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The Political Forum Discuss anything related to politics in this forum. World politics, US Politics, State and Local.

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Old 02-20-2018, 11:39 AM   #16
LexusLover
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He probably got Napoleon confused with Santa Anna.
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Old 02-20-2018, 06:59 PM   #17
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Deputy Attorney General Rod Rosenstein announced last week the indictment of 13 Russian nationals and three Russian organizations for meddling in the 2016 U.S. presidential election.
The details ― of Russian financing of Trump’s businesses, and of more campaign contacts ― are likely to be spelled out in further indictments, almost surely including members of Trump’s family, and in Mueller’s final report, which will look very much like a bill of impeachment.

What’s astonishing ― and devastating ― is that this detailed report on Russian manipulation of a U.S. presidential election had to come from a special counsel. Under a normal administration, evidence of a foreign power meddling in a U.S. election would have prompted a presidential order for a full investigation. Instead, Trump mocked the whole idea and used his influence to block such inquiries by House and Senate panels.

Rather than looking deeply into Russian interference, the president appointed a commission on election integrity, headed by Vice President Mike Pence and Kris Kobach, the Kansas secretary of state best known for voter suppression, based on the premise that massive voter fraud by immigrants and others not qualified to vote had helped Clinton win the national popular vote. This was so preposterous that the commission collapsed of its own weight.


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So where does Mueller’s latest set of indictments leave us?

First, these disclosures end Trump’s intermittent efforts to fire Mueller. If he were to try that now, it would be an open-and-shut case of obstruction of justice. Congressional Republicans would have no choice but to begin the impeachment process.

Second, they drive a further wedge between Trump and the Republican leadership in the House and Senate. All key Republicans, whatever their marriage of convenience with Trump on other issues, have expressed outrage at the Russian operations and praised Mueller. Trump, by contrast, has only proclaimed his own lack of complicity, and has said nothing about what documented Russian interference means for American democracy, much less vowed to resist it and punish Putin.

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President Donald Trump walks out of the Oval Office on Feb. 16.
We also see a further wedge between Trump and the entire intelligence community. Last week, on the eve of the Mueller indictments, the leaders of every major intelligence agency, including Trump appointees, testified unanimously before Congress that there was no doubt that Russia meddled in the 2016 election. Unlike Trump, they are alarmed that Putin tipped a U.S. election to a pro-Kremlin stooge.

One question is the degree to which Mueller’s 37-page indictment relied on materials from those U.S. intelligence agencies, and what else the government has that it isn’t revealing out of concern for disclosing “sources and methods.” Mueller’s indictment goes into far more detail than anything else that has been made public.

Two other questions remain. First is Mueller’s timing. When will other indictments come? He could wrap things up in a matter of weeks, or the investigation could drag out beyond November’s midterm elections.

Second is how the U.S. should punish and deter Russia. The Russian actions to undermine American democracy and tip the election amounted to an act of war. And if those actions were as effective as much reporting and now Mueller’s indictments have suggested they were, it means Trump literally became president in a Russia-sponsored coup d’etat.

The U.S. and the Russians surely have the capacity to knock out each other’s vital defense and infrastructure systems that rely on the internet. But unlike the nuclear deterrence of Mutually Assured Destruction, there are no bright lines when it comes to self-restraint in cyberwar. If there were, Russia surely crossed one in 2015 and 2016.

What sort of retaliation makes sense? Mutually assured cyberdestruction would be a catastrophe; that’s why Russia gets away with these incursions. But slaps on the wrist like banning the travel or freezing the bank accounts of a few Russian individuals just makes America look pitiful.

This is the serious question America needs to take up, once Trump is gone. Thanks to Mueller’s latest revelations and those still to come, that day may not be far off.

Robert Kuttner is co-editor of The American Prospect and a professor at Brandeis University’s Heller School. His forthcoming book is Can Democracy Survive Global Capitalism?

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Old 02-20-2018, 09:25 PM   #18
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get em Rob...

What yall don't realize is that it was a very purposeful and masterful strategy to indict the Russians first. This was very important and all legal minds know this. It is the setup before the storm. Now that you've set the baseline (and proved Russian invasion) you can now go after those Americans that helped them. You can't go after the Americans (Trump's team) unless you first establish that the Russians did assault our National Sovereignty.

This is Chess not Checkers. Trump and his psycho killer looking sons will be indicted and hopefully serve hard time at Ft. Leavenworth.... maybe they will even get life in Prison from the courts for treason against the US.

They didn't commit treason, you don't even know what treason is.

Jim
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Old 02-20-2018, 09:28 PM   #19
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Trump is going down SIR and you cant stop it. When it all said and done he be the only POTUS sent to prison with his sons. He will be FIRED.AND YOU CANT STOP IT
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Old 02-20-2018, 10:23 PM   #20
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Trump is going down SIR and you cant stop it. When it all said and done he be the only POTUS sent to prison with his sons. He will be FIRED.AND YOU CANT STOP IT
I certainly can't stop it and you can't make it happen either.


Jim
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Old 02-21-2018, 04:52 AM   #21
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I certainly can't stop it and you can't make it happen either.


Jim
He can in his own mind.
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Old 02-21-2018, 08:29 AM   #22
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Trump is going down SIR and you cant stop it. When it all said and done he be the only POTUS sent to prison with his sons. He will be FIRED.AND YOU CANT STOP IT
You need to read other news sources other than the Puff Ho.
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Old 02-21-2018, 09:21 AM   #23
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Originally Posted by Sistine Chapel View Post
get em Rob...

What yall don't realize is that it was a very purposeful and masterful strategy to indict the Russians first. This was very important and all legal minds know this. It is the setup before the storm. Now that you've set the baseline (and proved Russian invasion) you can now go after those Americans that helped them. You can't go after the Americans (Trump's team) unless you first establish that the Russians did assault our National Sovereignty.

This is Chess not Checkers. Trump and his psycho killer looking sons will be indicted and hopefully serve hard time at Ft. Leavenworth.... maybe they will even get life in Prison from the courts for treason against the US.
You do know that Napoleon got his ass kicked, right SissyChaps? At least you didn’t use Custer in your analogy fucking weirdo
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Old 02-21-2018, 03:25 PM   #24
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Steele remains to be indicted as an unregistered foreign agent working to meddle in our national election. I am sure the indictment is in process. Unfortunately, we have a lying cheating sack of shit as a special counsel that will look the other way on anything that has to do with the the DNC and Hillary Clinton.
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Old 02-21-2018, 09:10 PM   #25
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the special counsel is a republican and trump is a piece of shit, the gop will loose big time in the mid terms, trump will be impeached or resign and you wil keep crying big ass tears, just wait till texas turns blue assholes
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Old 02-21-2018, 09:29 PM   #26
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FTFY, shit chaser.
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Old 02-21-2018, 10:54 PM   #27
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the special counsel is a republican and trump is a piece of shit, the gop will loose big time in the mid terms, trump will be impeached or resign and you wil keep crying big ass tears, just wait till texas turns blue assholes
Hillary's still waiting!

Are you related to ASSUP? He thinks Texas elected Gov Wendy Davis.

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Old 02-22-2018, 05:16 PM   #28
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[QUOTE=LexusLover;1060524749]
From Page 4 ... (I apologize for not putting on Big Chief paper!)QUOTE]


Of course you know had you actually done that, LL, the libturds in this forum would've come outa the woodwork screaming you were a racist for mocking Native Americans....

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