Just Let him Die..!

[Sensia]

I think some things that the present candidates have said have blown me away in their debates. Lacking total empathy for our fellow Americans and it seems they have an audience to. I think it is a disgrace to say "lets refund the social security to people, scrap SS and tell people your on your own", I also think we do not need to back track to the days where poor people died in their homes and on the streets because they had no money to go to the hospital or get care for long term illnesses.

This is what I call being completely out of touch with reality and having no empathy or compassion what so ever. Are we turning into greedy selfish people in this country?

LET HIM DIE VIDEO

What about the innocent who get caught up in the legal system? I am a Texan and do not feel the same way as these people in the video or concerning Rick Perry's way of handling death row inmates who might be innocent.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908...11564#44511564

And.. with Michelle Bachman making a false claim that the HPV vaccine causes mental retardation.. wtf?

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by Guilty Pleasures

I think some things that the present candidates have said have blown me away in their debates. Lacking total empathy for our fellow Americans and it seems they have an audience to. I think it is a disgrace to say "lets refund the social security to people, scrap SS and tell people your on your own", I also think we do not need to back track to the days where poor people died in their homes and on the streets because they had no money to go to the hospital or get care for long term illnesses.

This is what I call being completely out of touch with reality and having no empathy or compassion what so ever. Are we turning into greedy selfish people in this country?

+1

I agree with you totally, the rhetoric is quite disturbing. Sometimes, I shake my head in disbelief at some of the things they say!
For an American to say, let a fellow American die. Wow, that is friggin' unbelievable! It is an open and shut case of misplaced priorities!

[CuteOldGuy]

Wolf Blitzer was the one who said "Let him die." None of the candidates supported that. Republicans say enough stupid things on their own, but they didn't say this one.

[Sensia]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Wolf Blitzer was the one who said "Let him die." None of the candidates supported that. Republicans say enough stupid things on their own, but they didn't say this one.

No the question in the debate was would you let him die if .. and the audience cheered the idea that the government should let an uninsured person die. "Congressman Ron Paul (R-Texas) suggested that making one's own choices, including whether to buy health insurance or risk your life, is "what freedom is all about." He went on to say that it is an individuals responsibility to obtain health insurance, but he didn't address the issue of the millions of Americans who cannot afford it, as if to say or insinuate a poor person is irresponsible therefore they are shit out of luck if they end up with a terminal or life threatening illness, etc. He should have immediately condemned the people in the audience for such a thing in my opinion. But he did not.

The thing that I found disturbing is not one of the those candidates addressed the comments in the crowd to condemn that kind of thinking.

"Does this crowd or Congressman Paul really believe that most people who can afford health insurance choose instead to go without it? Has it been that long since they sat at an American kitchen table and tried to figure out how to keep their benefits after a layoff? Or how to get care when they've never had insurance, ever? Or even how to schedule an appointment with an overbooked doctor in an HMO system?Do they seriously not know anyone who has struggled with those questions, even if they themselves have not?"

[Whirlaway]

The big lie........the audience cheered Ron Paul's statement of individuals being responsible, prepared and accepting the requirements of a free society; It is misleading to say they cheered Blitzer's "let him die" question.

Originally Posted by Guilty Pleasures

No the question in the debate was would you let him die if .. and the audience cheered the idea that the government should let an uninsured person die. "Congressman Ron Paul (R-Texas) suggested that making one's own choices, including whether to buy health insurance or risk your life, is "what freedom is all about." He went on to say that it is an individuals responsibility to obtain health insurance, but he didn't address the issue of the millions of Americans who cannot afford it, as if to say or insinuate a poor person is irresponsible therefore they are shit out of luck if they end up with a terminal or life threatening illness, etc. He should have immediately condemned the people in the audience for such a thing in my opinion. But he did not.

The thing that I found disturbing is not one of the those candidates addressed the comments in the crowd to condemn that kind of thinking.

"Does this crowd or Congressman Paul really believe that most people who can afford health insurance choose instead to go without it? Has it been that long since they sat at an American kitchen table and tried to figure out how to keep their benefits after a layoff? Or how to get care when they've never had insurance, ever? Or even how to schedule an appointment with an overbooked doctor in an HMO system?Do they seriously not know anyone who has struggled with those questions, even if they themselves have not?"

[Sensia]

You obviously did not watch the debate I quote "but congressman, are you saying that society should just let him die? [Audience] Yea! yes! cheer.. applaud.."

Yes they did cheer the concept of just letting a fellow American die who did not have health insurance.

Watch it for yourself here is the replay:
http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_new...ah-let-him-die

[wellendowed1911]

Originally Posted by Guilty Pleasures

You obviously did not watch the debate I quote "but congressman, are you saying that society should just let him die? [Audience] Yea! yes! cheer.. applaud.."

Yes they did cheer the concept of just letting a fellow American die who did not have health insurance.

Watch it for yourself here is the replay:
http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_new...ah-let-him-die

Guilty- you are correct +10000000 for you- Whirlway only wants to hear what he wants to hear- that was very sickening to hear someone cheer in that manner- also I guess Whirlway didn't hear the round of applause when Perry talked about his great "execution" rate in the State of Texas and the crowd cheered- when someone gets the Death penalty I don't cheer- that's sickening and trust me- I am almost certain there have been plenty of innocent people executed- so it's nothing to cheer about. Whirlway- have you noticed the ethnic make up at the GOP debates??? Compare them to the audience when Obama makes his speeches- let's see at the GOP debates- would I be correct and say it's 99% white and 1% other? At Obama rallies- there's every ethnic group you can imagine- nice melting pot- can you tell me which one represents America more?
Also, you noticed that neither Bachman or Paul answered the question who should pay- they both danced around the question.

[Whirlaway]

You are being deceitful in saying "the audience cheered"...yes at 0.50 seconds a sigfnicant level of the audience cheered Ron Paul's statement on freedom and responsibility; then at 1.05 a few (very few members in the audience ) yelled out in support of letting him die. There was no cheer..applaud as you claim !....for you to say that the audience cheered" "applaud" is flat out decietful...why did you make such a false claim when you could have been more accurate in saying a few in the audience?........

Originally Posted by Guilty Pleasures

You obviously did not watch the debate I quote "but congressman, are you saying that society should just let him die? [Audience] Yea! yes! cheer.. applaud.."

Yes they did cheer the concept of just letting a fellow American die who did not have health insurance.

Watch it for yourself here is the replay:
http://maddowblog.msnbc.msn.com/_new...ah-let-him-die

[blue3122]

The basic question here is "Who is responsible for your bad decisions?" Are you? Or is the rest of the society including the government? It is one thing to not be able to afford insurance for basic health care. It is quite another thing to be able to afford it and make your own choice to not buy it. Sort of like a seatbelt. Whose responsibility is it if an individual makes a choice not to wear a seatbelt? Or not to hold on to the handrails. This is where you can get into rationality of decision making (Becker has a Nobel for this. NO, not Becker on TV).

I have been looking since Clinton brought it up the first time and I still can't find anywhere in the Constitution where healthcare is a right.

[wellendowed1911]

Originally Posted by blue3122

The basic question here is "Who is responsible for your bad decisions?" Are you? Or is the rest of the society including the government? It is one thing to not be able to afford insurance for basic health care. It is quite another thing to be able to afford it and make your own choice to not buy it. Sort of like a seatbelt. Whose responsibility is it if an individual makes a choice not to wear a seatbelt? Or not to hold on to the handrails. This is where you can get into rationality of decision making (Becker has a Nobel for this. NO, not Becker on TV).

I have been looking since Clinton brought it up the first time and I still can't find anywhere in the Constitution where healthcare is a right.

The fact of the matter is he's a human being- let's say some lady wears some scantly clothes 2am in the morning in a rough neighborhood is it her fault if she gets raped because she didn't have any protection with her- she was in a bad area and wearing scantly clothing???
Or if I were driving through that area and I see some man dying in the street because he got mugged and nearly beaten to death- he made the decision to walk in that "bad" area so should I just say "fuck him" it's not my responsibility to render him help????? I can give you a million scenarios- and the ironic thing is that Republicans label themselves as "Christians". Did not Jesus heal sinners and just people- show me a verse in the Bible where Jesus refused to help someone because they weren't a follower or "holy"?

[blue3122]

Excuse me small endowed. I didn't realize I was talking to Jesus.
A "mistake" is driving/walking in a bad neighborhood when you don't know the area. Going into a bad neighborhood when you know is a choice. Not buying insurance when you can afford it is a choice. I would recommend palliative care. Can you show me the guaranteed healthcare clause in the Constitution please?

[TexanAtPlay]

Originally Posted by Guilty Pleasures

I think some things that the present candidates have said have blown me away in their debates. Lacking total empathy for our fellow Americans and it seems they have an audience to. I think it is a disgrace to say "lets refund the social security to people, scrap SS and tell people your on your own", I also think we do not need to back track to the days where poor people died in their homes and on the streets because they had no money to go to the hospital or get care for long term illnesses.

This is what I call being completely out of touch with reality and having no empathy or compassion what so ever. Are we turning into greedy selfish people in this country?

LET HIM DIE VIDEO

What about the innocent who get caught up in the legal system? I am a Texan and do not feel the same way as these people in the video or concerning Rick Perry's way of handling death row inmates who might be innocent.

http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/26315908...11564#44511564

And.. with Michelle Bachman making a false claim that the HPV vaccine causes mental retardation.. wtf?

Just because some of us believe that Social Security in its present form is ILLEGAL doesn't mean that we are against a safety net. The left and their sympathizers can't see anything other than if you are against the program, you're for grandma starving to death -- but that's Alinskyite posturing...it's in their core.

If you want a welfare state....then call a Constitutional Convention and propose amendments or even a whole new Constitution....get 3/4th of the States to ratify...and you can have anything you want. Why aren't the left-wingers proposing my solution? Because they know they'd never even get 1/3rd of the States ratifying it.

Article I Section VIII of the United States Constitution specifies the specific items which Congress may fund as these items are in the general welfare (as stated in the PREAMBLE). All OTHER Programs and Powers are reserved to the people or to the individual States. Then again...that one didn't get printed in the Pocket Constitutions of Democratic Party lawmakers and Executive Branch Czars.

If you want a social security program....it has to be administered by the State. If multiple States band together and offer a "regional" plan....that would certainly pass Constitutional muster.

Same with Medicare/Medicaid....the STATES should run and fund it within their States. So State taxes go up....but the National taxes must go down to compensate.

And finally....if the young man made bad choices and ended up declining insurance he should have kept......it's not my responsibility to bail him out. I don't appreciate money being confiscated from me to take care of his irresponsibility. Therefore....he very well COULD die. And I would not lose any sleep over it. Because HE made his own choices.....it didn't work out....It's like putting your last chips on black in Vegas....and RED comes up.

That question is a trap from the left, because the correct answer is the answer they use to further demonize you.

I have one for the left....how much money or assets should any one person be "allowed" to keep? They demonize profits and wealth, even though it funds their safety net and their pork programs. I want their supporters to tell us...if they feel that way, then how much is enough?

Another one for the left...how many kids should a welfare queen be allowed to birth while not supporting herself? At what age is a child no longer a child? For insurance purposes now....it's 26. Do you think that people who believe that profits are good should be "reeducated" to support Socialist thinking? If you had a free hand to decapitate your opposition, would you? (Yes, they WOULD....it was a DEMOCRATIC president who put 110,000 Americans into Concentration Camps....)

Bring back Constitutional government. The mistake made is that nobody except maybe Texans, see their states as individual little republics. But each State joined a voluntary union as a sovereign political entity...and is an independent nation in its own right. Once we start treating it that way, then we'll be on the road to fixing this mess.

You just can't do something on the basis it "helps" someone. There is no basis for the crop of welfare programs.

[Whirlaway]

+1 TexanatPlay.

[CPT Savajo]

Ron Paul was correct for saying what he did in reference to the hypothetical medical question. The 30yr old has the freedom of choice if he wants insurance or not and who's to say that he didn't have insurance through is employer. Blitzer construed that question to his liking. Most of those political hacks are trying to become Ron Paul and will say anything that pleases the crowd. He's just speaking the truth and it's a fact that there are too many people dependent on big government to save them. There's so many wildcards in the health care arena that candidates can't cover the whole are in a small debate. What if the patient was a 3 year old kid instead of a 30 year old man!

Republican crowds are a warmongering bunch, democrats are the same just look at the thousands of dead bodies in Libya. There is no lesser of the two evils. The people in the crowd that shouted, "let him die" acted on their own. Ron Paul was a doctor and many people don't know that. He's the only candidate up there who actually has a spine!

Social security should be scrapped for the upcoming generations of Americans. It should be given to the older Americans who have paid in their whole life. Social security is a busted plan!!! IF I WAS GIVEN THE OPTION TO GET OUT OF SOCIAL SECURITY I WOULD OPT OUT IMMEDIATELY BECAUSE I WOULD RATHER HAVE THE FIAT CURRENCY IN MY POCKET, THAN THE GOVERNMENT GETTING IT. SCRAP MY MEDICARE PAYMENTS TOO! THEN MAYBE AMERICANS COULD GO OUT AND GET HEALTH INSURANCE. SOCIAL SECURITY AND MEDICARE ARE GOVERNMENT THEFT PROGRAMS AND THEY STINK!!! I HATE THE FACT THAT I HAD TO PAY INTO ANY OF THOSE FAILED PROGRAMS AND I BELIEVE THATS HOW MANY AMERICANS FEEL ABOUT IT.

Plus I know how to manage my money better than a lot of the people out there. I don't need or want the government having any of my money. I can manage it a WHOLE LOT BETTER THAN THEY CAN. PEOPLE WHO ARE ONLY RELYING ON SOCIAL SECURITY TO TAKE CARE OF THEM ARE PRETTY MUCH FUCKED TO BE HONEST BECAUSE THAT TELLS ME THEY HAVE (NO PLAN FOR RETIREMENT)! THATS SCARY IN THIS DAY AND AGE! But it's the truth!

Social Security is an old industrial age plan, wasn't it formed in the 1930's? 1930's plans aren't going to work that well in the information age with higher inflation! The government needs to be downsized and they need to scrap a lot of those federal departments.

The thing that pissed me off the most about the CNN TEA PARTY DEBATE is that Wolf Blitzer snubbed Ron Paul by NOT letting him answer the question pertaining to the federal reserve!!! That was bullshit, the man who's been preaching about what it's been doing to our economy for over 30 years got totally ignored!

[Laz]

Ron Paul also stated that when he was a doctor people in need were provided help through charitable organizations. He never said that he believed people should not be assisted.

The core delimma in this discussion is when does ones persons lack of personal responsibility become societies responsibility as a whole. If we expect the federal government to be our parent and take care of us regardless of our own behavior then you had better expect massive government intrusion in your life. You can also expect very poor assistance because the government has never demonstrated the ability to do anything well.