150 YEARS AGO TODAY - GETTYSBURG AND VICKSBURG

[Whirlaway]

On this day 150 years ago, the Army of the Potomac prevailed over General Lee’s Confederate forces in the third and final day of battle at Gettysburg. With Grant’s victory at Vicksburg on the same day, the tide of the war turned decisively in favor of the Union.



Read more here.....great links to detailed accounts of both Gettysburg and Vicksburg.

http://www.powerlineblog.com/archive...-measure-2.php

[Jackie S]

The bloodiest three days in American History.

I have mixed feelings about the War between the States. (We call it a civil war, but it does not meet the definition). General Lee has always been idolized as such a military genius, when in fact he was using outdated tactics against "modern weaponry".

He was not alone, most of the General Officers had studied at West Point when Nepoleon was at his peek. They were taught that mass formations overpowing the other forces was the way to fight. This worked because of the extremely inaccurate smooth bore muskets that most Amies used. It was often said of the British "brown bess" smooth bore musket that the safest place to be was where the shooter was aiming.

That all changed in about 1860, as the newer rifled musket and the mini' ball. The regular infantryman now had the capability to be lethal out to 300-400 yards.

But the Generals still insisted on mass formations marching into this devastating firepower.

If you ever see the movie "Gettysburg", General Longstreet gives a very good discription of what was going to happen in Pickets Charge. He knew it was doomed to failure, but bowed to Lee's authority on insisting that the Union Troops would turn and run.

They didn't. And as Pickett himself said in his memoirs, "that old man destroyed my Division" when speaking of Lee.

[Whirlaway]

Not knowing how/when slavery would have been ended (without war) makes me certain that the Civil War was a war that had to be fought.

Unfortunately, the post war policies of Reconstruction were an unnecessary evil on the southern states.

[Jackie S]

A quote from General Longstreet. "We should have freed the slaves, and THEN fired on Fort Sumpter".

[I B Hankering]

Vicksburg and Gettysburg gave substance to Lincoln's Emancipation Proclamation. Without those victories, Lincoln's executive order would, in the long run, have proved worthless. These battles ensured the end of slavery in the U.S. As such, these two Union victories should be commemorated on this sesquicentennial, the 4th of July, 2013, in conjunction with celebrating the anniversary of the founding of this great nation.

@ Jackie: Like Lee, Grant employed the same tactics at Vicksburg, 1863, and at Cold Harbor: May-June 1864 -- almost a full year after Pickett's forlorn charge. Grant would later comment that his decision to make a frontal assault at Cold Harbor was one of his greatest mistakes. It was certainly one of his most costly in terms of lives lost by the Union.

[Whirlaway]

Watch live commemorative coverage of Gettysburg here (20 hours of live stream from Seminary Ridge; Pickett's charge 11 to 5 pm. Wed.) :


http://www.breitbart.com/Breitbart-T...burg-150-Years


You won't find any liberal/progressive media outlets providing this coverage...they hate America's nobel history.

[EXTXOILMAN]

I have been to Gettysburg and Vicksburg several times each, plus countless other stops at Civil War sites, going back to when I was a kid. Was at Gettysburg two years ago again, and walked away just as awed and humbled by what happened there as the first time my Dad took me 35 years ago.

[cptjohnstone]

I took my first visit to Gettysburg 50 years ago plus a couple of weeks. I have been to Vicksburg and Atlanta where they have surround painting of the last days of Atlanta. I remember in the tour one of the rangers pointed out on one foggy night the Confederate patrol missed a small opening between the rocks which lead to the Union supply trains

I have several computer games

If you want to know more watch Ken Burns The Civil War, best documentary ever

[Chica Chaser]

Moved to Sandbox, non-political thread.
Don't make it into one

[chefnerd]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

Not knowing how/when slavery would have been ended (without war) makes me certain that the Civil War was a war that had to be fought.

Unfortunately, the post war policies of Reconstruction were an unnecessary evil on the southern states.

Correct, the policies and actions of the "Radical Republicans gave the South back to the "Conservatives" aka the Democrats for roughly speaking a century.

[Whirlaway]

More importantly, and antoginizing, Reconstruction placed the southern States under military control.

Pres Johnson, a democrat, opposed reconstruction, and favored quick reunification of confederate States. Johnson's restoration plan didn't provide protections to the newly freed slaves ; which the "radical Republicans " thought was necessary....given the largely democratic slave holding south's history of racial hatred and violence.

Originally Posted by chefnerd

Correct, the policies and actions of the "Radical Republicans gave the South back to the "Conservatives" aka the Democrats for roughly speaking a century.

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by Whirlaway

Unfortunately, the post war policies of Reconstruction were an unnecessary evil on the southern states.

Then the South should have won the war if they didn't want to deal with the fall out of owning people and then starting a war to maintain that right. Of course the other option was to not have started the war in the first place.