For the Karens....

[Levianon17]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Chinese miners were infected with a bat virus in 2012. They were clearing bat guano from the mine. Transmission would have been directly from horseshoe bats to humans, without going through another species. In fact, this virus may have evolved into COVID 19. Three of the miners died. I believe the Wall Street Journal and others reported that the Wuhan lab took coronavirus samples from the mine, and one of the viruses was 96% similar genetically to COVID 19. For comparison, SARS is 80% similar.

I read today that 3% of the people living in the vicinity of caves in southeast Asia tested positive for antibodies to bat viruses. And you extrapolate that to the general population and you could have up to 7 million people infected annually with bat viruses, I think just in that part of the world. Farmers use bat guano for fertilizer and get infected. The mode of transmission would be inhalation.

SARS and MERS are bat viruses too. I don't know if humans were directly infected by the bats or if those went through a third species.

DTickler came across a paper about the mine. Here's his link and my Cliff Notes version of what it said:

https://www.eccie.net/showpost.php?p...1&postcount=51

This paper says another virus was sampled from the mine that's 98.7% similar to COVID 19, although I haven't run across anything that would indicate the Wuhan lab was studying that one.

Miners in a mine containing Bats that carry the virus are coming in direct contact with the feces, dander and even urine. Bats emit urine in the form of a mist there may be viral particles contained in their bodily fluids so that would be a mode of transmission for any human in the mine or cave. But what about the humans not coming in direct contact with the Bats like the Miners. If the miners were contagious after being exposed why wasn't there a Pandemic back in 2012? Or was the virus not transmissible from person to person but only through direct contact with the Bats. That's where the Wuhan Virology Lab would come into play and the Research on "Gain Of Function". Which through techniques performed in the Lab rendered a ordinary Zoonotic virus to be transmissible from person to person. That's a good possibility and that's what's being looked into from the information contained in Fauci's emails.

[Strokey_McDingDong]

Originally Posted by pfunkdenver

Neither the CDC, nor Fauci, said the opposite. You are completely wrong.

They did. I'll look it up later if I'm not busy.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by Levianon17

Miners in a mine containing Bats that carry the virus are coming in direct contact with the feces, dander and even urine. Bats emit urine in the form of a mist there may be viral particles contained in their bodily fluids so that would be a mode of transmission for any human in the mine or cave. But what about the humans not coming in direct contact with the Bats like the Miners. If the miners were contagious after being exposed why wasn't there a Pandemic back in 2012? Or was the virus not transmissible from person to person but only through direct contact with the Bats. That's where the Wuhan Virology Lab would come into play and the Research on "Gain Of Function". Which through techniques performed in the Lab rendered a ordinary Zoonotic virus to be transmissible from person to person. That's a good possibility and that's what's being looked into from the information from Fauci's emails.

There's a physicist and M.D., neither of whom is an expert in virology, who were on Hannity tonight and published an editorial in the WSJ today. Apparently they've been making the rounds since last fall. They are making your argument, that zoonotic viruses cannot be readily transmissible between humans unless they're modified in the laboratory. One of these guys, the doctor, says the chances this was NOT modified in a lab is one in a billion. That blows his credibility, because no one who's an expert in the field is making claims anything like that.

Aren't there a number of viruses that started out in animals, went to humans, and then we ended up with epidemics or near misses because of human-to-human transmission? Like bird and swine influenzas, ebola, HIV, smallpox, zika, and the coronaviruses that cause the common cold, SARS and MERS?

I read that you have small outbreaks of coronaviruses and other viruses from bats and other animals that can stay localized in rural areas until they finally hit larger cities, years later. The writer said that's what happened with Ebola.

With respect to the miners, one scientist said that the rate of "reproduction" or mutation of coronaviruses is so fast that you can have significant changes in the structure of the virus in a single infected individual. You're compressing years of evolution in many living organisms into days in a virus. And remember that one of the viruses from the mine was already 98.7% similar genetically.

Yes, samples of coronaviruses from the mine were obtained by the Wuhan institute. Did they perform gain of function research that made the virus more contagious? Hell if I know. From what I've read apparently there are no tell tale signs that the COVID 19 virus was genetically engineered. I've read elsewhere if they were injecting the virus into humanized mice, or accidentally or purposefully creating a recombinant virus where the genetic materially from the bat virus is mixed with genomes from another virus, there might not be a smoking gun.

My opinion is that this may or may not have accidentally come from the Wuhan lab. A person could make a reasonable argument that it probably did. But gain of function research was probably not what made this virus the scourge of humanity. But my thoughts and $3.00 will buy you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

The problem with assuming this must have been the result of gain of function research is that if wasn't, then we're not learning anything from from the experience. We wouldn't do anything about preventing the spread of coronaviruses from bats to humans. We wouldn't work towards shutting down wet markets. That would be a pity. In recent decades three new life threatening diseases, SARS, MERS and COVID 19, were caused by bat coronaviruses.

[Levianon17]

Originally Posted by Tiny

There's a physicist and M.D., neither of whom is an expert in virology, who were on Hannity tonight and published an editorial in the WSJ today. Apparently they've been making the rounds since last fall. They are making your argument, that zoonotic viruses cannot be readily transmissible between humans unless they're modified in the laboratory. One of these guys, the doctor, says the chances this was NOT modified in a lab is one in a billion. That blows his credibility, because no one who's an expert in the field is making claims anything like that.

Aren't there a number of viruses that started out in animals, went to humans, and then we ended up with epidemics or near misses because of human-to-human transmission? Like bird and swine influenzas, ebola, HIV, smallpox, zika, and the coronaviruses that cause the common cold, SARS and MERS?

I read that you have small outbreaks of coronaviruses and other viruses from bats and other animals that can stay localized in rural areas until they finally hit larger cities, years later. The writer said that's what happened with Ebola.

With respect to the miners, one scientist said that the rate of "reproduction" or mutation of coronaviruses is so fast that you can have significant changes in the structure of the virus in a single infected individual. You're compressing years of evolution in many living organisms into days in a virus. And remember that one of the viruses from the mine was already 98.7% similar genetically.

Yes, samples of coronaviruses from the mine were obtained by the Wuhan institute. Did they perform gain of function research that made the virus more contagious? Hell if I know. From what I've read apparently there are no tell tale signs that the COVID 19 virus was genetically engineered. I've read elsewhere if they were injecting the virus into humanized mice, or accidentally or purposefully creating a recombinant virus where the genetic materially from the bat virus is mixed with genomes from another virus, there might not be a smoking gun.

My opinion is that this may or may not have accidentally come from the Wuhan lab. A person could make a reasonable argument that it probably did. But gain of function research was probably not what made this virus the scourge of humanity. But my thoughts and $3.00 will buy you a cup of coffee at Starbucks.

The problem with assuming this must have been the result of gain of function research is that if wasn't, then we're not learning anything from from the experience. We wouldn't do anything about preventing the spread of coronaviruses from bats to humans. We wouldn't work towards shutting down wet markets. That would be a pity. In recent decades three new life threatening diseases, SARS, MERS and COVID 19, were caused by bat coronaviruses.

There are a number of diseases that are transmitted from animals to people. Some of them can be transmitted from an affected person to anther person. So when it comes to this Bat Virus it's obviously transmitted to humans, specifically humans that are in close contact with their environment and bodily fluids. Since Bats are nocturnal not a lot of people will come in contact with a Bat. I can count the times I've seen a Bat. So the question is can a person infected with a Corona Virus from a Bat casually transmit it to another person or not? I don't really care either way. But what is the absolute truth about Covid-19 and how it's transmitted. If something happened in that Lab in China then some people need to just suck it up and tell the truth.

[rexdutchman]

No bats within 600 miles of Wuhan, no tests showing bats at the market had covid However the lab held 20,000 bat virus genomes samples sooooo????Humm

[GastonGlock]

Originally Posted by rexdutchman

No bats within 600 miles of Wuhan, no tests showing bats at the market had covid However the lab held 20,000 bat virus genomes samples sooooo????Humm

I thought they had bats in Wuhan which is why they study it so much, it's that they didn't have the Pangolins that they assumed were the intermediate jump between bats and humans for several hundred miles.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by Tiny

...Did they perform gain of function research that made the virus more contagious? Hell if I know. ...

Historically speaking: When has choosing to be ignorant ever been a good choice?

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

Historically speaking: When has choosing to be ignorant ever been a good choice?

Ignorance is believing everything you hear on MSNBC or FOX. I’m smart enough to know what I don’t know. And to realize that if virologists don’t know the answer, some pundit on Cable news sure as hell doesn’t.

This doesn’t apply to you. You do go digging where others don’t, although at times in the wrong places

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by rexdutchman

No bats within 600 miles of Wuhan, no tests showing bats at the market had covid However the lab held 20,000 bat virus genomes samples sooooo????Humm

Bats that carry coronaviruses similar to COVID 19 live in an area from Thailand to Japan, or larger:

https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.bbc...t-55998157.amp

A friend of mine has histoplasmosis, a bat disease, that he got from a location 300 miles away.

Yeah this may have leaked from the Wuhan lab. But if you believe that with 100% certainty you’re fooling yourself

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by Levianon17

. Since Bats are nocturnal not a lot of people will come in contact with a Bat. I can count the times I've seen a Bat.

You’re not a farmer from a developing world country who uses bat guano as fertilizer. The Chinese have some strange medicinal practices. They chop up bats and sell the body parts. They put guano in their eyes. Again, you’ve got the two miners that died after being exposed to bat guano in a mine with coronaviruses up to 98.7% similar to COVID 19. Up to 7 million southeast Asians are infected with live bat viruses annually. My friend who contracted histoplasmosis, which admittedly is not a coronavirus, didn’t come into contact with a bat that bit him or sneezed on him. He breathed fumes from the guano.

[rexdutchman]

But there's NO biological, or epidemiological traces of its evolutionary history in its wake ( from bats to humans ) sars-cov-2 no history of the place,time, and mechanism of transmission of the first human ,
The official story makes no sense just saying. ( read the truth about covid-19)

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by rexdutchman

But there's NO biological, or epidemiological traces of its evolutionary history in its wake ( from bats to humans ) sars-cov-2 no history of the place,time, and mechanism of transmission of the first human ,
The official story makes no sense just saying. ( read the truth about covid-19)

Read the last couple of pages of this thread and you’ll see evidence of possible transmission to the first humans, in a copper mine where miners were cleaning out bat guano. Yeah, I’ve read where people have speculated that it’s bizarre that the furin cleavage site popped up in this coronavirus overnight. And have also read where others say the characteristics of the furin cleavage site almost certainly show it was a product of evolutionary change, not manmade. Supposedly the virus reproduces and mutates so rapidly that you can end up with big changes while it resides in a single host. It doesn’t have to pass through many generations of people to evolve. And there’s no evidence from the structure of the virus that it was genetically engineered.

[rexdutchman]

That s what the Wuhan lab is doing ( gain of function = genetically engineered bioweapons )

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by rexdutchman

That s what the Wuhan lab is doing ( gain of function = genetically engineered bioweapons )

Why would you create a very infectious bioweapon with a fatality rate of less than 1%? And then unleash it first on your own people, when you don’t have a vaccine? The Sinovac vaccine the Chinese developed is a piece of shit compared to the Pfizer and Moderna vaccines developed in part because of Operation Warp Speed. I believe this is part of the reason many Chinese believe COVID 19 is a bioweapon developed by the U.S. military. Which of course it is not.

[rexdutchman]

Read event 201 ,,, goal wasn't to kill just control Hum