the National Association of Home Builders fell once again during the month of September.* With such a glut of unsold foreclosed homes on the market, it is making things really hard of home builders.* Things have gotten so bad that even the U.S. government now owns nearly a quarter of a million foreclosed homes.* The impact of this housing nightmare on families has been absolutely devastating.* Just check out what a recent Time Magazine article had to say about what has been going on in California....
The impact on children has been brutal: since 2007, 7% of the state's children have had a foreclosure process started on their homes, the fourth-highest level in the nation, according to a study released this month by the Annie E. Casey Foundation.
#15 Many believe that due to much tighter lending standards, it is now harder to be approved for a mortgage than at any other time since World War II.* This is absolutely crushing the housing market.
#16 Most Americans don't seem to expect housing prices to recover for an extended period of time.* One recent survey found that 54 percent of Americans believe that there will not be a housing recovery until "2014 or later".
#17 The combined debt of the largest GSEs (Fannie Mae, Freddie Mac and Sallie Mae) has increased from 3.2 trillion in 2008 to a whopping 6.4 trillion in 2011.* If that debt goes bad, U.S. taxpayers will be left holding the bill.
#18 There are now nearly 50 million Americans that do not have health insurance, and the percentage of Americans covered by employer-based health plans has fallen for 11 years in a row.* Meanwhile, Americans now spend about 3 times as much on health care as they did back in 1990.
#19 The Postal Service has publicly announced that it is "on the verge" of financial collapse.
#20 The number of small businesses continues to fall.* I recently noted this fact on The American Dream Blog....
The number of "self-employed" Americans continues to rapidly shrink.* According the Bureau of Labor Statistics, 16.6 million Americans were self-employed back in December 2006.* Today, that number has shrunk to 14.5 million.* Even though we have 14 million unemployed people in this country and jobs are incredibly difficult to come by, the number of people trying to work for themselves continues to decrease because the environment for small businesses in this country has become so incredibly toxic.
#21 American consumers have become tremendously pessimistic.* According to one recent survey, 61 percent of all Americans believe that they will not return to their "pre-recession" lifestyles until at least 2014.* According to a different recent survey, 39 percent of Americans actually believe that the U.S. economy has now entered a "permanent decline".
#22 Many U.S. investors certainly seem to believe that trouble is coming.* According to CNN, last month the number of bets against the S&P 500 was the highest that we have seen in about a year.
#23 The number of U.S. households that are "doubling up" continues to grow.* According to the U.S. Census Bureau, the number of combined households has increased by 10.7 percent since 2007.
#24 When Barack Obama moved into the White House, the average price of a gallon of gasoline in the United States was $1.83.* Today it is $3.58.
#25 The number of Americans living in poverty grew by 2.6 million last year.* That was the largest increase since the U.S. government began calculating poverty figures back in 1959.
#26 Back in the year 2000, 11.3% of all Americans were living in poverty.* Today, 15.1% of all Americans are living in poverty.
#27 On Barack Obama's first day on the job, there were about 32 million Americans on food stamps.* Today, there are more than 45 million Americans on food stamps.
#28 If there is a financial collapse in Europe, that will definitely plunge us into another recession.* Right now, things do not look promising.* At this point, headlines all over the world are proclaiming that Greece is dangerously close to defaulting.
#29 At some point soon, investors all over the globe may decide that it is time to start dumping U.S. government debt.* For example, Chinese officials are now openly talking about the need to "liquidate" their holdings of U.S. Treasuries.
#30 The U.S. national debt continues to explode in size and spiral out of control.* According to Professor Laurence J. Kotlikoff, the U.S. "fiscal gap" increased by about 6 trillion dollars last year.* In fact, Kotlikoff makes a compelling argument that Greece is actually in better shape financially than the United States is.
Do you now understand how much trouble we are in?
The long-term trends that are destroying us continue to get worse.
The United States is steamrolling directly toward an economic collapse.
When this economy hits bottom and splatters all over the place, it is not going to be easy to fix.
The America that we know today is going to be wiped out by a gigantic mountain of debt and by the consequences of decades of really bad decisions.
We were handed the keys to the greatest economic machine in the history of the world and we have wrecked it.
So prepare for really, really hard times ahead.
The era of endless prosperity is ending.
Next comes the pain.

[Guest083013]

thank you very much for taking the time to place this on the forum.....

.....I kinda think the last line is rather "prophetic" because now those of you have not used the valued IGNORE option will have to endure the pain as you see the voluminous retorts I'm sure are on the near horizon

[Rodram]

Originally Posted by dennisrn

thank you very much for taking the time to place this on the forum.....

.....I kinda think the last line is rather "prophetic" because now those of you have not used the valued IGNORE option will have to endure the pain as you see the voluminous retorts I'm sure are on the near horizon

Yes, the ignore option on ECCIE is a great tool, especially when you want to hide from having to defend your comments or your points of view.

Wiki has a good description for this behavior:
"Cowardice is the perceived failure to demonstrate sufficient robustness and courage in the face of a challenge."

dennisrn, I will never again capitulate to gain an open dialogue with you.

[bushmasterM4]

Sorry for the volume. I should have just posted a link. I still think it is worth discussing as most of the hobbyists are established or retired professionals. Am I the only one freaking out about all this?

[Rodram]

Originally Posted by bushmasterM4

Sorry for the volume. I should have just posted a link. I still think it is worth discussing as most of the hobbyists are established or retired professionals. Am I the only one freaking out about all this?

No, you're not the only one bushmaster, I think we all are. Can you pick one of the points that particularly concerns you so we can discuss it?

[Whitedog]

Wow, it's guess it's so bad out there, I think I'll shoot myself. I have to remind myself of that every time I sit down to a table full of food, or get in one of my several autos, and go to one of my several thousand acre hunting leases, or have to decide which of the 5 HD televisions in my house to watch. It's also difficult to remember when I'm fishing in Brazil, Alaska, or Canada. Even when things are bad, they aren't so bad.....

[Rodram]

I'll address #19 and the USPS. This is weird, but from what I understand, is that at some point the USPS was ordered by congress to pay all of their retiree health benefits trust fund every year that amounted to over 5 billion dollars. Most companies underfund those trust funds but not the Post Office. Strange.
This among many other short falls, including losses incurred by email, has caused the USPS to be in such terrible financial situation.

[Whitedog]

Regarding the USPS: Remember that Congress controls postal rates, so it's not hard to figure out why they lose money. Try and send a letter through FedEx or UPS for 44 cents, and see how far it gets. Or, have the bulk mailers, that only pay a fraction of first-class rates, pay their share and listen to them scream their heads off. The USPS is probably one of the best run programs the gov't controls. I'll never understand how people can complain about a service they can't get anywhere where else for the price. Of course it's going broke! It's just another example of the non-taxpayers wanting something for nothing, so Congress won't manage fees properly. Although, maybe we should blame Obama. It's his fault everything is screwed up.

[Laz]

The USPS has to change with the times. That will require them to overhaul their service offerings, pricing and staffing. In the private sector that is done all of the time. But for a government run unionized bureaucracy that will be a challenge. I do not complain about the service I just think they should price the service at a level that at least breaks even against their expenses. If their prices are to high Fed Ex or UPS will displace them.

[Rodram]

Originally Posted by Laz

The USPS has to change with the times. That will require them to overhaul their service offerings, pricing and staffing. In the private sector that is done all of the time. But for a government run unionized bureaucracy that will be a challenge. I do not complain about the service I just think they should price the service at a level that at least breaks even against their expenses. If their prices are to high Fed Ex or UPS will displace them.

LAZ, your comment is so full of the misinformation and dogma from the republican agenda to label everything as a government bureaucracy and failure that I wonder if Americans know anymore how much of the government works and how it has made our lives better.


-Has anyone had a problem with the Post Office to the point that it could be called "a government run unionized bureaucracy" ?

-How were the roads on the way to work?

-Did you get there safely?

-How about the laws that the government puts in to make your travel safe?

-How about those government mandated airbags? They work huh?

-Did those government regulated buses get your kids to school safely?

-Did you eat your meal with the confidence that it wasn't contaminated with e-coli or other bacteria?

How about your Social Security check? Did you get it?
(Just a little perspective here for you to consider; Social Security has never bounced a check in it's 70 year existence.)

How about you SOCIALIST in the military? Had any problems getting paid, receiving your benefits or your free government run healthcare?

Snark on/The government feeds you, clothes you, doctors you, puts a roof over your head and makes sure you wipe your ass and YOUR NOT A SOCIALIST ON THE GOVERNMENT TIT? HOW IS THAT?!? Snark/off

How about the men and women fighting the wars in the middle east? Are they doing a bad job? They ARE the government dontcha' know!?!

I could go on forever LAZ but would you consider what I've said?

[Rodram]

Originally Posted by Laz

The USPS has to change with the times. That will require them to overhaul their service offerings, pricing and staffing. In the private sector that is done all of the time. But for a government run unionized bureaucracy that will be a challenge. I do not complain about the service I just think they should price the service at a level that at least breaks even against their expenses. If their prices are to high Fed Ex or UPS will displace them.

And give our mail to the free market Wall Street pig machine just so it can go under and have some CEO get paid millions for the failure? And we would benefit how exactly? By not getting any mail?
This is what I mean by the republican agenda and why it destroys the perspectives of Americans with it's continual, never ending lying.
I'm not referencing just you LAZ, but all of us, as I have fallen to that noise also.

[Jdriller]

-Has anyone had a problem with the Post Office to the point that it could be called "a government run unionized bureaucracy" ? They have about 50% more employees than they need and can't get rid of them under current rules. They are losing billions of dollars per year.

-How were the roads on the way to work?
Roads and bridges are in terrible shape. The infrastructure is in dire need of major overhaul. Traffic everywhere is backed up. New roads, new interstates are badly needed.

-Did you get there safely? A lot of people don't.

-How about the laws that the government puts in to make your travel safe?
At least as far as air travel is concerned, all these searches, taking your shoes off, your belt off, going through x-ray machines are costing billions to implement and doing very little to make us safe.

-How about those government mandated airbags? They work huh? Unless you are an, adult, 5'tall and only weigh about 100 lbs. Then they may kill you

-Did those government regulated buses get your kids to school safely? You mean the ones without seat belts (which is almost all of them)

-Did you eat your meal with the confidence that it wasn't contaminated with e-coli or other bacteria? Contaminated foods are making hundreds of thousands of people sick every year and killing some.

How about your Social Security check? Did you get it?
(Just a little perspective here for you to consider; Social Security has never bounced a check in it's 70 year existence.) Don't get one and I am not confident I will get the full amount am an entitled to when I do qualify. Obama did threaten that SS checks might not go out during the debt debates.

How about you SOCIALIST in the military? Had any problems getting paid, receiving your benefits or your free government run health care? They earn their check and benefits. Lately the government has been tossing around ideas that would totally change their retirement plans, reduce their benefits after retirement. They already have to pay for medical and dental insurance after they retire (but for many when they joined up they were led to believe the military medical/dental treatments would be handled for no cost via military/dental facilities. Now they have to pay insurance premiums and co-payments and get much of their treatment in civilian institutions

Snark on/The government feeds you, clothes you, doctors you, puts a roof over your head and makes sure you wipe your ass and YOUR NOT A SOCIALIST ON THE GOVERNMENT TIT? HOW IS THAT?!? Snark/off And puts the military guys out there to be shot at, killed, maimed and separated from families for months, sometimes years at a time. IF you count the number of hours they work (sometimes 12 hours or more a day, 7 days a week) they don't get near the money they should.

How about the men and women fighting the wars in the middle east? Are they doing a bad job? They ARE the government dontcha' know!?! They are only one part of the government. But they don't make the rules. They are doing an outstanding job even knowing that long term all their sacrifices will be for nothing when we pull out and everything goes to hell

I could go on forever LAZ but would you consider what I've said?

[Rodram]

Originally Posted by Jdriller

-Has anyone had a problem with the Post Office to the point that it could be called "a government run unionized bureaucracy" ? They have about 50% more employees than they need and can't get rid of them under current rules. They are losing billions of dollars per year.

-How were the roads on the way to work?
Roads and bridges are in terrible shape. The infrastructure is in dire need of major overhaul. Traffic everywhere is backed up. New roads, new interstates are badly needed.

-Did you get there safely? A lot of people don't.

-How about the laws that the government puts in to make your travel safe?
At least as far as air travel is concerned, all these searches, taking your shoes off, your belt off, going through x-ray machines are costing billions to implement and doing very little to make us safe.

-How about those government mandated airbags? They work huh? Unless you are an, adult, 5'tall and only weigh about 100 lbs. Then they may kill you

-Did those government regulated buses get your kids to school safely? You mean the ones without seat belts (which is almost all of them)

-Did you eat your meal with the confidence that it wasn't contaminated with e-coli or other bacteria? Contaminated foods are making hundreds of thousands of people sick every year and killing some.

How about your Social Security check? Did you get it?
(Just a little perspective here for you to consider; Social Security has never bounced a check in it's 70 year existence.) Don't get one and I am not confident I will get the full amount am an entitled to when I do qualify. Obama did threaten that SS checks might not go out during the debt debates.

How about you SOCIALIST in the military? Had any problems getting paid, receiving your benefits or your free government run health care? They earn their check and benefits. Lately the government has been tossing around ideas that would totally change their retirement plans, reduce their benefits after retirement. They already have to pay for medical and dental insurance after they retire (but for many when they joined up they were led to believe the military medical/dental treatments would be handled for no cost via military/dental facilities. Now they have to pay insurance premiums and co-payments and get much of their treatment in civilian institutions

Snark on/The government feeds you, clothes you, doctors you, puts a roof over your head and makes sure you wipe your ass and YOUR NOT A SOCIALIST ON THE GOVERNMENT TIT? HOW IS THAT?!? Snark/off And puts the military guys out there to be shot at, killed, maimed and separated from families for months, sometimes years at a time. IF you count the number of hours they work (sometimes 12 hours or more a day, 7 days a week) they don't get near the money they should.

How about the men and women fighting the wars in the middle east? Are they doing a bad job? They ARE the government dontcha' know!?! They are only one part of the government. But they don't make the rules. They are doing an outstanding job even knowing that long term all their sacrifices will be for nothing when we pull out and everything goes to hell

I could go on forever LAZ but would you consider what I've said?

What country are you in J? Somalia? You're so far off the deep end that I sure would like to know where you get this from. I don't even think Limbaugh could this bad. WOW

[Jdriller]

How about from the news from various sources, including CNN, FOX, Local news, the newspaper, the internet news. Most of this in in the headlines all the time. As far as the military is concerned, I was part of the military either as a child dependant (18 years) or active duty (8 years). I have seen an lived it. Have you?

[Laz]

I agree with Jdriller and have a couple of additional points.

First I did not say they did not accomplish the job. I said they needed to evolve to work in the current environment. I am operating on the assumption that unlimited government subsidies is not the objective.

On roads how much of the gas tax collected has been squandered by politicians on things not related to the purpose of the gas tax. Then we are told that taxes need to be raised so that there is money for road construction and maintanance.

Food quality is just as important to the businesses as the government. Perfection will never be achieved but I believe businesses work on that as much as the government.

I am more worried about Social Securities ability to pay for the next 70 years. This is the first time we have been in a situation where more money will be going out than coming in. Obama's answer is to reduce SS taxes in an ineffective attempt to create jobs. Give companies a reason to hire. That is what creates jobs.

I have a financial planning background and am very familiar with military benefits. They for the most part are very generous. I would be critical of them if it were not for one reality. It is the only occupation where you can be ordered to do something that could easily get you killed or maimed. Given that, they earn every dime we pay them. If there is any waste in government that is the one place I will be less critical of waste. I still think they need to spend money wisely but I want them to err on the side of providing for our troops.

Finally - yes I have considered what you said and I am not a Republican mouthpiece. They have contributed to the problems we have also. We need a change of attitude in both parties to being responsible with the taxpayors money.