Anybody Notice The Feds Wants Apple To Break Into An Americans phone

[gnadfly]

Originally Posted by WTF

Be like those two bozo's who lied about PPH that were charged by the government , right LL.

Everything the government charges another with is correct, right.

Stay on topic you stupid bitch.

[i'va biggen]

Going to help terrorists, they will not have to buy all those "burn" phones now.

[gnadfly]

Anyone know of an article that accurately summarizes what the Feds want Apple to do? At first it was the Feds want Apple to help them unlock their phone because after 10 unsuccessful attempts the data on the phone is scrambled. I have Android devices and can get past the lockout screen if I don't know the swipe pattern by going to my account webpage.

Apple and the govt have a long running battle ever since they used al-Awalki's 16yo's son's iphone to drone him. This was after Obama's assurances that it would never happen.

About 4-5 years ago a guy had an uncrackable email system. If you were on the system (not free) and your email recipients were on the system nobody could see your emails, not even him. The govt forced him to shut down.

I didn't know this was a govt iphone. Still haven't seen any confirmation of it. If true, the govt should not allow the phone to be "uncrackable" in that any locking or encryption key entered by the USER (not APPLE) has to be accessible by the govt who owns the phone. But that is an issue for future phones.

Originally Posted by LexusLover

You actually believe the "criminals" and "terrorists" are going to get a copy of the software to crack the encryption and then go around "cracking" everyone's Apple Phone?

Yes. Kinda. Criminals, terrorists, the Chinese, NSA, exwife's lawyer, etc will exploit whatever is exploitable.

[Yssup Rider]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Stay on topic you stupid bitch.

Hypocrite. How can you whine about someone hijacking a thread and then hijack another thread within 10 minutes?

Takes a certain lack of moral fiber, wouldn't you say, shitfly?

[WTF]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Does the government have a legitimate interest in being able to access the data in phones?

Yes but the question is ,Should they be able to compel Apple to do so?

I say no but realize some of you simple minded short term thinking pro big brother safety freaks think differently.

[CuteOldGuy]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

The phone producers and consumers are probably better off with lawsuit to get a phone examined than a statute prohibiting a "government proof encryption."

"Frying pan into the fire!"

Does the government have a legitimate interest in being able to access the data in phones?

Certain phones. With a warrant. But they have no authority to demand a third party do their work for them.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

But they have no authority to demand a third party do their work for them.

And I thought the Government could not compel a citizen to purchase health insurance coverage or face a fine for not doing so either ..... but until someone shit cans the ACA .. that's what the law is as approved by the SCOTUS.

Each year ink manufacturers ARE REQUIRED to add to their formula specifically identifiable trace elements (metal) for that year's ink (for ball point pens). For what reason? Government tracing.

My question is: Who wants a statute passed prohibiting a manufacturer of cell phones (sold in this country or used in this country) from installing an encryption program that prevents the government from obtaining the data on the phone? Or would you rather the manufacturer "cooperate" on a case-by-case basis with a court order in house so that the data is mined from the phone IN HOUSE with the investigating agency represented when the data is retrieved to assure proper chain of custody in compliance with the order?

I can get a court order authorizing a lock smith to open a combination safe, who gets the "master combination" from the manufacturer of the safe? What's the difference as far as the manufacturer providing access to the "secure vault" the contents of which a third-party wants to examine and/or confiscate?

The only difference I see is someone puts too much shit on the cell phones and then wants to protect it, when what they should have done in the first place is not put all that shit on there! How many times has some hysterical hobbyist or provider posted about "losing" their Iphone and ALL THEIR CONTACT INFORMATION! When you start using your phone as a MAIN FRAME for your whole fucking life data storage ... then you "assume" the risk of it getting mined or lost. You are shifting the responsibility of your own security to Apple et al.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

You actually believe the "criminals" and "terrorists" are going to get a copy of the software to crack the encryption and then go around "cracking" everyone's Apple Phone?

Originally Posted by gnadfly

Yes. Kinda. Criminals, terrorists, the Chinese, NSA, exwife's lawyer, etc will exploit whatever is exploitable.

It's real simple. Two special agents appear at Apple's pre-designated lab with the Iphone in question with a court order and the owner's waiver, and stand their in the lab with video and audio recording the chain of custody events while the technician(s) hook up the phone to a computer containing the proprietary software and the software downloads and unscrambles the file or files in the phone that are desired by the FBI and hands the "English" to them on a disk or flash drive with an accompanying affidavit affirming/swearing to the validity and accuracy of the "translation," and the two agents depart with the Iphone, their copy of the information (the only one is ok .. keeping in mind ala HillariousNoMore than there is unscrambled data on the Apple computer (which can be scrubbed while the agents remain there to observe and confirm) ...., and the paper work confirming the chain of custody, extraction, translation, and authenticity of the "English."

Now explain how ...

"...Criminals, terrorists, the Chinese, NSA, exwife's lawyer, ..." are going to get the "unscrambling software"? It NEVER leaves the Apple lab computer!

[DSK]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

It's real simple. Two special agents appear at Apple's pre-designated lab with the Iphone in question with a court order and the owner's waiver, and stand their in the lab with video and audio recording the chain of custody events while the technician(s) hook up the phone to a computer containing the proprietary software and the software downloads and unscrambles the file or files in the phone that are desired by the FBI and hands the "English" to them on a disk or flash drive with an accompanying affidavit affirming/swearing to the validity and accuracy of the "translation," and the two agents depart with the Iphone, their copy of the information (the only one is ok .. keeping in mind ala HillariousNoMore than there is unscrambled data on the Apple computer (which can be scrubbed while the agents remain there to observe and confirm) ...., and the paper work confirming the chain of custody, extraction, translation, and authenticity of the "English."

Now explain how ...

"...Criminals, terrorists, the Chinese, NSA, exwife's lawyer, ..." are going to get the "unscrambling software"? It NEVER leaves the Apple lab computer!

That is a perfect example of an excellent chain of custody, but I can hear the ghost of Johnny Cochran saying this:

"If the data ain't encrypted then whitey done scripted to make the dark man convicted!"

[cptjohnstone]

has anybody ask if the phone was back up some where?

[CuteOldGuy]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

And I thought the Government could not compel a citizen to purchase health insurance coverage or face a fine for not doing so either ..... but until someone shit cans the ACA .. that's what the law is as approved by the SCOTUS.

Each year ink manufacturers ARE REQUIRED to add to their formula specifically identifiable trace elements (metal) for that year's ink (for ball point pens). For what reason? Government tracing.

My question is: Who wants a statute passed prohibiting a manufacturer of cell phones (sold in this country or used in this country) from installing an encryption program that prevents the government from obtaining the data on the phone? Or would you rather the manufacturer "cooperate" on a case-by-case basis with a court order in house so that the data is mined from the phone IN HOUSE with the investigating agency represented when the data is retrieved to assure proper chain of custody in compliance with the order?

I can get a court order authorizing a lock smith to open a combination safe, who gets the "master combination" from the manufacturer of the safe? What's the difference as far as the manufacturer providing access to the "secure vault" the contents of which a third-party wants to examine and/or confiscate?

The only difference I see is someone puts too much shit on the cell phones and then wants to protect it, when what they should have done in the first place is not put all that shit on there! How many times has some hysterical hobbyist or provider posted about "losing" their Iphone and ALL THEIR CONTACT INFORMATION! When you start using your phone as a MAIN FRAME for your whole fucking life data storage ... then you "assume" the risk of it getting mined or lost. You are shifting the responsibility of your own security to Apple et al.

The ACA is unconstitutional, regardless of what the Court says. What is on my phone is not your, or anyone else's business. You want to see it? Get a warrant. Can't figure out how to open it? Too bad. The Fifth Amendment says I don't have to open it for you. And the 13th Amendment says you can't force Apple to, either. Why are you so afraid of freedom?


Now I'm not stupid enough to believe that the Constitution means anything anymore. CJ Roberts and the ACA disabused me of any such notion. So I'm sure Apple will eventually forced to build a back door for government. But let's not fool ourselves into thinking that we are doing this to keep us free. We're not. We are living in a post-Constitutional society. But I'm still going to support Apple in this cause, and I greatly respect Tim Cook for putting up the fight. At least to my grandchildren, Tim Cook will be a folk hero.

[i'va biggen]

You would think that a warrant from the justice dept, on a case by case basis, especially on a terrorist would let Apple open the phone, without a software backdoor.

[WTF]

If you read the history on this Apple quit doing this for LE a year or so ago ..the government is using this case for precedent.

Apple hadbeen doing it on their old phones for LE. Be interesting to see how this plays out.

The more i research the more i feel Apple is doing the right thing.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

The ACA is unconstitutional, regardless of what the Court says.....

And you probably think OJ Simpson is guilty of murdering those two people.

Now go contemplate our galaxy colliding with another one in the future.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by i'va biggen

You would think that a warrant from the justice dept, on a case by case basis, especially on a terrorist would let Apple open the phone, without a software backdoor.

That would be the "smart" thing to do. The "not so smart" thing to have done was to allow it get into the press and get jammed up in the Courts. Apple is banking on a Democratic President in 2017 to thwart any effort by a Republican controlled Congress to legislate a prohibition against untouchable "encryptions."

Keep in mind that Bill Clinton signed an executive order authorizing a "chip" be required to be in EVERY PHONE operated in the United States to allow Federal LE to "listen in" on the phone conversation AND the personal conversation in the vicinity of the phone. What do you think BurnYourMoney thinks?