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Old 02-21-2016, 01:57 PM   #46
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Is that really the best you got?
Not at all. I just don't waste my good ammo on bumper-sticker bozos.


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Well, just keep trusting the government. We'll see how that works out for you.
You're the one who trusts the government so much you want to give it the power to step in anytime it feels like it and arbitrarily declare any successful private business or financial institution too big to fail so it can break them up. Very libertarian of you.
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Old 02-21-2016, 10:59 PM   #47
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What a disappointment... I thought you were one of the few intelligent posters here, ExNYer. You've swallowed the false, agenda-driven libtard narrative on the 2008/09 financial crisis hook, line and sinker. And then you insult everyone's intelligence by saying this libtard narrative is consistent with Libertarianism. Go play with COG. Then vote for Bernie Sanders. He's your man. He'll break up the banks and take a wrecking ball to the rest of the US economy too.
So, I guess you are a banker, huh?

First, I'm not a tort lawyer so stop pretending you know me, mope.

And stop trying to put words in my mouth or attribute assumed positions/beliefs to me. That's IBHankering's trick. It's stupid when he does it. It's stupid when you do it.

I didn't "lose" any money in the crashes that sways my opinion. I lose money - like everyone else - when my TAXES go to bail out big banks. You only point out the financial institutions that are still in existence. What about the ones that are gone? Merrill Lynch? Lehman Brothers? They were absorbed into the now-even-bigger banks - which now pose an even greater threat to the economy.

Are you really waiting for another replay of 2008-2009?

I can't even begin to address line-by-line all of your misleading arguments above. I have neither the time nor the patience to do so.

But, suffice it to say, all of your blather about "economies of scale" is horseshit.

The problem is "too big to fail" remember? That means economies of scale are part of the problem if they lead to a half dozen monstrous banks that have too much sway over the economy. Oligarchy is not an improvement over monopoly.

It isn't the 14,000 or 5,500 banks that are the problem. It is the small handful that we have to worry about bailing out when things go south again. Like they appear to be doing right now.

And your argument about American companies having to borrow from foreign banks because no American banks are big enough is utterly ridiculous. First, it is RARE that any company needs to borrow so much money that only a giant bank like Goldman Sachs can swing it. That's no excuse to let GS continue to exist at its current size.

Second, there is nothing to stop a company from borrowing money from a group of banks that pool the loan. That happens all the time also.

And then there is this line of stupidity:
---------------------------------------------
"... you contradicted yourself. First you say the banks “bribe” politicians to “leave them alone.” Then in the next breath you complain about how busy they are drafting new legislation affecting their industry. Do they want to be left alone or not? Make up your mind before you go on a rant.
---------------------------------------------
There is no contradiction, mope. "Affecting their industry", as you put it, doesn't tell you anything.

The banks like to draft legislation that is designed to "leave them alone" - i.e., reduce their oversight, remove barriers to markets they want to enter, reduce penalties for shady practices, etc.. The legislation is drafted to suit their purposes, not increase the burdens on them.

What I don't understand is why YOU are so willing to go in the tank to protect the economic clout of the half-dozen or so financial institutions that can take down the economy in another downturn.

In a REAL free market, they would be allowed to go broke and better banks would take their place, right? All this bailout shit is communism, right?

And yet, in your entire diatribe, you never once addressed the issue of bailing them out the next time around, did you?

We have gotten into the position of privatizing the profits of these big banks, but socializing the risk. How fucked up is that?

Yet all we hear from you is that we have to do absolutely nothing. We have to maintain these financial giants in their current positions at all costs.

Is that the best you've got?
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Old 02-22-2016, 01:11 AM   #48
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Not at all. I just don't waste my good ammo on bumper-sticker bozos.




You're the one who trusts the government so much you want to give it the power to step in anytime it feels like it and arbitrarily declare any successful private business or financial institution too big to fail so it can break them up. Very libertarian of you.
Where did I say the government can step in anytime they want? Are you so devoid of ideas you have to make up stuff about me? That's a WPF tactic. You've sunk to a new low. Say "Hello" to WPF while your down there.
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Old 02-22-2016, 03:03 PM   #49
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https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IkdmOVejUlI
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Old 02-22-2016, 03:15 PM   #50
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[QUOTE=ExNYer;1057834539]

I can't even begin to address line-by-line all of your misleading arguments above.

I have neither the time nor the patience to do so.

[QUOTE]

I think I'll pass that one along to the Clinton campaign. She's going to need it.
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Old 02-23-2016, 02:50 PM   #51
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So, I guess you are a banker, huh?

Nope. I just know a helluva lot more than you do about banking and finance. Which isn't saying much.


First, I'm not a tort lawyer so stop pretending you know me, mope.

Glad to hear that. So what kind of legal work do you do?


And stop trying to put words in my mouth or attribute assumed positions/beliefs to me. That's IBHankering's trick. It's stupid when he does it. It's stupid when you do it.

Only once did I attribute anything to you – when I said “I'll venture a guess you're referring to subprime mortgages.” And I did that because you didn't explain how the big banks are punching you in the nose. Your metaphor is silly and not apt to the discussion.



I didn't "lose" any money in the crashes that sways my opinion. I lose money - like everyone else - when my TAXES go to bail out big banks.

If you are referring to the TARP program, taxpayers were repaid in full. They even earned a tidy profit at the end of the day. In other words, TARP didn't add a nickel to the national debt. So, how did you lose money again?


You only point out the financial institutions that are still in existence. What about the ones that are gone? Merrill Lynch? Lehman Brothers? They were absorbed into the now-even-bigger banks - which now pose an even greater threat to the economy.

Merrill Lynch is now part of BofA. The broker-dealer operation of Lehman Brothers was bought out of bankruptcy by Barclays (nearly all its employees were gone, so it wasn't much of a prize). Anyone else you want to know about?

Treasury Secretary Hank Paulson and Fed Chairman Ben Bernanke pushed for all of the mergers to happen. What's your point? You still haven't explained how/why bigness per se is a threat to you or the economy. I can just as easily argue that having some big banks around is a good idea in case they're needed to help absorb failing institutions in a future crisis (although I have a sneaking suspicion the next time the Government asks them to help out this way, they may just say go fuck yourself).



Are you really waiting for another replay of 2008-2009?

There won't be a replay. The next crisis will have nothing to do with subprime mortgages. Ironically, you just lamented the fact that the big Wall Street investment banks are gone. So you miss the folks who were overly exposed to the subprime stuff. Commercial banks were (and are) smarter and more careful. They have more capital and generally enforce stricter exposure limits. Oh wait, I almost forgot – you don't know the difference between commercial and investment banks.


I can't even begin to address line-by-line all of your misleading arguments above. I have neither the time nor the patience to do so.

You don't have the time and patience? Or you can't? Your earlier post was so misinformed that I had no choice but to address it line-by-line.


But, suffice it to say, all of your blather about "economies of scale" is horseshit.

The problem is "too big to fail" remember? That means economies of scale are part of the problem if they lead to a half dozen monstrous banks that have too much sway over the economy. Oligarchy is not an improvement over monopoly.

You're the one who is blathering here. What the fuck does “too much sway over the economy” mean? Give me a precise definition, otherwise you're just wasting everyone's time like COG does. "Economies of scale" is an elementary Econ 101 concept. The fact that you call it “horseshit” tells me you don't understand basic economics. There are numerous examples of how it applies to banking. On a per branch basis, it costs far less to roll out new software for a bank with 200 branches than one with only 20 branches. Obviously, simple economics is over your head.


It isn't the 14,000 or 5,500 banks that are the problem. It is the small handful that we have to worry about bailing out when things go south again. Like they appear to be doing right now.

So don't bail them out. Or should I say, don't force them to take Government (TARP) money they didn't ask for. And don't force them to go through with mergers when they want to back out due to a Material Adverse Change. Put failing banks into receivership with the FDIC, sell off their assets and use the proceeds to satisfy as much of their liabilities as possible. What's so hard about that? Fuck this too-big-to-fail nonsense. It's just an excuse for libtards to go in and smother them with regulations anyway.

And which banks are about to “go south again”? Today all of the big ones are very well-capitalized. Do you know something I don't know? Spit it out. Where's the problem? Too much energy exposure? Got a link? Do your homework before you make statements like that.



And your argument about American companies having to borrow from foreign banks because no American banks are big enough is utterly ridiculous. First, it is RARE that any company needs to borrow so much money that only a giant bank like Goldman Sachs can swing it. That's no excuse to let GS continue to exist at its current size.

Second, there is nothing to stop a company from borrowing money from a group of banks that pool the loan. That happens all the time also.

You're so ignorant about banking, it astounds me. You don't understand the difference between plain-vanilla lending and underwriting and trading of stocks and bonds – the Glass-Steagall separation. When the broker-dealer unit of a bank underwrites a stock or bond issue, it isn't making a loan – it's selling a company's shares or debt into the market. If it can't sell off the issue quickly at a profit to institutional investors, it can be stuck with big losses. That's riskier and requires more capital than simply making a loan, whether the loan is syndicated among a group of banks or not. My argument is not ridiculous – it's widely echoed by everyone who understands how Wall Street works.


And then there is this line of stupidity:
---------------------------------------------
"... you contradicted yourself. First you say the banks “bribe” politicians to “leave them alone.” Then in the next breath you complain about how busy they are drafting new legislation affecting their industry. Do they want to be left alone or not? Make up your mind before you go on a rant.
---------------------------------------------
There is no contradiction, mope. "Affecting their industry", as you put it, doesn't tell you anything.

The banks like to draft legislation that is designed to "leave them alone" - i.e., reduce their oversight, remove barriers to markets they want to enter, reduce penalties for shady practices, etc.. The legislation is drafted to suit their purposes, not increase the burdens on them.

Gee, is that what happened with Dodd Frank? Which banks did the drafting for that piece of shit legislation? How did it suit their purposes? How did it not increase the burdens on them? How did it leave them alone? By the way, Dodd Frank is another example of that elusive (for you) concept known as economies of scale. It's killing the smaller community banks, since the costs of complying are more burdensome for small banks than larger ones.


What I don't understand is why YOU are so willing to go in the tank to protect the economic clout of the half-dozen or so financial institutions that can take down the economy in another downturn.

I'm not out to protect anyone's economic clout. I'm puncturing your ignorance and protecting your liberty, whether you appreciate it or not. If any bank or corporation is so big that it exercises too much market influence, there are anti-trust laws on the books for you to use to break them up. You want to go much further and give the government the right to break up private entities for spurious reasons, even after they bulked up at the government's request. Just follow the Bernie Sanders formula - work up enough populist hatred against the target and you're good to go. Today it's Wall Street, tomorrow the oil companies, the day after tomorrow you and your employer.


In a REAL free market, they would be allowed to go broke and better banks would take their place, right? All this bailout shit is communism, right?

Banks fail all the time and there should be no exception for the big ones. The Fed is there for temporary liquidity problems. The FDIC exists to guarantee small depositors. The big banks even have “living wills” ready to keep things orderly. You obviously understand communism even less than you do banking. Bernie Sanders blathering away about breaking up the banks while you stupidly applaud is much closer to communism than anything I have ever advocated.


And yet, in your entire diatribe, you never once addressed the issue of bailing them out the next time around, did you?

Actually I just did. No more TARPs as a forced backdoor excuse for the government to take over private institutions or industries.


We have gotten into the position of privatizing the profits of these big banks, but socializing the risk. How fucked up is that?

Are you talking about Fannie Mae and Freddie Mac, which have always enjoyed an implicit government guarantee? If so, I would definitely consider breaking up those government-created behemoths. Otherwise your characterization doesn't apply. If you have a problem because you think the TBTF banks can borrow funds at slightly lower rates that non-TBTF banks, then the solution is obvious – get rid of the too-big-to-fail designation! It's just another misconceived invention of Dodd Frank anyway.


Yet all we hear from you is that we have to do absolutely nothing. We have to maintain these financial giants in their current positions at all costs.

What did you say earlier about don't “put words in my mouth or attribute assumed positions/beliefs to me”? I never said any of that.


Is that the best you've got?

For now. If you're smart, you'll tap out and not subject yourself to another whooping.
.
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Old 02-23-2016, 05:25 PM   #52
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Where did I say the government can step in anytime they want?
Right here:

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These major banks are full of fraud, and are depriving people of liberty and property. It is completely Libertarian to investigate and break them up if the evidence supports it.
Who is going to break them up if not the government? As for drumming up "evidence" - that will be the easy part. Just find people like COG. First they will find people to say "Jamie Dimon is depriving me of liberty by turning down my loan application." Then they will find others (who are in default on their loans) to say "Jamie Dimon committed fraud by approving my loan application."

See any IRONY yet?

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The only irony is your reliance and trust in government.
So now you're accusing me of trusting the government that you are relying on to break up the banks?

Now that's rich in IRONY!

You're about as Libertarian as Liberace was heterosexual!

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Old 02-23-2016, 11:56 PM   #53
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Actually I said that banks should be investigated if there is evidence that they are engaging in fraud. That's quite a bit different than saying "anytime the government wants to". But since you lack basic comprehension skills, I will give you a pass on that.
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Old 02-24-2016, 05:20 AM   #54
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These major banks are full of fraud, and are depriving people of liberty and property. It is completely Libertarian to investigate and break them up if the evidence supports it.

The only irony is your reliance and trust in government. These banks are part OWNERS of the government. Oh, sorry. Check a government source and "prove" me wrong.
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Yes. It's a statute. Let's repeal it.
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You're the one who trusts the government so much you want to give it the power to step in anytime it feels like it and arbitrarily declare any successful private business or financial institution too big to fail so it can break them up. Very libertarian of you.
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Where did I say the government can step in anytime they want? Are you so devoid of ideas you have to make up stuff about me? That's a WPF tactic. You've sunk to a new low. Say "Hello" to WPF while your down there.
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Who is going to break them up if not the government? As for drumming up "evidence" - see any IRONY yet?

You're about as Libertarian as Liberace was heterosexual!
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Actually I said that banks should be investigated if there is evidence that they are engaging in fraud. That's quite a bit different than saying "anytime the government wants to". But since you lack basic comprehension skills, I will give you a pass on that.
COG is one of those "self-proclaimed" "LIBERTARIANS" who ask the government to right the wrongs they want to be ADDRESSED BY THE GOVERNMENT they oppose ...... like those posting on this board who call LE pigs and then dial 911 when someone knocks on their front door!

COG ... you are full of shit!

.... Just ask your "FRIEND" who is a "SENATOR"!!!!!


The only lameass, kindergarten playground bullshit you can throw is ...

Quote:
But since you lack basic comprehension skills, I will give you a pass on that.
You are dumber than this guy, ...



......................who also proclaims to be smarter than everyone else ...
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Old 02-24-2016, 08:46 AM   #55
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Obviously LLephantMan either has a problem with golf or doesn't know how to post other photos.
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Old 02-24-2016, 10:24 AM   #56
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LexusLoser, calm down. Have some Ovaltine. You are doing a fine job of fulfilling WPF's role as the resident cunty bitch.
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Old 02-24-2016, 02:05 PM   #57
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LexusLoser, calm down. Have some Ovaltine. You are doing a fine job of fulfilling WPF's role as the resident cunty bitch.
Kindergartener fits you to the T!

If you had an ounce of sense you would be embarrassed of yourself. But you don't, ....

.............. so you're not.
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Old 02-24-2016, 11:24 PM   #58
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Kindergartener fits you to the T!

If you had an ounce of sense you would be embarrassed of yourself. But you don't, ....

.............. so you're not.
Feel better now? WTLexusLoser?
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Old 02-25-2016, 04:53 AM   #59
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Feel better now?
Do you post to "feel better"?

If so, you must feel awful 99% of the time when posting. Unless of course ....

... you can't realize just how dumb most of the shit you post is.

For instance: You don't care about the laws passed by the Government, because they are passed by the Government!!!

How does that work out for you in traffic court?
Tax Court?
Appraisal District?
Getting on an airplane?
The list is endless for you so-called "Libertarians"!

Do you tell your "friend" the Senator what an idiot he is for participating "in the Government"?

Or do you call him/her "SenatorLoser" and leave it at that?
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Old 02-25-2016, 06:26 AM   #60
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Feel better now? WTLexusLoser?
COIdiot had better be careful!

Otherwise he could soon be included on LLIdiots exclusive ...

"IGNORE" list!
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