Government’s pockets thinning, I thought tax cuts increased revenue

[Tiny]

Goodness. The world must be so simple for Blackman and TS Mokies. All they have to remember is "Democrat Good, Republican Bad." And then everything falls into place.

I've been following this thread but didn't have time to post. I figured I was going to have to come over here and kick some ass. But Lusty Lad's already done that for me. And DucButter applied the final shot to the head.

A couple of additional comments, federal receipts as a % of GDP in fiscal 2022, 19.2%, were the fourth highest in the history of the United States of America:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FYFRGDA188S

And despite a cut in the federal corporate rate from 35% to 21%, federal tax receipts on corporate income in fiscal 2022 were the highest since 2014:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FCTAX

You can't attribute this to tax increases during the Biden administration. In fact, despite controlling the presidency, Senate and House, I don't believe the Democrats rescinded any of the provisions of the Republicans' 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA). They actually extended some that were due to expire! And their only significant tax increase, the minimum tax on corporate income, didn't start until January 1, 2023.

So close-to-record high revenues were achieved with a tax regime last altered by the Republicans' TCJA. However, contrary to what Blackman says, I don’t believe tax revenues normally go up when tax rates are lowered. Although it wouldn't surprise me if the longer term revenue-maximizing rate from the federal corporate tax is lower than the 35% that was in effect before the TCJA. And the revenue maximizing rate for capital gains is almost certainly lower than the 43.4% that Biden was pushing.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Goodness. The world must be so simple for Blackman and TS Mokies. All they have to remember is "Democrat Good, Republican Bad." And then everything falls into place.

I've been following this thread but didn't have time to post. I figured I was going to have to come over here and kick some ass. But Lusty Lad's already done that for me. And DucButter applied the final shot to the head.

A couple of additional comments, federal receipts as a % of GDP in fiscal 2022, 19.2%, were the third highest in the history of the United States of America:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FYFRGDA188S

And despite a cut in the federal corporate rate from 35% to 21%, federal tax receipts on corporate income in fiscal 2022 were the highest since 2014:

https://fred.stlouisfed.org/series/FCTAX

You can't attribute this to tax increases during the Biden administration. In fact, despite controlling the presidency, Senate and House, I don't believe the Democrats rescinded any of the provisions of the Republicans' 2017 Tax Cuts and Jobs Act (TCJA). They actually extended some that were due to expire! And their only significant tax increase, the minimum tax on corporate income, didn't start until January 1, 2023.

So close-to-record high revenues were achieved with a tax regime last altered by the Republicans' TCJA. That's not to say lower rates necessarily result in higher tax revenues. Although it wouldn't surprise me if the longer term revenue-maximizing rate from the federal corporate tax is lower than the 35% that was in effect before the TCJA.

i'm TWK and i double like this post

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

i'm TWK and i double like this post

Haha! That's where those two likes came from

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by Tsmokies

The gop tax cuts increase revenue for the wealthy and corporations that own the gop. And...of course fucked the working people. Good thing megas are all wealthy or just too stupid to get a clue. Wonder which it is

if you say so

IRS data proves Trump tax cuts benefited middle, working-class Americans most

https://thehill.com/opinion/finance/...mericans-most/


President Biden and congressional Democrats’ Build Back Better (BBB) Act is now in the hands of the Senate. That legislative body’s 50-50 partisan split will undoubtedly make the bill’s passage difficult.


In order for BBB to become law, Democratic Senate leadership will need to convince moderates such as Sens. Kyrsten Sinema (D-Ariz.) and Joe Manchin (D-W.Va.) that the legislation’s $2.4 trillion price tag can be offset by expanding the IRS and its enforcement efforts while imposing substantial tax reform measures.


Congressional Democrats have argued that one of the best ways to pay for the legislation is to raise taxes on wealthy households, which, according to many on the left, have benefited disproportionately and unfairly from the 2017 tax reform law passed by Republicans and signed by former President Trump. The latest data, however, proves that this claim is pure mythology.


Income data published by the IRS clearly show that on average all income brackets benefited substantially from the Republicans’ tax reform law, with the biggest beneficiaries being working and middle-income filers, not the top 1 percent, as so many Democrats have argued.


A careful analysis of the IRS tax data, one that includes the effects of tax credits and other reforms to the tax code, shows that filers with an adjusted gross income (AGI) of $15,000 to $50,000 enjoyed an average tax cut of 16 percent to 26 percent in 2018, the first year Republicans’ Tax Cuts and Jobs Act went into effect and the most recent year for which data is available.


Filers who earned $50,000 to $100,000 received a tax break of about 15 percent to 17 percent, and those earning $100,000 to $500,000 in adjusted gross income saw their personal income taxes cut by around 11 percent to 13 percent.


By comparison, no income group with an AGI of at least $500,000 received an average tax cut exceeding 9 percent, and the average tax cut for brackets starting at $1 million was less than 6 percent. (For more detailed data, see my table published here.)


That means most middle-income and working-class earners enjoyed a tax cut that was at least double the size of tax cuts received by households earning $1 million or more.


What’s more, IRS data shows earners in higher income brackets contributed a bigger slice of the total income tax revenue pie following the passage of the tax reform law than they had in the previous year.


In fact, every income bracket with filers earning $200,000 or more increased its tax burden in 2018 compared to 2017, and every income bracket with a top limit lower than $200,000 paid a smaller proportion of the total personal tax revenue collected.


That means that Republicans’ tax reform law resulted in the tax code becoming slightly more progressive — the exact opposite of what Democrats have claimed over the past four years.


The IRS data further shows that the tax reform law — which included a variety of business tax cuts, including a large reduction in the corporate income tax rate — spurred economic mobility.


Every income bracket with a top level lower than $25,000 experienced a reduction in its number of filers, and every income bracket above $25,000 increased in size, with the biggest gains occurring in the brackets with a floor of at least $100,000.


The fact is, Republicans’ 2017 tax reform law did exactly what was promised: It lowered taxes for all income groups, provided the greatest benefits for middle-income households, and spurred economic growth that helped reduce poverty and improve prosperity.


It would be a grave mistake for Democrats to eliminate key parts of this important legislation.


Justin Haskins (Jhaskins@heartland.org) is director of the Socialism Research Center at The Heartland Institute and the co-author, with Glenn Beck, of the forthcoming book “The Great Reset: Joe Biden and the Rise of 21st Century Fascism.”

[Salty Again]

... Crikey! ... Look at that!

The tax cuts greatly helped the middle class.
Just as President Trump said they would! ...

### Salty

[farmstud60]

The problem with too many is they think all income is like a salary and thus changing tax rates only affects amount of revenue collected by the Federal Government.


Our tax code is so complicated that using a static analysis is worse than stupid.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Seems like that would reduce the amount of taxes needed.

[Ducbutter]

What is rather amusing about this thread is that Blkmn knew he had no basis for his claims, he was only slinging mud and hoping no one would call him on it. Even an attorney should recognize that a 30% reduction in tax revenue would be catastrophic. Seems to me he's spouting stuff he doesn't really believe. I thought that was bad?

[1blackman1]

Is a reduction year over year of 75 billion in collected tax revenue an increase or decrease?

Asking for a mathematician friend.

[Ducbutter]

Yeah, run with that.

[1blackman1]

So you don’t know whether being less is a reduction? I thought you at least knew basic mathematical concepts.

Revenue and collections last year this time > revenue and collections this year this time. Is this untrue?

[Ducbutter]

If your mathematician friend knew anything about statistics he'd have told you it was almost a 100% certainty receipts would fall so it's meaningless. And if they were any kind of actual friend they would tell you to quit being obtuse. You can keep showing your ass here but I think everyone who's followed the thread kmows you have nothing.
I'm out.

[1blackman1]

Bye sucka, don’t let the doorknob hit ya . . .

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Is a reduction year over year of 75 billion in collected tax revenue an increase or decrease?

Asking for a mathematician friend.

Is a reduction year over year of 75 billion in spending a good or bad thing? Can we do it again? Yes Please!

Asking for a tax paying friend.

[Texas Contrarian]

Here are a couple of additional points I would make about the recent tax revenue trajectory, taken in context.

For starters, if government's pockets appear to be thinning, that's due to skyrocketing levels of spending, not inadequate tax revenue. As lustylad noted, revenue grew at a virtually unprecedented rate in FY2021 and FY2022, ballooning from about $3.4T to an annual run rate of approximately $4.9T.

Then consider the timing of the effects of the multiple covid relief and stimulus packages of 2020-2021, especially the $1.9T ARP passed in March 2021. There's little disagreement with the view that total "relief and stimulus" spending was several trillion dollars in excess of what was needed to fill the output gap. As JP Morgan analysts noted in midyear 2021, this resulted in "excess savings" in household accounts of about $2.5T.

A first-order result was the unsustainable 5.7% headline GDP growth rate in calendar 2021, when consumers eager to get back to "normal" as the pandemic was winding down created pent-up demand for all manner of goods and services. This prompted various liberal commentators like Heather Cox Richardson and a number of others to write that it's "morning in America" again, and the economy is roaring. (No, it wasn't!)

But second- and higher-order effects naturally start to appear as that enormous pile of savings gets spent down and the apparently "roaring" economy begins to slow. That's what we're seeing now, as some consumption that under more normal circumstances might be occurring this year got pulled back into prior periods.

Consequently, a number of LEI components and other indicators have been weakening over the last 9-12 months. Earnings guidance numbers in many industries across wide swaths of the economy have also been on the decline in recent months.

When a tsunami of unsustainable stimulus measures are poured into an economy, creating an artificial boom, why is anyone surprised when government tax collections soon weaken by a few percentage points?