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Income taxes have only been around a little over 100 years. That's the time frame you referenced. Why do you bring up Nixon? Does that mean it's ok to restrict freedom if a Republican does it? I vigorously opposed Nixon, for that and many other reasons. You asked how we were less free, and I told you. Oh, and the President needs no pretext to hold me indefinitely without due process. He (or she) can have anyone arrested and detained indefinitely, for any reason or no reason. Want to know why? BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY TO CHALLENGE THE DETENTION!
You're a fucking moron.
Oh, and ShamWow, don't worry. When the curtain falls, I'm sure they'll remember your impassioned defense of tyranny, and give you a comfortable cot in the reeducation camp. You will fit in well with the United Statists of Amerika.
Income taxes have only been around a little over 100 years. That's the time frame you referenced. Why do you bring up Nixon? Does that mean it's ok to restrict freedom if a Republican does it? I vigorously opposed Nixon, for that and many other reasons. You asked how we were less free, and I told you. Oh, and the President needs no pretext to hold me indefinitely without due process. He (or she) can have anyone arrested and detained indefinitely, for any reason or no reason. Want to know why? BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY TO CHALLENGE THE DETENTION!
You're a fucking moron.
Oh, and ShamWow, don't worry. When the curtain falls, I'm sure they'll remember your impassioned defense of tyranny, and give you a comfortable cot in the reeducation camp. You will fit in well with the United Statists of Amerika.
The Romans had taxes, so you're full of shit there. You mentioned the gold standard. That's Nixon's fault. I'm not defending him. Take that up with him. In hell, maybe. How would the president even know to have you picked up unless you've done something pretty fucking heinous? Do you think we could have threads and conversations like this in China? Hell no. This is the time we live in. These are the rules we live by. Don't like it? Tough shit. There's no coming revolution. No impending doom. Fear has always been use to control the less astute among us. It's no different now. They keep you paralyzed with fear, full of ignorance, right where they want you.
I tried really hard to be civil in this argument, mind you.
But you still have to consider populations.
What does the size of the population have to do with anything? that is EXACTLY why they use PER 100,000 and not as an instance of the whole population. It means that the number of murder rates PER THE SAME AMOUNT OF PEOPLE is higher in the United States.
Plus we are a melting pot of different races, cultures ect.
Horseshit. All these other countries are just the same as the U.S, with the exception of Britian, which has more immigrants and more "different cultures" than the U.S. This is completely utterly irrelevant. I've lived in the UK, I grew up there. And let me tell you, the streets are just as harsh if not worse than America. The only difference is that you don't have the added fear of someone shooting you in the face for no fucking reason.
America is a gun country it's just that simple.
What? that has to be the most baseless argument ever
Many foreign countries have very strict gun laws but guns still exist and can be obtain rather easily
No they can not. The price of a black market AK in Australia is roundabout $15000. That's compared to the average global price of $500 and $400 in California's black market Here: http://www.havocscope.com/black-market-prices/ak-47/ I think its safe to assume that anyone with 15 grand lying around does not go buying guns to shoot up a school. He's doing allright.
Not to even mention the added difficulty of finding someone who will sell you an illegal gun that has no reason whatsoever to even be in the country.
I've lived in America all my life and in two different areas of the country the Midwest and the Southeast. We have a relatively high rate of crime that is true, but it's not just because we have a lot of guns. By your own admission you stated the UK had some violent streets as bad if not worse than America and apparently people have fewer guns. In fact the other day I was reading about a homeowner in my community shot two intruders coming into his home. The perp had a crow bar and broke the window of the homeowners back door. Homeowner shot both subjects killing one of them. If something like that happen in the UK how do you think it would have turned out? If you are against gun ownership that's fine. But since you didn't grow up in this country you know you can always head back to the UK where there is no guns but lots of violence.
I've lived in America all my life and in two different areas of the country the Midwest and the Southeast. We have a relatively high rate of crime that is true, but it's not just because we have a lot of guns. By your own admission you stated the UK had some violent streets as bad if not worse than America and apparently people have fewer guns. In fact the other day I was reading about a homeowner in my community shot two intruders coming into his home. The perp had a crow bar and broke the window of the homeowners back door. Homeowner shot both subjects killing one of them. If something like that happen in the UK how do you think it would have turned out? If you are against gun ownership that's fine. But since you didn't grow up in this country you know you can always head back to the UK where there is no guns but lots of violence.
Jim
Wow didn't make any effort to READ into the argument did you? When I said that the streets are just as bad, it was indication to the crime that's on the street level. Its just as bad as America, but you don't find people getting shot and killed over it.
You claim one instance where a burgular broke into someone's house and robbed him. What about the thousand drug deals gone bad that end up with some one getting shot? or the gas station stick ups that end with the poor Indian bastard getting his head blown off? I have to ask, "bro, Do you even First48?". If you watch that show you'd see how many times a drunken fight or a marijuana deal turns up with someone shot and killed, simply because one or all the players had a gun. Put that scenario in the UK, and yeah, you might have someone getting punched in the face and getting his teeth knocked out, but, at the end of the day, he shakes it off like a man and walks back home to his family. Every single death that you guys skate over under the guise of "freedom" is a end-all tragedy to the ones involved. Losing someone hurts deep, as I'm sure you know. I don't think your right to go shooting deer on the weekend outweighs someone's right to live.
you can always head back to the UK
Thanks for the advice, but I think I'll stick around. This country is the land of my fathers and I was born here. I love this country to the death, I'm sure you do too. We just have different ways of seeing it prosper, I guess.
Wow didn't make any effort to READ into the argument did you? When I said that the streets are just as bad, it was indication to the crime that's on the street level. Its just as bad as America, but you don't find people getting shot and killed over it.
You claim one instance where a burgular broke into someone's house and robbed him. What about the thousand drug deals gone bad that end up with some one getting shot? or the gas station stick ups that end with the poor Indian bastard getting his head blown off? I have to ask, "bro, Do you even First48?". If you watch that show you'd see how many times a drunken fight or a marijuana deal turns up with someone shot and killed, simply because one or all the players had a gun. Put that scenario in the UK, and yeah, you might have someone getting punched in the face and getting his teeth knocked out, but, at the end of the day, he shakes it off like a man and walks back home to his family. Every single death that you guys skate over under the guise of "freedom" is a end-all tragedy to the ones involved. Losing someone hurts deep, as I'm sure you know. I don't think your right to go shooting deer on the weekend outweighs someone's right to live.
you can always head back to the UK
Thanks for the advice, but I think I'll stick around. This country is the land of my fathers and I was born here. I love this country to the death, I'm sure you do too. We just have different ways of seeing it prosper, I guess.
Well if you haven't notice, I try to avoid getting into heated pissing matches over other people's views on this forum. I realize everyone has their own views and I respect that, but I must respect my own first. I know gun violence has a stigma. Lots of people in America want to get rid of guns. Guns make it easy to kill and maybe more than one person in a single incident and that's unfortunate. I am afraid we just can't have a perfect society it's just not in the cards. Your life can be in jeopardy at any time without warning. That fact has nothing to do with guns but rather the attitudes of people. Incidentally considering the UK's lack of gun ownership compare to America, who do you think fears being a victim of a violent crime the most? People of the UK or Americans.Interesting enough, people from the UK ,about 21% more than Americans. Maybe it's because in America you can lawfully obtain and own a firearm. I'll be the first to agree, we need to always strive to curb gun violence, but we don't need to do anything about lawful gun ownership.
The Romans had taxes, so you're full of shit there. You mentioned the gold standard. That's Nixon's fault. I'm not defending him. Take that up with him. In hell, maybe. How would the president even know to have you picked up unless you've done something pretty fucking heinous? Do you think we could have threads and conversations like this in China? Hell no. This is the time we live in. These are the rules we live by. Don't like it? Tough shit. There's no coming revolution. No impending doom. Fear has always been use to control the less astute among us. It's no different now. They keep you paralyzed with fear, full of ignorance, right where they want you.
You are quite dense, but I will try one more time. I referenced INCOME taxes, you moron. You know, one of the planks in the Communist Manifesto. And as far as the President's detention powers, you mean I'm ok if I behave? Is that freedom? Without due process there is no independent review of whether I misbehaved or not.
You must be gaming us. Nothing else explains your ignorance. Are you and ShamWow a comedy team, or gay Siamese twins?
Oh, and the President needs no pretext to hold me indefinitely without due process. He (or she) can have anyone arrested and detained indefinitely, for any reason or no reason. Want to know why? BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY TO CHALLENGE THE DETENTION!
I suppose this statement could use some clarification and/or cite of authority.
As for the OP the NRA is about to step in and the DickTater-in-Chief ...
Those statistics certainly make America look like a violent crime invested country. But you still have to consider populations.
Canada- 35 million
England 53-million
Australia 23-million
America 331 - million
America is larger in population than all three of those countries combined. Plus we are a melting pot of different races, cultures ect. America is a gun country it's just that simple. I can't understand why people are so concerned with firearms. Many foreign countries have very strict gun laws but guns still exist and can be obtain rather easily and of course the people that have them are usually criminals. I say this all the time " Be careful what you wish for" cause you may not be able to change your mind. America is safer than you think.
Jim
Jim, the statistics were population based. Homicides per 100,000 people so the population of the U.S. is irrelevant. I don't disagree with most of your statements. I am not pushing for strict gun control such as exists in England. Simply pointing out how misleading Iiffy's statements were, IMHO. Don't condemn other countries gun control laws when, for whatever reasons, they seem to be working.
Don't condemn other countries gun control laws when, for whatever reasons, they seem to be working.
Then we shouldn't ignore those countries (like Mexico and other Central and South American countries) in which their "gun control" isn't working ... and they have higher per capita death rates by firearms than the U.S. Which, BTW, seems an even greater and more urgent purpose of "securing" our Southern border, since many of those crossing illegally are from those countries with a much higher death rate than the U.S. (a "propensity" to use firearms against others).
And there you are, shamman, U B a wanker bragging about armed government agents violating the civil rights of law abiding American citizens. Meanwhile, just a few posts earlier, you stupidly claimed such a thing could never happen while you were stupidly oblivious to the fact that it had already happened, shamman.
BTW, here's a documented case where the verdict went against the "government", shamman:
I'm not giving up my guns because Ozombies feel uncomfortable and like Bloomberg said...
Quote:
“It’s controversial, but first thing is all of your — 95 percent of your murders and murderers, and murder victims fit one M.O. You can just take the description, Xerox it, and pass it out to all of the cops. They are male, minorities, 15 to 25. That’s true in New York, it’s true in virtually every city in America,” Bloomberg is heard saying in the newly released audio.
