AMERICA IS GOIN DOWN

[enderwiggin]

Originally Posted by eagle

-----------

Why don't you create your own topic about Russia?

Because you opened the topic here. You can't make a statement like, "The U.S.A is the most violent, warmongering country EVER", comparing them to every other nation or society that ever existed on the planet, without inviting others to examine that comparison to other nations -- Russia included.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by eagle

Russia owed nothing to America.

May be not to "America" ... but to the U.S.

http://whatreallyhappened.com/WRHARTICLES/pearl/www.geocities.com/Pentagon/6315/lend.html

Lend Lease
to Russia

From Major Jordan' Diaries

(NY: Harcourt, Brace, 1952)

Chapter Nine

Lend Lease
to Russia

From Major Jordan' Diaries

(NY: Harcourt, Brace, 1952)

Chapter Nine

SUMMARY

MUNITIONS $4,651,582,000 NON-MUNITIONS 4,826,084,000 ---------------- Total 9,477,666,000 Note: the figure of $11 billion includes services as well as goods furnished.
The U.S. Government has never released detailed reports on what was sent in Lend-Lease, so Major Jordan's data, gleaned from the Russians' own manifests, is the only public record. More than one-third of Lend-Lease sent was illegal under the terms of the act which specifically prohibited "goods furnished for relief and rehabilitation purposes."
It should be kept in mind that Russia was an ally of Japan throughout the war, that it had been the ally of Hitler during the first two years of the war, that its division of Poland with Germany started the war, that it was an agressive imperialist force that attacked Finland and subverted the Baltic states as well, that it had announced that it intended to take over the world and that most of the aid sent in 1945 was sent after Stalin's February speech in which he said he would continue the war but against the United States.
Franklin Roosevelt's alter ego and Lend-Lease administrator Harry L. Hopkins, a KGB agent, declared to Russia before a crowd at Madison Square Garden on June 22, 1942, that: "We are determined that nothing shall stop us from sharing with you all that we have." He was not joking.


To “coin” the phrase:
A billion here and a billion, amounts to REAL money.

The operative words are: "Lend" and "Lease"

[Trey]

to act like Russia is so innocent in the nuclear race is bull shit. I do beleive they still hold the record for the largest nuclear test to date, not to mention they wanted it to be like twice the size it was. The bomb had to be used when it was the fact that it has not come to play in a long time is result of the example that was set when the first 2 went off please remember the bombs were measured in kilo tons at the time they are now mega tons one ICBM would bring any country to its knees with the multiple war heads they have. This is why know one wants to use them the old MAD sucks. If Russia had nukes while Hitler was tapping that ass back in the day you dont think they would have used them?

[futile]

Eagle. Why don't you suck on your own finger and go back to sleep? You have no idea about what you talking. It is very easy for someone to say "this should have not done that, this should have been this way" after all is done.

If America did not Abomb Japan to make them surrender, half of Japan is probably owned by Russia by now.

[lizardking]

Broad generalizations rarely hold up under scrutiny, and Eagle's is no exception. There is some truth, however, to his essential point that our nation has demonstrated itself to be overly aggressive at several points in history. The current wars are a very good example of this. In waging these wars, our leaders did infinitely more harm to our nation that did the 9/11 hijackers. I don't know if Osama bin Ladin is hiding in a cave in Afpak or a villa in the South of France, but wherever he is, he's probably laughing his ass off at our foolishness. My genuine belief - which I certainly cannot prove - is that Bush/Cheney initiated these wars in bad faith and in an effort to divert tax dollars to their cronies and constituents that profit from war. The only other remotely plausible explanation is stupidity, and I very begrudgingly give them more credit than that. Our collective propensity to rally behind jingoistic aggression made it possible for Bush/Cheney to sell these wars to the American public, and, considering the catastrophic impact the costs have wreaked on our nation's fiscal and economic health, we have truly been hoist upon our own petard.

Part of the problem is that we seem to have an fundamental inability to see our adversaries' perspective on anything. Take Iran. In the interest of paving the way for Big Oil to profit from Iranian resources, we propped up - and armed to the teeth - the Shah, a blood-thirsty dictator that disregarded civil rights by utilizing a brutal Gestapo-like secret police to imprison and murder his opposition and that raped his citizens of the benefit of their substantial natural resources. When he was finally overthrown by an inevitable popular uprising, we went next door and propped up another blood-thirsty dictator, Saddam, that murdered millions of his own citizens and raped his country of its natural resources. We armed Saddam to the teeth so that he could wage a brutally violent 10 year war with his neighbors in Iran. We apparently had no problem with his use of chemical weapons against the Iranians or all manner of other war crimes. We stuck with Saddam until he turned on the Kuwaiti's, with whom George I had an unnaturally close relationship via the House of Saud. And now we wonder why the Iranians hate us, and we have an active public discourse on the merits of "preemptively" attacking Iran. We hate the Iranians simply because they hate us. They've never really done anything to us (except hold some folks hostage for a while 30 years ago - but does that justify a war today? Get over it!). How would we feel if Iran had wreaked as much havoc in our country as we have in theirs? We would have passed the point of mere "public discourse" long ago. Iran would be lousy with Halliburton and Blackwater "contractors".

Someone is sure to raise the Iranian "nuclear threat" here. That's certainly a concern, but it is one we had better learn to deal with in some way other than violence. Eventually, anyone is going to be able to manufacture a nuclear device using instructions found on the internet and materials commonly available at WalMart. It will be as easy as cooking meth. Now, that may not be true in 10 years or 20, but odds are 100 years from now it will be. Prospects such as this, coupled with the explosive growth of the population on this planet, make war an increasingly unacceptable alternative. A corollary of this is that tolerance and peaceful co-existence are no longer just good ideas, they are becoming evolutionary imperatives.

[eagle]

Originally Posted by enderwiggin

Because you opened the topic here. You can't make a statement like, "The U.S.A is the most violent, warmongering country EVER", comparing them to every other nation or society that ever existed on the planet, without inviting others to examine that comparison to other nations -- Russia included.

Fine, whatever.

[eagle]

Originally Posted by trey

to act like Russia is so innocent in the nuclear race is bull shit. I do beleive they still hold the record for the largest nuclear test to date

Sir, you are totally wrong, here are the FACTS..

America has conduct more nuclear tests than any other nuclear power COMBINED Between 16 July 1945 and 23 September 1992 thank you.

Now Russia have only tests 715 between Agoust 29-1947 and 24 Octuber 1990............

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by eagle

America has conduct more nuclear tests than any other nuclear power COMBINED Between 16 July 1945 and 23 September 1992 thank you.

Good, I think it is a good thing to test weapon systems to assure they are reliable and work as intended. It would be a shame to send over a nuclear warhead to Iran and either it did a half-ass job or it destroyed part of a neighboring country that we consider to be an ally.

Additionally, "we" (that means the citizens of the United States as opposed to those common, lazy, and sleazy foreignors who sneak into this country, either under the pretense of some temporary visa or walking or swimming across an unprotected area of our border to avoid the "hastle" of "paper work" and verification of their backgrounds) would prefer to localize the damage and limit the collateral damage caused by a warhead, because like other circumstances "we" (see above) will go in and clean up the mess after the "dust" has settled, kind like "we" (see above) did in Chernobyl.

Speaking of "cleaning up" a mess, and that "might Russian army":

RussiaToday | December 12, 2007

By mid July 1941 the majority of tanks, which comprised the 20 thousand Soviet tank fleet were lost. The Werhmacht troops were advancing impetuously and kept approaching the Russian capital. Each tank at the Soviet army at the front was treated as treasury. And that's when the lend-lease supplies proved very timely. The first English Matilda and Valentine tanks arrived in the USSR in September 1941, and a month later they were already tested in action during the battles near Moscow.”


"Without American production the United Nations could never have won the war. -Joseph Stalin, during the Tehran Conference,1943

[eagle]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

Additionally, "we" (that means the citizens of the United States as opposed to those common, lazy, and sleazy foreignors who sneak into this country, either under the pretense of some temporary visa or walking or swimming across an unprotected area of our border to avoid the "hastle" of "paper work" and verification of their backgrounds)

If you don't like " foreignors " why don't you move to another planet?

You REALLLLLY most leave a very SAD life sir, because anywhere in America you will find " foreignors " and we are here to stay and good thing is that you have no power to kick us " the foreignors " out of this country. Mmmmm lazy mmmmm i work day and night and i don't take welfare.

[dearhunter]

I was always curious what russian koolaide looked like........now, I know.........too funny.

[eagle]

Originally Posted by dearhunter

I was always curious what russian koolaide looked like........now, I know.........too funny.

Oh yeah.

[Ty]

Brilliant!

[eagle]

Originally Posted by Ty

Brilliant!

Indeed.

[LexusLover]

Originally Posted by eagle

If you don't like " foreignors " why don't you move to another planet?

Sorry about the typo .... English scholar, but ....

.. I've noticed a trend of "talking points" .. not least of which are yours ...

that when someone discusses doing something (besides talking) about the PROBLEM in this country of people sneaking into or staying in this country ILLEGALLY, the response is a question like:

"What, you don't like immigrants?"

And now "we" have a modification to the question:

"What, you don't like foreignors?"

Perhaps "we" should automatically charge all persons who are here ILLEGALLY with "spying" .... throw their asses in prison .... while we build "our" case against them for "spying" .... like so many of our "friends" do.

Then we can charge $500,000 for a "bond" to be released to their "home" country .... and at 12 million ILLEGALS, we could retire our budget deficit into 2050.

[Note to self: Would not work, because folks from Mexico would not give 2 centavos for anyone of their ILLEGALS over here to go back home ... that is why they are here in the first place.]

[eagle]

Originally Posted by LexusLover

[Note to self: Would not work, because folks from Mexico would not give 2 centavos for anyone of their ILLEGALS over here to go back home ... that is why they are here in the first place.]

Mmmmm so when you goin back to your country? or you want to live forever and ever with your sad life sir? be happy like me and forget about ( THE FOROIGNERS ) lol life is GREAT live it to the fullist like i do...