$$ Up Front

[jokacz]

I never pay up front unless asked to do so. And then I consider that a green light to open the menu discussion. If there is a hint of bait and switch, I'm gone, with my money.

The last few times I paid up front, I had to help the girl find where she put the money before I left. Guess I need to see a better class of whore. lol

[jackfengshui]

It appears that we are actually comparing 3 scenarios, not 2:

1. Money changing hands in the beginning.
2. Money/envelope on display from the beginning but not taken until the end.
3. Money changing hands at the end.

[JohnnyCap]

The answers vary wildly from my experience, which again, is that at a minimum 85% want money up front. Of course second visits are different, and I've no history of meeting these girls as guest speakers or as referrals from friends either. Not sure how much it has affected Paul, but whenever I've combined photography with the hobby, I've paid after. I have an honest face but I look like a cop...you know, chubby, short hair, in a cheap suit with powdered sugar all over it.

I'm surprised how many stories there are of never paying up front and it strengthens my resolve to not do so.

[jackfengshui]

Originally Posted by JohnnyCap

I'm surprised how many stories there are of never paying up front and it strengthens my resolve to not do so.

It is certainly your perogative, but that means insisting that every provider meeting you for the first time takes all the risk that you will not stiff her.

[RochBob]

Basically (as with most things in the Hobby) it comes down to what a Provider is comfortable doing or is required to do if working for an Agency and what the Client is comfortable doing. I can understand not wanting to pay upfront given several of the "Grab & Dash" stories that have been posted on the Board. But again. I only see a small group of verified Providers that I have known for a long time (in some cases Years). So we have an established set routine for our sessions and with rare exception I have never had any issues. These same Providers have also told me their stories about guys leaving shorted payments, empty envelopes and flat running out after the session is over without paying. So the potential for a rip off can and does go both ways.

[JohnnyCap]

Originally Posted by jackfengshui

It is certainly your perogative, but that means insisting that every provider meeting you for the first time takes all the risk that you will not stiff her.

Insisting is no way to start what should be a pleasant visit. I can see how my 'resolve' statement would sound that way but reason must prevail. The risk should be shared. I got picked off a few times in the 90s paying and not receiving, and a few times since, though it has happened less. Like anything else, reason and judgement are required.

I still find it surprising when any frequent hobbyist claims to never pay up front when my experience has been dramatically different. But as Fogarty sings, "half of what you see, none of what you hear."

[jackfengshui]

Originally Posted by JohnnyCap

The risk should be shared.

Hence my earlier proposal:

Originally Posted by jackfengshui

Paying up front means the hobbyist takes the risk. Paying afterwards means the provider takes the risk. Perhaps a compromise is paying half way through the activities. LOL