The Local Hobby Scene - perpetual thread

[berryberry]

Originally Posted by livermore

Curious, what’s the record for longest thread in coed discussions?

Oh the one on whether Jinny was on social security went on for 70 some pages I believe. But that one veered off topic into anything and everything. if you count the pages from the closed thread and this one, we are half way there

I bet though if that social security thread was started today, you could find several Pgh hos who would qualify

[berryberry]

Originally Posted by blkstocking

Yes, honesty would have been, hey, dont give me your cash cause we are shutting down would have been nice. Requesting honor is not bullying.

Indeed it would have. But I haven't known many grifters with honor and basic human decency, have you?

[berryberry]

Originally Posted by blkstocking

But that said...other markets dont have the same problem to the same degree. A well run agency will make bank here.

Yeah, that is the real kicker. Other markets don't have the same problem to the same degree as Pittsburgh. I think part of the reason is you had a provider controlled board here in Indys which hurt the hobby So between as Laserface noted:

- groups like "Local 250" who wanted to manipulate the hobby economy by driving up rates, and driving down expectations on level of service. and

-The same groups doing whatever they could to discourage "outside" providers from visiting the area and taking a bite out of the income of local providers including having their allies book a visiting provider's calendar solid before she ever even got here - and then when she finally arrived, all NS/NC her, en masse... and

- controlling what could be said on the Indy's board with respect to negative service, turning a whole group of guys who solely used that sight into useless wusses who just accepted bad service, and higher manipulated rates

That now if those same Indy's guys are around, they just don't know any better so some still see the same overpriced, poor service, old Indy's options who have no accountability. Travelers still remember the poor reputation of Pgh from the provider driven cancellation scams and thus many don't visit. And new girls breaking into the hobby may just go on SA where there also is no accountability and limited visibility

[bkfantasy]

I sometimes use a VPN. When I access the well-known advertising platforms, by default I get advertisements for whatever city my VPN says I am in. Trust me when I say, the pickings are uniquely slim here. Makes me cry a little when I see the advertisements for Montreal.

[bambino]

Originally Posted by bkfantasy

I sometimes use a VPN. When I access the well-known advertising platforms, by default I get advertisements for whatever city my VPN says I am in. Trust me when I say, the pickings are uniquely slim here. Makes me cry a little when I see the advertisements for Montreal.

One of my best hobby experiences happened in a Montreal strip club. I tipped a bouncer $20 and asked him to hook me up with the best. He brought twins to my table. Hot AF blond French Canadians. We went to a private room. Damn, that was off the charts fun. It was a bargain at 2 Hundo.

[blkstocking]

I do miss regular travel across the border. Chicago, Dallas, KC, and other midwest cities are great. Better than LA but boy are they hot. NYC, Mami and DC have all the freak you could muster. Paris, London, Rome, Madrid serviced by the most professional high class agencies I have experienced. Then there is Amsterdam.... like a hunting experience with gold in every window.


Then... Pittsburgh. Yuck.

[bambino]

Originally Posted by blkstocking

I do miss regular travel across the border. Chicago, Dallas, KC, and other midwest cities are great. Better than LA but boy are they hot. NYC, Mami and DC have all the freak you could muster. Paris, London, Rome, Madrid serviced by the most professional high class agencies I have experienced. Then there is Amsterdam.... like a hunting experience with gold in every window.


Then... Pittsburgh. Yuck.

Well, fortunately I had a great run. I was gearing back a few years ago anyway. But geez, I still like to see a hottie now and then. But there isn’t any.

[tannana]

Originally Posted by Dreamgurrl

The fact that you think Indys was profitable is HILARIOUS.

Before the old (original) site was nuked and every time there was a "crackdown" (paying for the guys room, for instance) it was possible to see who'd been dropped into what group, and relatively easy to count them (this was like so many other things on that platform--the modifications had no security baked in. None). Or, in english, to see who was in the god group, the mods group, and the various groups within the software meant to associate ability with what one had earned or paid for. After the last shakedown scam on paying for guys access, I counted the number of folks who seem to have paid, took a 10% discount for folks I figured kissed the ass of someone with admin privs, and multiplied that number by the $50 it supposedly cost. The resultant number would've carried the site the way it was configured at the host it was running on for longer than it remained there. I assume no other monitization on the plus side of the ledger and also assume that PI's time, Mallory's time, your time, and whomever else actually had creds time during the last bit on the old platform had an actual cost of 0, which given the shinnanegans used to either increase one's own business or impede others which was happening by folks with creds had a monetary return of 0, which is also untrue--it conveyed competitive and monetary advantage.



Or, on the basis of an even relatively informed swag, I'm pretty confident in saying that isn't true as it pertained to "pre-Dolphin" indys. At one point, it very much should have been profitable and I'm almost certainly, to someone, was.



After that? I didn't have enough crack at the re-launched re-platform to make any particularly astute observations. But, I guess what I would wonder is why one would hit a bank up for a chargeback rather than having the expectation that the operator might refund monies for services not rendered? And, to the extent that there was any population who could or did pay with some other form of payment (these would be the smart ones who didn't give up their real credit card info), how do they get theirs?


(I'd love to know if it was the hosting or the services on the dolphin install which ruined the model. I'm betting it was keeping it running, right? Because for a long time, PI got tech help and all manner of free labor from a few people, Mallory particularly, so you likely had to pay to make that deficit up, and I'll bet the numbers wouldn't work and really wouldn't work once you risk adjusted them for FOSTA. ).


The short version: the "pre-migration" Indys was likely profitable due to the payments and the donated time of the original OH modifying nerds, Mal, you (I don't list PI as I assume that's where the profit went). Dunno if your edition was or wasn't, but I do commend you on having it secured to the point where one would have to do actual illegal things to it to find out.

[berryberry]

Originally Posted by tannana

Before the old (original) site was nuked and every time there was a "crackdown" (paying for the guys room, for instance) it was possible to see who'd been dropped into what group, and relatively easy to count them (this was like so many other things on that platform--the modifications had no security baked in. None). Or, in english, to see who was in the god group, the mods group, and the various groups within the software meant to associate ability with what one had earned or paid for. After the last shakedown scam on paying for guys access, I counted the number of folks who seem to have paid, took a 10% discount for folks I figured kissed the ass of someone with admin privs, and multiplied that number by the $50 it supposedly cost. The resultant number would've carried the site the way it was configured at the host it was running on for longer than it remained there. I assume no other monitization on the plus side of the ledger and also assume that PI's time, Mallory's time, your time, and whomever else actually had creds time during the last bit on the old platform had an actual cost of 0, which given the shinnanegans used to either increase one's own business or impede others which was happening by folks with creds had a monetary return of 0, which is also untrue--it conveyed competitive and monetary advantage.



Or, on the basis of an even relatively informed swag, I'm pretty confident in saying that isn't true as it pertained to "pre-Dolphin" indys. At one point, it very much should have been profitable and I'm almost certainly, to someone, was.



After that? I didn't have enough crack at the re-launched re-platform to make any particularly astute observations. But, I guess what I would wonder is why one would hit a bank up for a chargeback rather than having the expectation that the operator might refund monies for services not rendered? And, to the extent that there was any population who could or did pay with some other form of payment (these would be the smart ones who didn't give up their real credit card info), how do they get theirs?


(I'd love to know if it was the hosting or the services on the dolphin install which ruined the model. I'm betting it was keeping it running, right? Because for a long time, PI got tech help and all manner of free labor from a few people, Mallory particularly, so you likely had to pay to make that deficit up, and I'll bet the numbers wouldn't work and really wouldn't work once you risk adjusted them for FOSTA. ).


The short version: the "pre-migration" Indys was likely profitable due to the payments and the donated time of the original OH modifying nerds, Mal, you (I don't list PI as I assume that's where the profit went). Dunno if your edition was or wasn't, but I do commend you on having it secured to the point where one would have to do actual illegal things to it to find out.

And your swag was only based on the $50 guys room access scam. Didn't they also had revenue come in from higher priced Silver Mine memberships? And correct me if I am wrong but didn't they have banner ads or things of that sort too that generated money. And then of course the free services the pimp who ran it solicited from some of the women there in exchange for favorable treatment on the site

Yeah, they made money and the grifters pocketed it

[Dreamgurrl]

COMPLETELY unrelated and TOTALLY off topic:
Does anyone know how to fix a broken record? Throw it in the trash? Just curious

Sorry for deviating from the original topic.

[bambino]

Actually, MMD was the tech mastermind behind Indys. They used a template that cost nothing. Eccie could use it. They should. It’s a better platform. PI was a flunky car detailer before Indys. So yes, PI made plenty of cash running Indys. I don’t blame him for making a buck. But, as sociopaths do, he fucked it up. Mallory was just a pawn in the scheme of things. And PI fucked her over. She tried to hold it together. Then PI bequeathed it to DG. It quickly went down the drain. But she pulled some cash while she could. She did buy a Denali after the Xmas GTG. Bravo!

[zip2121]

Originally Posted by berryberry

Yeah, that is the real kicker. Other markets don't have the same problem to the same degree as Pittsburgh. I think part of the reason is you had a provider controlled board here in Indys which hurt the hobby So between as Laserface noted:

- groups like "Local 250" who wanted to manipulate the hobby economy by driving up rates, and driving down expectations on level of service. and

-The same groups doing whatever they could to discourage "outside" providers from visiting the area and taking a bite out of the income of local providers including having their allies book a visiting provider's calendar solid before she ever even got here - and then when she finally arrived, all NS/NC her, en masse... and

- controlling what could be said on the Indy's board with respect to negative service, turning a whole group of guys who solely used that sight into useless wusses who just accepted bad service, and higher manipulated rates

That now if those same Indy's guys are around, they just don't know any better so some still see the same overpriced, poor service, old Indy's options who have no accountability. Travelers still remember the poor reputation of Pgh from the provider driven cancellation scams and thus many don't visit. And new girls breaking into the hobby may just go on SA where there also is no accountability and limited visibility

Was over in Columbus last week. Lots of legit reviewed girls, listing reasonable prices. I picked one that wasn't... However that's on me. Did not see gps on display even on LC. Girls I texted got back within a few minutes, and had a pick of who to go with.

Here in the burg, the only ones that get back are sketchy. SW girls, 3 I've seen in the last month, are rare, and want to rush you (gonna cum soon? Right after putting it in their mouth).

Couple girls that do text back here all wanted 150 plus for hr. Shit, so do I girls, so do I. Put down the quarantine feed bucket, tone up, and maybe we talk.

Ffs. This town is horrible. I should have moved after college.

[sexymaid_69]

Originally Posted by berryberry

Oh the one on whether Jinny was on social security went on for 70 some pages I believe. But that one veered off topic into anything and everything. if you count the pages from the closed thread and this one, we are half way there

I bet though if that social security thread was started today, you could find several Pgh hos who would qualify

I had to address this statement.

I still don't qualify for SS, yet.

Yes, I am retired but that's just sitting there waiting for me to come of age.
And I don't mind adding that I can only think of a couple of ladies in the Pittsburgh area who are older than I.

I hope you don't mind my correcting your assumption.

Now,
Silver mine access on the site that was...

When it started ( pre-Dreamgirl days) I paid the then $250 fee for access in cash directly to "he who's name need not be said" at a gathering.
I got home.....no access???

I messaged him
I was informed that the cost had doubled. No prior announcement atall.

I paid the rest to a wonderful brunette and I had 1 year of access.

Maybe because it was so new but there was no advantage to it back then. The sm activity was almost as dead as the activity here gets.

And don't even get me started on that "featured" crap.

Again pre-Dreamgirl days...

Just a perspective from the other side.


It was a good thing when it started but as they say
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

[bambino]

Originally Posted by sexymaid_69

I had to address this statement.

I still don't qualify for SS, yet.

Yes, I am retired but that's just sitting there waiting for me to come of age.
And I don't mind adding that I can only think of a couple of ladies in the Pittsburgh area who are older than I.

I hope you don't mind my correcting your assumption.

Now,
Silver mine access on the site that was...

When it started ( pre-Dreamgirl days) I paid the then $250 fee for access in cash directly to "he who's name need not be said" at a gathering.
I got home.....no access???

I messaged him
I was informed that the cost had doubled. No prior announcement atall.

I paid the rest to a wonderful brunette and I had 1 year of access.

Maybe because it was so new but there was no advantage to it back then. The sm activity was almost as dead as the activity here gets.

And don't even get me started on that "featured" crap.

Again pre-Dreamgirl days...

Just a perspective from the other side.


It was a good thing when it started but as they say
Absolute power corrupts absolutely.

Well, PI did have a good thing going. Over 30,000 members. Who paid some type of fee. It doesn’t take a rocket scientist to know he was making good money. But he fucked it up because he was a fuck up. I’m curious why you’re giving DG a pass now? You didn’t a few years ago. Maybe you can explain?

[laserface]

Originally Posted by berryberry

The only thing I question is your conclusion when you said "I submit to you that, in many ways, gentlemen, we have met the enemy, and he is us...". But I question it because I think you can read that two ways. So could you clarify. If you mean:

* because guys have not held these providers accountable as they raised rates and provided mediocre service (so no one is holding them accountable),
* because some guys have acquiesced to the silly we need your life history, contact info for your employer and wife and children, etc etc so we can blackmail you if we want instead of just stopping seeing these providers so this dangerous practice ends
* because some guys have acquiesced to paying overpriced GPS rates for 40+ year old Hos with bad attitudes and so-so service

that we have become our own worst enemy, well I agree with you.

Some of all of the above, really. But it's a bit more than that.

As a community, we were pretty quick to crap all over the agency system once independent providers started to become established, with comments like "I ain't paying no pimp!" Ignoring that, as has otherwise been pointed out, having a middleman has some value as an accountability choke-point. There is only so much you can personally do to hold a provider accountable for poor behavior, poor service, or poor attitude. You can post a bad review - maybe people will see it, maybe they won't. You can personally decide to not see that provider anymore. But basically, they can keep on getting away with those behaviors indefinitely, or until enough hobbyists become aware that it affects their business. At which point, the provider changes her name and starts again (possibly with a boost, being perceived as an apparent "new girl"...). An agency owner will take action after a few complaints, and take the girl off the schedule if the complaints continue. Oh, and I wouldn't be paying a "pimp" either, because agency owners are not what most people think of when they think "pimp" (where the "pimp" takes all of the money, dribbles out some from time to time as the girl has needs, and basically controls her life - that's pretty despicable).

Oh - we did the above, unless it was convenient not to. As an example, I will cite He Who Shall Not Be Named in Shadyside... :-) Because he had the "hottest" girls in the area at the time, even though we all knew he treated them like crap (and he honestly didn't treat his customers much better). And yeah, I'm guilty there too - though in all honesty, I wouldn't have done so at all if I had not been able to bypass his incredibly intrusive screening process. That was probably selfish behavior.

Even with that dilute type of "accountability", we also had most of the means of accountability squelched because negative reviews were basically not allowed on Indys (they were almost never approved for publication), unless the provider involved was "unloved" somehow. And if you would post a negative review on another site, you ran the risk that basically *no one* who was Indys-based would even see you. We're all aware of a number of instances where a provider refused to schedule with someone, stating point-blank that it was because he'd posted negative reviews (of other providers) in the past. The influence of the Indys echo chamber extended beyond that site.

I also don't think we did enough to support the providers back during the "Local 250 Wars" that were evidencing the behaviors we actually wanted to see. I'm not sure exactly how we would have done that. But I'm sure we could have done more than we did.

I also do not forget that a number of hobbyists were complicit in all of this. The cancellation scams would never have worked if there wasn't a large enough number of hobbyists who would agree to play the game.