Bernie Sanders

[pussycat]

We have a right to possess something not because we need them but because the government has no moral right to punish us if we have them. The basis of this Republic was to limit the criminal authority of the state only to those functions which are justified to punish malicious or outrageous acts.

As for the 2nd Amendment it is intended to secure the rights of the states to possess their own militias. That's what the Amendment refers to. Clearly the purpose is so that each state can defend itself, but from what, other states or the Federal government? Seems the Civil War put an end to that Right..

But what's implied in the 2nd Amendment is that all citizens would have weapons because a militia is a group of citizen soldiers using their own weapons. It's an archaic idea now as the states have National Guards which supply the weapons, and helicopters, and tanks. But nevertheless the idea that the Federal government could come along and restrict the ability of citizens to possess weapons would have been unheard of -- ridiculous. There would have been no need for such. But then the idea of mass shootings would also have been considered unheard of and absurd.

The point of the 2nd Amendment was not to guarantee individual rights to possess weapons but for the States to have their own citizen armies to defend against other states or the Federal government, and the Civil War destroyed any legitimacy of a State resisting Federal authority with force, EVEN IF that state voted solidly to do so (which was clearly the intend of the founders).

But the 2nd Amendment has been twisted in order to preserve this individual right as many important things like privacy have been found, through twisted interpretation, to be present in the Constitution because it's easier to do that than to Ratify another Amendment to clarify that Right.

[sportfisherman]

Does it give us the right to have an atomic bomb ?
Does it give us the right to have a tank ?
Does it give us the right to have a rocket launcher ?

So most would agree that there can and should be some limits.
I personally feel that at a minimum there should be background checks,loopholes closed,and return to a ban we once had on assault weapons.
Anyone against these regulations basically is for mass shootings.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by pussycat

We have a right to possess something ...

1st of all, it's a God given right. It was not given to us by the benevolent Federal government. 2nd of all, the right to bear arms is an individual right. This was reaffirmed by the Supreme Court in 2008 as an individual right and deemed it to be the codifying of a pre-existing right. As such, it is also not a State right. Plus you could read what the Framers of the Constitution thought. Yes, Virginia, they wrote it down. Not to mention, it is somewhat based upon English law from 1689. So it wasn't even a novel concept.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

And folks after that shit show of a Democratic debate - Trump will get reelected for another 4 years. Hopefully his kids will carry the torch for him after his last term. I'd love to see Ivanka become the first female President.
Because if any of those idiots on stage get into the White House - America is doomed.

God bless America and God bless Donald J. Trump.

What a surprise!!

Both Sanders and Biden lead or are tied with Trump in key battleground states. Is Ivanka still around? She and Pence are invisible these days.

How's your 401k doing? The ONLY thing Trump has going for him is the economy. If it falters he's in big trouble. He, and Republicans in general, have failed on other key issues important to voters -- health care, immigration, and the environment, which are, with the economy, the four highest rated concerns of voters.

‘Not the economy, stupid’: A majority of Americans say 2020 election will be about other issues

No, “it’s not the economy, stupid.” At least, not as far as the way a majority of Americans are currently planning to cast their votes in the 2020 presidential election.

Near two-thirds of Americans (61%) say the 2020 election will be about issues other than the economy, according to a CNBC and Acorns Invest in You survey conducted by SurveyMonkey and released Monday.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/11/not-...e-in-2020.html

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

1st of all, it's a God given right. It was not given to us by the benevolent Federal government. 2nd of all, the right to bear arms is an individual right. This was reaffirmed by the Supreme Court in 2008 as an individual right and deemed it to be the codifying of a pre-existing right. As such, it is also not a State right. Plus you could read what the Framers of the Constitution thought. Yes, Virginia, they wrote it down. Not to mention, it is somewhat based upon English law from 1689. So it wasn't even a novel concept.

God given? Were in the Bible does it state that?

And as Judge Scalia wrote in his writing for the majority:

“Like most rights, the right secured by the Second Amendment is not unlimited. [It is] not a right to keep and carry any weapon whatsoever in any manner whatsoever and for whatever purpose.”

The Court provided examples of laws it considered “presumptively lawful,” including those which:

Prohibit firearm possession by felons and the mentally ill.

Forbid firearm possession in sensitive places such as schools
and government buildings.

Impose conditions on the commercial sale of firearms.

The Heller decision was far from the blanket endorsement of unlimited gun rights that the gun lobby hoped it might be. Rather, the last decade of post-Heller litigation has demonstrated that the decision was a limited ruling fully compatible with the many lifesaving gun laws that protect us today.

States have been delegated the right to impose gun control laws as they see fit, and if people within the state disagree with the laws, they have to right to appeal to the court system to overturn the laws.

[stikiwikit]

"You do not have the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theatre!" Justice Oliver Wendall Holmes. Regardless, of how you twist he 2nd, the fact is no rights are absolute. If you can't own a Howitzer, then it only a step to any other assault weapon meant for war, imo.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by stikiwikit

"You do not have the right to yell "fire" in a crowded theatre!" Justice Oliver Wendall Holmes. Regardless, of how you twist he 2nd, the fact is no rights are absolute. If you can't own a Howitzer, then it only a step to any other assault weapon meant for war, imo.

The AR-15 and several other semi-automatic weapons are banned in certain states.

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by sportfisherman

Does it give us the right to have an atomic bomb ?
Does it give us the right to have a tank ?
Does it give us the right to have a rocket launcher ?

So most would agree that there can and should be some limits.
I personally feel that at a minimum there should be background checks,loopholes closed,and return to a ban we once had on assault weapons.
Anyone against these regulations basically is for mass shootings.

It's legal to have a flame thrower

[Austin Ellen]

Ha! Remember the 2016 polls? I was one of the very few who predicted Trump would win. I'm not worried. Just wait. Trump always comes out on top. No problema. And Ivanka and Pence
are visable. I don't know what you are talking about there.
And the market. Yeah, the corinavirus put a damper on things. But it will will go up again.

What did you think of the monkeys on the debate stage throwing shit at each other?

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

What a surprise!!

Both Sanders and Biden lead or are tied with Trump in key battleground states. Is Ivanka still around? She and Pence are invisible these days.

How's your 401k doing? The ONLY thing Trump has going for him is the economy. If it falters he's in big trouble. He, and Republicans in general, have failed on other key issues important to voters -- health care, immigration, and the environment, which are, with the economy, the four highest rated concerns of voters.

‘Not the economy, stupid’: A majority of Americans say 2020 election will be about other issues

No, “it’s not the economy, stupid.” At least, not as far as the way a majority of Americans are currently planning to cast their votes in the 2020 presidential election.

Near two-thirds of Americans (61%) say the 2020 election will be about issues other than the economy, according to a CNBC and Acorns Invest in You survey conducted by SurveyMonkey and released Monday.

https://www.cnbc.com/2019/11/11/not-...e-in-2020.html

[Dev Null]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

What did you think of the monkeys on the debate stage throwing shit at each other?

Better than the monkey in the Oval Office throwing shit at himself.

[Austin Ellen]

-

[Dev Null]

Did anyone else hear Trump talking today about how the stock market is down because of the Democratic debates, not the corona virus?

Of course the bulk of the losses happened before the debates, but don't confuse him with the facts, he's already made up his mind.

I'm sure everyone feels much safer now that he's appointed vice president Mike Dunce as the corona czar. Maybe he can pray it away.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Austin Ellen

Ha! Remember the 2016 polls? I was one of the very few who predicted Trump would win. I'm not worried. Just wait. Trump always comes out on top. No problema. And Ivanka and Pence
are visable. I don't know what you are talking about there.
And the market. Yeah, the corinavirus put a damper on things. But it will will go up again.

What did you think of the monkeys on the debate stage throwing shit at each other?

I remember the 2016 Republican debates. Name calling. Discussion on which candidate had the biggest "hands". Discussion of issues took a back seat to the hateful rhetoric going on on the stage. At least, for the most part, the Democratic debates are about the issues. You and I may not like the particular stances certain candidates are taking, but at least they are being discussed.

The major problems at the last debate were due to the lack of control by the moderators. Allowing people to talk over each other. Allowing people to interrupt others. Horrible job by them.

I agree that you were one of the few who called Trump's victory. And I was wrong. However, you were wrong in 2018 and I was right. I am still waiting for a while before predicting the 2020 presidential election. I have stated that Republicans will hold the Senate majority but possibly lose one or two seats. And Democrats will hold the House majority but lose some seats. And Trump will get less electoral votes in 2020 than he did in 2016.

As for the market. All good things must come to an end. There is little reason why the market has gone up like it has. Now reality is setting in. Remember, this bull market started under Obama.

Dow Futures Crumble as 10-Year Bull Run Nears Painful End

Wall Street analysts, including Citigroup, warned of a 20% stock market drop - a technical bear market and the end of a record-breaking ten-year run.

DJIA futures down over 350 points. Remember how recently Trump supporters were bragging about the DJIA possibly breaking 30.000? Now it might break 26,000 -- in the wrong direction. I have said before -- when the market was going up, Trump took full credit for it. With the current slump, yesterday Trump blamed Sanders. So typical of him.

Pence? He has been given very little responsibilities by Trump over the last 3 years. Trump is a control freak. And what does Trump finally give him responsibilty for? Controlling the conronavirus. Damn!! Thanks a lot Donald.

Ivanka? Haven't heard diddly from her.

[SpeedRacerXXX]

Originally Posted by Dev Null

Did anyone else hear Trump talking today about how the stock market is down because of the Democratic debates, not the corona virus?

Of course the bulk of the losses happened before the debates, but don't confuse him with the facts, he's already made up his mind.

I'm sure everyone feels much safer now that he's appointed vice president Mike Dunce as the corona czar. Maybe he can pray it away.

FOX News blames Bernie. Trump blames everyone.

Fox Business Blaming Stock Market Drop on Sanders Is a Sign of Things to Come

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by SpeedRacerXXX

...‘Not the economy, stupid’: A majority of Americans say 2020 election will be about other issues...

FAKE AF news article quote aside; I wonder if it's not the economy is because the economy is not stupid these days?