Illegal immigration...your thoughts

[runswithscissors]

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[onehitwonder]

Someone sent me a sweet note saying that they felt bad for me, wished me luck in getting some assistance with "Poot" (my baby) and to keep my head up. Very encouraging especially from a total stranger, to even take the time. How very kind. However they were a little disturbed by comments I made concerning my lack of education. And maybe there was a self asteem issue. I re-read my posts and it seems I may have came across as a bit self loathing. (see a smart girl word!I can fake it ocasionally) My self asteem is intact. As far as my education? It is what it is. My fault. And now I'm paying for that decision. Street smarts only take you so far.
The other women on this thread ( Dagney, Gia and Vicky Lyn) are well spoken and much more informed than myself. Hence the "out of my league" comment. I am to say the least, impressed(sp?) and a bit envious. Brains and beauty, how awesome is that? So I guess I just wanted y'all to know that about me so maybe you would take it easy on me : )


Respectfully, OHW

back on topic. Sorry to have strayed.

[rrrabbit]

Originally Posted by onehitwonder

Someone sent me a sweet note saying that they felt bad for me, wished me luck in getting some assistance with "Poot" (my baby) and to keep my head up. Very encouraging especially from a total stranger, to even take the time. How very kind. However they were a little disturbed by comments I made concerning my lack of education. And maybe there was a self asteem issue. I re-read my posts and it seems I may have came across as a bit self loathing. (see a smart girl word!I can fake it ocasionally) My self asteem is intact. As far as my education? It is what it is. My fault. And now I'm paying for that decision. Street smarts only take you so far.
The other women on this thread ( Dagney, Gia and Vicky Lyn) are well spoken and much more informed than myself. Hence the "out of my league" comment. I am to say the least, impressed(sp?) and a bit envious. Brains and beauty, how awesome is that? So I guess I just wanted y'all to know that about me so maybe you would take it easy on me : )


Respectfully, OHW

back on topic. Sorry to have strayed.

Having read the several posts that you have made contributing, I will go out on a limb and offer my observations. Sorry, in advance, for going off topic.

You not only have the prescence of mind to say that you are in a bad place, but you also have the awareness to follow-up and put straight that self esteem ain't it. The manner in which you have put forth yourself, and transacting yourself, I have a hunch that you know more about life that you are letting on.

Humility is a beautiful thing. And you carry it well.

Best wishes.

And now back on topic.

Originally Posted by alex64

This topic about " Illegals " is more about race than you think, even if you deny it, it is what it is, I do not hear anybody complaining about " Illegal" Canadians or Europeans so why you guys just dont say it " You do not like Hispanic, latino people". So what the hell, why are you guys so concern about talking about
" Illegals" when this board is about something we do " Illegaly"
and that makes everybody here " Illegal".
"He dicho"

I applaud your hard work, and your subsequent success. That's what makes this country great - ANYONE can come here and build a future for themselves.

But this thread is about "illigals". This country has a due process to follow to come here and obtain residency. Yes, that due process takes time and patience. I know, because I went through it personally. So for you to suggest that we don't know what we are talking about is hogwash, and is an ignorant statement, IMHO.

And you are also DEAD wrong that it's about racism when one says "illegals" and immediately switechs to Mexicans. I'm as dark brown as one can get, and I'm nowhere near a racist (and I'll stand by that statement).

I don't see 1,00 Irish illegals driving around in Austin, like they own the road, cutting everyone off, not putting their blinker on and pulling into your lane and THEN letting off the gas - forcing me to slam on my breaks. Nor do I see 150 Russians at HEB not controlling their children or cutting into line.

There are unwritten expectations of social conduct that each of us know to adhere to when we are in public. Mybe it takes some time to learn those rules, when one is new to the country (I had to learn them myself). I don't take issue to the fact that some people don't know better. But I do take issue to being cut off by people when they should not be here in the 1st place. I take even greater issue to it when it hapens to me 20 times more than it should on an average day.

[onehitwonder]

No one has adressed my first post as of yet. You remember, right? About me having to be bilingual in this country where I am FROM. About me LOSING a job over it or NOT being considered for a job because of it. Most folks immediately chose sides, made accusations, posted stats, recited the constitution and called me a racist. WOW. If I moved to Mexico I bet I would have to learn the language or I'd be sh*t out of luck. And I'm pretty sure I would'nt be given someone's job BECAUSE I spoke english.


rrrabbitt: I know plenty about life this is true. Just wish I had went about living it a little different. : ) Ahhh.. wish in one hand and boo-boo in the other......well you know the rest!

[N2SEX46]

One Hit,
When I went to Mexico to help my friend, my Castillian Spanish wasn't appreciated as I found out. I picked up some Latin Spanish during my incarceration and along with the border language lingo-WOW!! Still, being able to converse had it's advantages or I'd have probably died there. I found during a Google search to learn Portuguese on Rosetta Stone that you can order both formal and Latin Spanish. If it is at all possible to somehow obtain one of these courses, in your case Latin American Spanish (through a friend, library, etc.) I believe it is worthwhile. I want to travel to Brazil next year, thus my interest in learning their language. It could prove to your advantage and for sure, it can't hurt. Anyway, best of luck to you. Times are very difficult, we are in a Depression, inspite of what Washington and Wall Streel claim, and it is one of the big reasons illegals risk everything to come to the U.S. among others. A few years ago, the ICE raided a meat packing plant and took in many illegals working there. The factory had to advertise for workers, and U.S. tax payers lined up in droves to apply. Not sure if it was from my former home state Minnesota (Worthington comes to mind), Wisconsin, Illinois, Iowa or another Midwest state. It isn't because they'll take jobs (those anyway) that no one else wants like then President Bush claimed. The drug problem is taking its toll in Arizona, people near the border are being robbed and killed in their homes, thus I suggest one of their reasons for the new Arizona Law we're reading about.
Ten years ago, I would have jumped on rrabbit's case for his comments, but now I see his point of view clearly and agree with him for the most part. So does my Hispanic wife. Again, good luck.

[onehitwonder]

N2SEX26:
I appreciate your comments. And yes ANY attempts to further ones education(spanish classes) is a plus. HOWEVER you may have missed my point. Please do not take my next comment as me behaving badly because you cannot judge my tone....... WHY do I have to speak spanish in my own country to KEEP the job I've had for 2 yrs? Could you please go back and read my posts form the first to last so that you fully understand what my, for lack of a better word, PROBLEM is, and see if you:
a) still feel that taking a spanish class is the solution. And if so,
b) how in the world is that acceptable
c) if you can explain this to me


Again, I AM NOT BEING A SMART-A*S!


side note: I held another position before moving to doorgirl so I was there 3 yrs total. And worked for the original owner at other clubs/venues for 15 yrs so my work ethic never came in question.

[shaft.drive]

Originally Posted by 78704

Not like the brazen giant of Greek fame,
With conquering limbs astride from land to land;
Here at our sea-washed, sunset gates shall stand
A mighty woman with a torch, whose flame
Is the imprisoned lightning, and her name
Mother of Exiles. From her beacon-hand
Glows world-wide welcome; her mild eyes command
The air-bridged harbor that twin cities frame. “Keep, ancient lands, your storied pomp!” cries she
with silent lips. “Give me your tired, your poor,
Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free,
The wretched refuse of your teeming shore.
Send these, the homeless, tempest-tost to me,
I lift my lamp beside the golden door!”
-Emma Lazarus, The New Colossus

I agree with this

[VictoriaLyn]

[quote=onehitwonder;485826] WHY do I have to speak spanish in my own country to KEEP the job I've had for 2 yrs?


That is some utter full on horse crap...That is wrong on soooooooooooo many different levels....It boils my blood the thought that happens:di sgust1:
....Sorry you had to deal with that

[onehitwonder]

Shaft drive: Yes that is wonderful. But what about the folks that were born here and helping those get off the boat? (ok my poor attempt at humor) But my question still stands.........

Victoria Lyn: Thank you Dear for your concern. I suspect it's happening more often these days. I've heard of another incidents but I'd rather speak about something I know and not hearsay. I was angry, but now I'm more worried. What if this becomes the norm? What will happen to us that do not have formal education or skills? We can't fall back on the system that we've put into obviously..........See posts # 46- 51- 59


Yours, OHW

[Carl]

Originally Posted by onehitwonder

N2SEX26:
I appreciate your comments. And yes ANY attempts to further ones education(spanish classes) is a plus. HOWEVER you may have missed my point. Please do not take my next comment as me behaving badly because you cannot judge my tone....... WHY do I have to speak spanish in my own country to KEEP the job I've had for 2 yrs? Could you please go back and read my posts form the first to last so that you fully understand what my, for lack of a better word, PROBLEM is, and see if you:
a) still feel that taking a spanish class is the solution. And if so,
b) how in the world is that acceptable
c) if you can explain this to me


Again, I AM NOT BEING A SMART-A*S!


side note: I held another position before moving to doorgirl so I was there 3 yrs total. And worked for the original owner at other clubs/venues for 15 yrs so my work ethic never came in question.

Well, it's not really the same job that you had. The business that provided that job was sold and now you have new owners. They changed the strip club to cater to Latinos. That may be a relatively minor change, but since they decided to go in a new direction, they may feel it is within their rights to change their employees as they see fit. I've worked in other situations that when ownership changed, one way or another, there was complete employee turnover within a fairly short time. New owners often simply want to have employees of their own choosing, irregardless of how long or how well employees hired by the previous owners worked at that same location. Your not being able to speak Spanish may have been a handy excuse for them.

And on the surface, since they are the new owners and did change the focus of the club, they feel within their rights, since it's their money and capital at risk to make whatever choices they want to make to run it according to their wishes. If they had decided to make it into a high-end karaoke club with private karaoke booths that catered to Japanese businessmen, they would feel entirely within their rights to insist on an entire staff that looked Asian and could speak Japanese.

Now as to your options, one reason that lawyers may not be anxious to take your case is that in Texas, employers have the right to change your job title (and the description/qualifications that go with it) at their will with no notification or consent from the employee unless there is a job contract in place that specifies them. The defendant being a SOB may or may not be part of the reason of their unwillingness to take the case.

However, you can still make a case for job discrimination to a governmental agency, the Texas Workforce Commission. It is possible that you can make a case for either national origin discrimination, race/color Discrimination or possibly, since you're a grandparent, age discrimination if you are over age 40.

http://www.twc.state.tx.us/crd/facts.html

Furthermore, there are penalties against these forms of discrimination not only against employees but also against job applicants. So, if you feel that you may be discriminated against during the application process with a new employer while job hunting, you may also have a case.

Now, the TWC may not get you your job back or a new job based on any complaint you might make, but it may at least amount to a little administrative "payback" and help you feel better about moving on.

[Carl]

Originally Posted by onehitwonder

Shaft drive: Yes that is wonderful. But what about the folks that were born here and helping those get off the boat? (ok my poor attempt at humor) But my question still stands.........

Victoria Lyn: Thank you Dear for your concern. I suspect it's happening more often these days. I've heard of another incidents but I'd rather speak about something I know and not hearsay. I was angry, but now I'm more worried. What if this becomes the norm? What will happen to us that do not have formal education or skills? We can't fall back on the system that we've put into obviously..........See posts # 46- 51- 59


Yours, OHW

Unfortunately, while your current experience allows you to put faces, languages as points of reference for your problem, the sad fact that the jobs that used to be available to workers without a formal education or skills have been shrinking and disappearing for a very long time. It may feel that you're competing with Spanish-speaking immigrants (legal or illegal) for your old job or any new job. But, especially with regards to a new job at other SCs or anyplace else for that matter, you're also competing against young people with limited experience and skills (teens to 20's), older retirees looking for part-time work to supplement their SS or pensions, jobs leaving the US to off-shore factories (or in the case of China, prison slave labor) and automation. every automated cashier at Wal-Mart, home Depot or HEB takes somebody's job. I wouldn't be surprised if that Spanish speaking door girl lost her job some day to an automated machine that checked swiped IDs for age and accepted cash, credit or debit for the cover charge and made change in singles. Just be a slight modification of the automated cashier at the stores.

[onehitwonder]

So what you're saying is out with old and in with the new, huh? And in this day and (MY) age I'm basically useless? No matter my work ethic? Do something to make myself feel better and move on? Is that an offer? *wink* You sound like you might have a small amount of lawyer in 'ya. Care to help a girl out? And yes I am over 40, just BARELY! Thank you very much! LOL

Seriously, I appreciate your comments Carl, I always do. You are neutral and direct in most cases. And it stung a little bit but at least you addressed it from what I believe may be a legal stand point? Also honestly. Now that we all know that I have been replaced by a newer, illegal, spanish speaking model, ( I had to be bilingual she only had to speak spanish) what's your take on the other issue I seem to be having with you know, the assistance department. Since I'm being put out to pasture and all. Is'nt this exact situation that I find myself in the reason for these programs? After all of the money "they" took out of my checks over the years......OMG! I sound like my mother! UGH!


Repectfully, OHW
P.S. I am in no way attempting to be disrespectful

edit. Mis-read/understood the start of your 2nd post and got a little snippy. Sorry :=)

[nuglet]

When traveling out of our country, almost everyone I meet speaks 2-3 or 4 languages. I envy them because I never HAD to learn another language, so when I elected to become bilingual, it was hard work for me and I still feel uneducated when I talk to a shoe shine kid in Barcelona that speaks 5 languages. I don't think it's "required" but if he wants to make a living, it's to his benefit to be able to talk to his customers. Cruise lines REQUIRE all personnel be multi-lingual as well as most business that cater to international customers.
In our country, we take it for granted that "want my money, SPEAK my language" and for the most part, you can get along with English alone anywhere in the world. That's a shame because it limits our contact with other races. I wish we had been taught, and encouraged to use, more than one language as we grew up in school.
Not offering a solution, just an observation.

[onehitwonder]

I've never been out of this country, although I dream of Italy on the daily. Must be awesome to see it all first hand. You go boy!

This never crossed my mind until said incident. And I get that it can only help to speak other languages but to be almost forced into it in my hometown so I can feed my family is a little much to take.

And other issue with the assistance is tough to "sit through" too. I need help and can't get it. I can't help feeling its because someone who didn't need it or deserved it, abused it. What about Ms minimum wage over here?

Well Nug,Carl,rrrabbitt, Poet, thanks for listening. I'm no closer to a solution than I was when we started. But at least y'all held my hair while I threw up! LOL!

Sincerly, OHW

[Carl]

Originally Posted by onehitwonder

So what you're saying is out with old and in with the new, huh? And in this day and (MY) age I'm basically useless? No matter my work ethic? Do something to make myself feel better and move on? Is that an offer? *wink* You sound like you might have a small amount of lawyer in 'ya. Care to help a girl out? And yes I am over 40, just BARELY! Thank you very much! LOL

Seriously, I appreciate your comments Carl, I always do. You are neutral and direct in most cases. And it stung a little bit but at least you addressed it from what I believe may be a legal stand point? Also honestly. Now that we all know that I have been replaced by a newer, illegal, spanish speaking model, ( I had to be bilingual she only had to speak spanish) what's your take on the other issue I seem to be having with you know, the assistance department. Since I'm being put out to pasture and all. Is'nt this exact situation that I find myself in the reason for these programs? After all of the money "they" took out of my checks over the years......OMG! I sound like my mother! UGH!


Repectfully, OHW
P.S. I am in no way attempting to be disrespectful

edit. Mis-read/understood the start of your 2nd post and got a little snippy. Sorry :=)

Well, I'm not a lawyer, but I have to sit through mandatory compliance training conducted by HR every few years on a variety of subjects and job discrimination (among about 11 other topics) is one of them.

The idea that we pay into a system and are entitled to get back out what we put in is a pretty fiction, i.e., a pretty lie, that is used to keep people from going berserk. Actually, your (and everybody else's) SS, Medicare and other taxes related to assistance programs were never going into a bank for you to withdraw later. They were/are going to pay the benefits of current beneficiaries. It's basically a legal Ponzi scheme run by the government. That's why SS/medicare is due to one day go broke under current payouts, because as people get older and live longer, there's fewer and fewer young people paying those taxes for each older American that qualifies for, and feels entitled to, them. That's part of the reason why retirement age for full benefits got pushed back to 67 a long time ago. That's part of the reason why now, a 67 year old person can work and not get penalties for the income applied to their SS benefits. Now they can keep paying back into the system and also use a part-time paycheck to supplement what will be a totally insufficient SS benefit to live on for most retirees.

Which was part of the point I was making in one of the posts. There used to be plenty of jobs that paid well for people with limited education and skill sets. But over the last 20-30 years they started going off-shore, thanks to tax advantages for corporations and the wealthy. Those that remain, have a broad applicant pool that are willing to work really dirt cheap, like illegal immigrants, the very young and the very old that are looking to supplement their retirement.

As far as the applications for assistance, there's not much advice I can give. I helped my mom apply for it after she had some serious health problems which forced her to retire early. The system is geared to help the poorest of the poor with documentation to prove they're really really poor. My mom had to go through every last bit of her retirement savings, cash in any whole life policies, burial polices, sell any property, use up all her credit, etc, and provide documentation of it, basically proving that she was effectively destitute before she got much help. And then it wasn't much help at that since she didn't have dependent children. Even her SS disability benefit took several appeals, even though she was wheelchair-ridden. All I can say is be prepared to be stripped of any human pride or self-esteem as you go through the system. If I hadn't been there for her, she'd probably be dead by now.