Critical Cultural Skill

[WTF]

Originally Posted by DFW5Traveler

I would think that a zealot would be opposed to hanging out on an escort site. It would go beyond idle curiosity and they would be approaching the envy zone.

LOL, good point, their envy is probably why they do not want others doing the hokey pokey while they toll in the fields singing ''Glory,Glory''!

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

A well placed double entendre: touché!

Agreed, worthy of a tip of the hat.

Originally Posted by ninasastri

As a psychologist studying marketing psychology as well, i do know that the organizations all benefit from the same - western - research. So if there is top down organizations as opposed to bottom up ones, its not dependent on nationality.

Girlfriend, where you been hiding?
Smart, sassy , tall and easy on the eyes! Hot damn, tell us all (or at least me) DG or PJ has not soiled you!

[NinaBrooke]

Hi WTF :-)
Nice to meet you. Thanks for your charming commentsm i do appreciate. I will move to Manhattan fresh from Venus ( ........no the swiss mountains actually) to enhance the beautiful landscape in the USA. and enjoy some variety myself, since i have an obsession with american gents (yeah call it fetish :-)....).
Handsome most of them themselves :-).

May i politely ask what DG and PJ means? I have no clue, sorry ;-(
Kisses, Nina

[discreetgent]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

May i politely ask what DG and PJ means? I have no clue, sorry ;-(
Kisses, Nina

Hi Nina,

DG here. Welcome to the asylum

First survival guideline to live by on this forum: pay no attention to WTF lol

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

Hi Nina,

DG here. Welcome to the asylum

First survival guideline to live by on this forum: pay no attention to WTF lol

wise counsel

[WTF]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

May i politely ask what DG and PJ means? I have no clue, sorry ;-(
Kisses, Nina

Well its to late, I see DG has already introduced himself before I could warn you of his charm.


To better answer your question,PJ should not be to far behind and will always be to the far right of DG. They scour the world looking to distress damsels. You are probably only one of ten or so in the world they haven't had their way with......yet. Be leary my lady, be very leary, they are smoothe and fast!

[pjorourke]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

Hi WTF :-)
May i politely ask what DG and PJ means? I have no clue, sorry ;-(
Kisses, Nina

I'm PJ, if that's your question. Did WTF say something?

[NinaBrooke]

:-) you guys are fun.... aaaah now i know. discreet Gent and WTF and PJorourke. Nice to meet you. Have fun

[discreetgent]

Originally Posted by WTF

To better answer your question,PJ should not be to far behind and will always be to the far right of DG. They scour the world looking to distress damsels. You are probably only one of ten or so in the world they haven't had their way with......yet. Be leary my lady, be very leary, they are smoothe and fast! [/SIZE]

LMAO; I can only wish; I'm lucky if I have seen ten ladies

[WTF]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

LMAO; I can only wish; I'm lucky if I have seen ten ladies

2k plus ten is still 2,010

[London Rayne]

Who's on first, WTF is on Home Plate.

[Guest053011]

I think that the truth lies somewhere in the ability to Organize as Teams but also to Value the Individual.

Asian cultures actually highly value the ability to organize, however, they turn into a large machine, where the individual input isn't valued unless you are of a certain status. Things are so rigid it does not allow for fluid change.

However, where North America can also organize, it values the individual. It takes suggestions for change, it's possible to mountaineer to the top even if you started from the bottom. As a result individual talent isn't lost in a pool, it can be realized and accessed. This has allowed us to build an economy of Ideas.

I do think that we often think too highly of ourselves. I have found day to day life much more organized and the service industry far more developed in Japan. Europe and Asia are faster to adopt new technology and incorporate it into their lifestyles - we have quite a shocking technology lag in North America. There are hospitals in Asia and Europe that can put ours to shame. There are many countries (not all) where education is extremely accessible even to the poor, to ensure that even the lowest common denominator is fairly high.

Where my European relatives once fled here to improve their quality of living that is no longer the case. The quality of living and work possibilities have opened up to them. They still come over when they can but for a very different reason: SPACE. There's a lot of people and few living spaces available, waiting lists for condos and apartments can go on for years, and as a result it's not very affordable.

I really don't think we're as advanced as we tell ourselves we are. What we have in our favor is massive consumption, we are a disposable consumer society of people that want to spend their money of STUFF - physical objects - not experiences. As such we can feed the rest of the world: the Pusher makes money as long as user stays addicted. We use statistical information to ascertain if we are at the top of when it comes to quality of living, and statistics can be manipulated to say anything we want them to, it's all in how you present the information.

I have come to look at North America as a people who are often under educated, the educated are often over worked, and people as a whole are generally under appreciated.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

We use statistical information to ascertain if we are at the top of when it comes to quality of living, and statistics can be manipulated to say anything we want them to, it's all in how you present the information.

I have come to look at North America as a people who are often under educated, the educated are often over worked, and people as a whole are generally under appreciated.

I completely agree when it comes to statistics. Especially in social sciences its highly biased. Something like quality of life is to problematic to determine by statistical values to represent it accordingly. I think statistics is the big enemy of individuality and especially in social sciences it states more about the creator of a certain questionnaire than about the research material.

When it comes to individuality, i think its an overrated system. Especially in the USA. The USA is a country that sells people like brands and the market is full of "how to become famous/pornstar/best wive/most expensive mistress in 10 days" which is a proof that the culture exists in the USA that tries to tell people that everybody can do anything, if they just have the right tools for marketing or whatever. Which speaks strongly against the support of the individualism, because if everyone only needs to access certain tools (personal development, schoolings, a master piano player) to become this or that, then individual talents are underestimated or under"focused" (my english is not so perfect).

The basis of the american dream is that everyone can do everything if you just really work hard. That is strongly against individuality. The truth is that not everybody can do everything no matter how hard you work. Because some people do have innate skills others don`t. And development of skills is always a mix between innate skills and the proper training of these skills.
Do americans have an inflated sense of self at some point and overestimate themselves? I do think so at some point. I do not say that for offending anyone. But USA is the country of show. If you put on the right show and the right facade its what counts. People are skilled to sell themselves as brands. The individual as a marketing nichè sold in cliches and brands.

Just look at our own business - the escorting business. How many "individuals" are really out there? Not so many. Look at all pages made by whatever webdesigner listening whatever statements, you will come to the conclusion no one is ever individual because it states the same everywhere. You see the same kind of "branding" and "advertisement" over and over. There is not so much room for individuality because we are trained to do certain things to access certain codes of conduct and present ourselves in a certain way (aka the "show" factor) to sell ourselves. And present yourself as a good escort or a bad escort or the way even photos are taken, the way your body is shown, which parts are photographed which positions, all the same all certain codes of conducts that do not vary so much from person to person. Individuality is overrated.

Psychology - at least the therapies counters these beliefs and should encourage to be authentic and get more individuals. Most of the times this fails too, and psychotherapy is yet another instrument to cater to downsize individuality and make you adjusted to a mass and a "norm" and a certain code of conduct that would be unbearable to attend to - if we did not have psychotherapists or escorts to help with it.

Not to sound too negative on individuality, it does exist, i t hink we just should not overestimate it and the impact on our culture or the way we cater to it for the culture. This pretending that someone is so "special" as opposed to all the "ordinary" others is not really happening. Comparing one person to the broad mass there are still too many common variables or factors within a certain subgroup (aka the Tiger Woods case - his reaction, his behaviour, his stupid apology - the media`s reaction - the wives reaction - the lovers reaction - completely stereotypical and culturally biased) Take any other marriage with similar happenings and you see the same scenario repeat itself. So - individuality? Hmmm. strange concept :-). I have more and more stopped to believe in it. But i do believe in different social groups. So a Mormon social group is different to an escort social group. But mormons and escorts within themselves? Too similar. in their behaviour, their viewpoints, their code of conduct, their opinions.
So - individuality is overrated. People are actually not BRAVE enough to be individuals. Its too much effort and the costs of efficiency are too high, as has the 68 revolution and its aftermaths already shown. We are - not - all made of stars .

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

People are actually not BRAVE enough to be individuals. Its too much effort and the costs of efficiency are too high, as has the 68 revolution and its aftermaths already shown. We are - not - all made of stars .

I respectfully disagree. Most of the people in this forum—as individuals—are bucking the conformity of societal norms. Then there are the truly remarkable and uniquly gifted individuals who stand out in history, e.g., Martin Luther “Ich kann und will daher nichts widerrufen, weil gegen das Gewissen etwas zu tun weder sicher noch heilsam ist. Gott helfe mir, Amen!” ("I cannot and I will not recant anything for to go against conscience is neither right nor safe. God help me. Amen"), Galileo "Eppur si muove" ("And yet it moves"), and Martin Luther King Jr., “I have a dream.” And there are many others.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

I respectfully disagree. Most of the people in this forum—as individuals—are bucking the conformity of societal norms. Then there are the truly remarkable and uniquly gifted individuals who stand out in history, e.g., Martin Luther “Ich kann und will daher nichts widerrufen, weil gegen das Gewissen etwas zu tun weder sicher noch heilsam ist. Gott helfe mir, Amen!” ("I cannot and I will not recant anything for to go against conscience is neither right nor safe. God help me. Amen"), Galileo "Eppur si muove" ("And yet it moves"), and Martin Luther King Jr., “I have a dream.” And there are many others.

I respectfully agree! I meant to say "MOST" people are not brave enough. Martin Luther King and the ones stated above are exceptional humans! So was Terence McKenna and others who stand out!

But i have to respectfully disagree that in this forum there are such kind of people :-) . We are nice but we are not exceptional :-) If we were we probably would not lead a double standard life and rather be on the streets trying to legalize prostitution :-) .
no offense! I include myself when stating i am ordinary :-). And i have encountered too many people in my life with inflated sense of self - so i am provoking a little bit on the other side and weighing my arguments in the "we are all ordinary" direction :-).

[Camille]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

I came across this idea in a blog I follow:

"The secret of American’s collective success as a people is our ability to self-organize ourselves on both the small and large scale into highly effective teams The relative inability to self-organize into teams is why China and some other cultures have lagged behind in the modern world. Americans have long relied on activities like sports, theater, marching band etc to teach that one critical American cultural skill. ...

American culture is based on the seeming contradiction of extreme individualism combined with a near instant willingness and ability to join a team to accomplish any particular task. The way New Yorkers spontaneously organized to evacuate Manhattan on 9/11 represented a large scale and dramatic example of the type of self-organization that Americans reflexively engage in on a daily bases.

Germans and the Japanese also excel at organization and group work but they default to hierarchical, top-down organization. Absent leadership or a predefined structure, both Germans and Japanese have a relatively hard time organizing themselves. American organization, by contrast, is strongly bottom-up with very flat or even nonexistent hierarchies. No other people self-organizes to the degree Americans do."


Thoughts? Comments?

PJ, I think the US are less top down than other countries but I'm not sure I'd go as far as to say they are bottom up. I think they are on a par with most western countries. Lots of countries have self-organized in times of crisis. Australia excel at doing this (an approach of theirs that is holding them together currently with regards that shocking inland Tsunami), England have done it after IRA attacks and plenty of other countries have done it after natural disasters.

The US certainly does things differently to a lot of other countries, but I'm not sure the writer has hit on what those differences are...

C xx