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The discussion has degenerated into a nothingburger
I wonder how the families of the hundreds of thousands of dead Ukrainian and Russian soldiers, or future casualties, feel about it being a nothing burger.?
I wonder how the families of the hundreds of thousands of dead Ukrainian and Russian soldiers, or future casualties, feel about it being a nothing burger.?
Russia can end the war tomorrow by pulling its forces home. The deaths would stop immediately. Russia has complete control over the continuation of the war.
Russia can end the war tomorrow by pulling its forces home. The deaths would stop immediately. Russia has complete control over the continuation of the war.
Russia can end the war tomorrow by pulling its forces home. The deaths would stop immediately. Russia has complete control over the continuation of the war.
So could Ukraine, by letting the people of the region determine their own future.
So if people in southwest Texas decide to join Mexico, we should let them do so? What about if Mexico invades South Texas, do we let them have a vote about their future? Righties say the dumbest shit.
Bold print - Yes, James Baker was one of the slickest lawyers ever to come out of Texas, and indeed didn't put that in writing. But Baker and a number of other American, European and Canadian politicians and diplomats made similar assurances. I posted a great link on that, and will repost again here,
yep good read of what actually happened and what was promised. and defending Ukraine wasn't part of it.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1blackman1
Trump is Putin’s bitch. Some things never change. Tiny appears to be a dove that’s ok with Russian expansion through force. Folks on the right are Russian apologists and propagandists.
It’s a war that’s started by a Russian invasion. Folks are fighting and the Ukrainians are fighting valiantly dying for their country against Russian and Korean troops. They’ve held 80% of their country after a full scale invasion that initially threatened Kyiv. They’ve even attacked into Russia. Strategically they’ve achieved more than anyone expected 3 years ago.
Russia can end their invasion at any moment by going home. They won’t. They’re the aggressor. Trump and the Trumpys are pussies dicklicking Russia and Putin.
The US has expenddd 170m or so providing weapons to Ukraine, and Europe has spent about 150m (actually European financial support has significantly gone to US companies through weapon purchases so the US actually benefits there).
We should provide whatever aid we can in weapons and technology and logistical support to help Ukraine drive Russia from their land.
It is to our benefit to keep Ukraine out of Russian control.
If Israel was trying to reclaim their borders after being invaded would we tell them to just cede the territory to Iran as long as they were willing to keep fighting?
you and others always claim Trump is Putin's bitch without any validity except far left outrage at Trump's comments with Putin.
you and others always claim if you don't support Ukraine you are pro Russia MAGA supporters and Trump cult members.
Just look at the timeline. Putin takes Crimea with Obama in office. Putin invades Ukraine with the senile Joe in office (after Joe said on national television that a "small incursion" would be okay). Noticing not one invasion or any taking of land under Trump. Telling....
Just look at the timeline. Putin takes Crimea with Obama in office. Putin invades Ukraine with the senile Joe in office (after Joe said on national television that a "small incursion" would be okay). Noticing not one invasion or any taking of land under Trump. Telling....
You are forgetting, that the Lefts hatred for President Trump outweighs all other considerations, even recognizing the truth in your post.
Can any of you Trump jock sniffers follow a topic without going all over the damn place when VP Trump is mentioned in a negative light?
The topic is basically stupid ass Trump placing blame on Ukraine for their war and its continuation. That is the damn topic.
If someone breaks into your damn house to take it, would you broker a deal to give them a valuable part of it so that they will leave, or would you try to blow their fucking head off to make them leave even though they are stronger than you? According to Trump, you should negotiate with those unwanted and uninvited intruders.
Donald Trump has taken aim at Ukraine after its president, Volodymyr Zelensky, said it was a "surprise" that his country was not invited to peace talks in Saudi Arabia to end the Ukraine war.
Trump said he was "disappointed" by Ukraine's reaction and appeared to blame Ukraine for starting the war - saying the country "could have made a deal".
The war in Ukraine was sparked by a full-scale Russian invasion almost three years ago.
By the way, he is also filmed talking about this. I just wanted to give an FYI before some of you old Trump loving simpletons try to discredit the source of the link I provided.
Wonder why he was surprised. Guess that means he'd have no problem if other people divested his properties and interest without him having a say before he entered office like he was suppose to.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaMan
Make a deal with Russia ? No matter if Trump said that, or someone else.
The reality goes back to President Reagan: "Russia is the focus of evil in the modern word."
Russia is known for its false flag operations. They may have invented it. Putin kills anyone in sight who threatens
his power. NATO is well known as a security and defense organization, not an entity that would attack anyone.
But Russia has to invade Ukraine, because if Ukraine joins NATO, they won't be able to invade any longer.....make sense to anyone ?
Putin is famous for his false flag moves. Even moreso the "gifts" he gets on his birthday. Past presents have been the assassination of political enemies. Ima sure he really wanted Ukraine to be a big cherry for the topping of one of the celebrations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by pertpvyztrzv
Like Kosovo 1999? Not part of NATO, but had to get involved.
Afghanistan 2001 was a NATO thing.
Iraq 2004, Libya 2011, Syria 2010.
While NATO was originally formed as a defensive alliance, these actions show a pattern of OFFENSIVE Military interventions, regime change and "Humanitarian wars". unquote.
Yea, NATO's only for defense, until it's not.
Yeah. USA shouldn't have been part of the Bosnian affair (as i've said repeatedly and given reason why.)
9/11 made Afganistan a target. NATO or not.
Iraq definitely was "They can't do that to Daddy" by W. Kuwait was the go though.
Don't go bombing nightclubs with USA soldiers/citizens and you won't have a problem.
And we never had an interest in Syria. Still don't except one of the above situations.
Quote:
Originally Posted by 69in2it69
I'd give Ukraine a bunch of nukes and see if Puddin wanted to re-negotiate the Budapest Memorandum...
Didn't they use to have alot? I do remember Russia giving alot of fissionable material to the USA during the turbulent times with fear of a terrorist group getting their hands on it because the nukes security became lax during troubled times.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaMan
Trump blaming Ukraine for the conflict ? Saying they should have made a deal 3 years ago with Russia ?
At what cost........giving away part of Ukraine to the Russians ? That sounds like Trump bullying tactics by the Russians.....the #1 section of the Trump playbook.
Trump's big thing is deporting illegal aliens. How about if someone made an offer to take part of the USA in exchange for stopping illegal aliens from crossing the "new" border ?
Trump is becoming more unhinged every day.
To be frank, I really don't know what caused donny to be so interested in Ukraine. But I sure know Puntins...
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lantern2814
Correct. NATO was originally formed for protection against the Soviet Union. Which no longer exists. THE American people don't want another Afghanistan. If not for the usual Washington suspects, this could have been ended long ago.
...and that is he wants to go back to the days of the USSR. With Russia controlling all the vassel countries. He took that lead from the Chinese Premier. That guy doesn't let ANYTHING get away from him. And he is trying to expand. That is what Putin wants.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaMan
To say that Ukraine is responsible for Russian troops crossing their border is the biggest pile of the year.
The only way I can see that Ukraine caused the invasion was their active roll in showing how passive they were and would not fire a shot first. Putin was going in anyway to satisfy some believe of a Greater Russia/USSR.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Tiny
Actually Russian nationalist militias started operating in Donbas without Russian government approval initially. Government support came later. It was a case of the tail wagging the dog.
So true. Don't know if Putin had a hand in it behind the scenes.
Quote:
Originally Posted by tman1847
Just another ”No Balls” Biden Fuck Up. Remember the beginning when he stated his sanctions would stop the Russians, lol they attacked the next day. Then he spread the sanctions out over years, delayed tanks, armored vehicles and F-16’s. The agenda news bragged about Joe Biden’s foreign policy expertise. And we have wars all over the planet. Joe Biden had 4 years to fix the mess he helped create. Forget the recent agenda news reports and give Trump sometime to fix this. If he kisses Putin ass, screws over Ukraine then criticize and point a finger
Definitely dragged his feet on a few things. Tried to make up for it later.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RX792P
Trump's first term
Trump has denied all wrongdoing. He confirmed that he had withheld aid from Ukraine, while offering contradicting reasons for doing so. Trump first claimed it was withheld because of corruption in Ukraine, but later said it was because other nations, including those in Europe, were not contributing enough aid to Ukraine. European Union institutions provided more than twice the amount of aid to Ukraine than did the United States during 2016-17, and Trump's budget proposal sought to cut billions of dollars from U.S. initiatives to fight corruption and encourage reform in Ukraine and elsewhere.
And now a guy with an ulterior interest is here trying to call the shots. Hmmm. Like the fox guarding the hen house.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacuzzme
Is there ANYONE not controlled by Raytheon or Pfizer?
So ask the guy with the avatar of a person who is definitely being controlled for his own self interest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacky S
The prevailing question should be……”How many more young Russian and Ukrainian’s have to die to satisfy the ego’s of both parties”?
President Trump’s first objective is to stop the killing.
The major arms suppliers on either side could care less, as long as they are getting killed with their weapons.
Oh, I don't think that is donnys first interest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by RX792P
Not sure Trump/Vance claims about Ukraine starting the war and Zelensky's dictatorship are as quite as successful as they would like
'You can fool some of the people all the time, and you can fool all of the people some of the time...you can't fool all of the people all of the time' (the last part is hopefully)
The new YouGov poll found that 61 percent of U.S. adults think Russia started the conflict in Eastern Europe that has been raging for nearly three years. Some six percent said Ukraine was the one to kick it off.
Around 15 percent of respondents blamed both sides equally while 18 percent were not sure, the poll found.
Nearly half of Americans, 45 percent, do not think that Ukraine’s president is a dictator. Around 22 percent think that he is while a third of respondents were not sure, according to the survey.
Glad people who took the poll remembered Zelenski going out of his way not to come off as threatening while Russia built up forces behind their border.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lucas McCain
Yeah. I thought 1b1's thread topic was simple enough to understand and stick to, but I guess not. LOL
And as the usual maggies, they have to push their own agenda going off topic.
Quote:
Originally Posted by VitaMan
I am talking about the degeneration of this discussion. I doubt the families of the above have any feelings about this thread.
Absence of empathy is a classic maggie trait. Multiple examples of such.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacuzzme
So could Ukraine, by letting the people of the region determine their own future.
You're about to be slapped....
Quote:
Originally Posted by 1blackman1
So if people in southwest Texas decide to join Mexico, we should let them do so? What about if Mexico invades South Texas, do we let them have a vote about their future? Righties say the dumbest shit.
It is up to a country how to take care of their own inner border interest.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacuzzme
Better than killing them.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Lantern2814
Just look at the timeline. Putin takes Crimea with Obama in office. Putin invades Ukraine with the senile Joe in office (after Joe said on national television that a "small incursion" would be okay). Noticing not one invasion or any taking of land under Trump. Telling....
I noticed that donny didn't honour his campaign promise of stomping it out day 1, even after I spotted him 6 days.
And seeing that it is still going on, he is doing his typical thing, trying to save face.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Jacky S
You are forgetting, that the Lefts hatred for President Trump outweighs all other considerations, even recognizing the truth in your post.
