Money Makers

[samantha thom]

Originally Posted by cowboyesfan

I think you might be surprised...that works out to less than 4 clients per day with a standard 5 day work week.

Woahhh!!!! 4 clients a day for 5 days weekly?? Shittt!!! Who could do that constantly?? I don't think I could ever do that. I am ambitious but not enough to put my beautiful precious body to do that.

[guest043013-2]

Originally Posted by samantha thom

Woahhh!!!! 4 clients a day for 5 days weekly?? Shittt!!! Who could do that constantly?? I don't think I could ever do that. I am ambitious but not enough to put my beautiful precious body to do that.

Got to love these threads. Got to believe that gals who are doing 20 hours of sessions a week, assuming MSOG & the rest, still ain't charging more than $150/hour.

At 20 hours of session a week, considering a 40 hour work week, what is she doing the rest of her 20 hours.

1. Showering & clenaing up: I do hope she is doing this between each session, figuring 1/2 hour for each session, there went 10 hours.

2. Cleaning up the incall. Takes a bit of time to pick up all of the used condoms you guys claim to have blown through while achieving 5-10 orgasms in an hour. (Hope I am not revealing too much ROS information.) At least, change the sheets, tidy up a bit. 6 minutes per session, or 2 hours a week.

3. Going to the store to buy condoms in bulk. Figure she is doing 20 sessions, average of 5 condoms per session if these reviews are correct, then needs 100 condoms per week. Figure 2 hours per week for condom shopping and other misc. supplies for incall.

4. Getting hair, nails done, figure once every 2 weeks, at 2 hours, or 1 hour per week average.

If you are keeping track, we have 20 hours of sessions and 15 hours of prep work, probably missed a few items.

5. Scheduling johns through the revolving door of the incall. Based on my model above, a 2 hour window has to be allotted for each one hour session: on top of the 1 hour session, half hour cleanup, 6 minute room prep, so this means back-toback johns actually should have 1 hour between them. Great for a lady's private parts to have time to recover from all of the well hung guys who are pounding them for the full hour they describe in their reviews.

What actually goes into scheduling:

a. Back in forth calls/texts/emails/PMs to schedule. 15 minutes per session scheduled. With 20 sessions, that adds up to 5 hours per week. Ding-ding, we have hit 40 hour work week.

b. Back in forth with guys who eventually do not schedule or who are just wasting a gal's time: Bet that involves as much time as the ones that do schedule: add another 5 hours.

c. Screening new guys, figure that 1/2 of the guys a gal sees are repeats. I have no idea if this is a good guess, for some it may be high, others low, but hell, it is good for a guess. So 10 new guys a week to screen. If lucky, most are P411, so maybe 15 minutes a piece. 2 1/2 hours of screening a week.

d. Time spent advertising, checking out reviews on multiple websites, replying to threads on websites to stir up interest, replying to threads on websites to stroke some dufus so he will be a repeat and you don't have to take risks with some new guy, etc. Varies, I bet a good average is 4-5 hours a week.

Ladies, I am not trying to suggest how you run your business, how you should run your business, or that I even think any of you are doing 20 sessions a week. The only providers I imagine doing that volume are AMPs, BP gals who are under pimp required quotas, & massage providers who are not providing FS.

I know how sore my jaw & tongue have gotten after an intense 20-30 minute daty session. I can't imagine a gal providing 20 oral sessions a week and having a jaw left. Especially with all of the 9+ inch wonders who brag about the face fuck they do to you.

Since I have no vagina, and have never experience (& never plan to experience) anal sex performed on me, I can't begin to imagine what 20 sessions of FS would do to a lady. I do know that my little tickler has left more than one lady sore after a FS session to the point where she said it was closed for business for the next day. Twenty repeats in a week has got to leave a lady's private parts totally useless.

[Guest020720]

tigercat....

are you a hooker?

wow...that's some serious insight.

don't forget time spent in chat to either drum up biz or just shoot the shit.

i feel your pain on the daty. my first time with just a straight up lesbian - i couldn't pronounce anything with the letters L or TH in them the next day.

I've cut clients out early (and given money back) that wanted me to go for another pop in a session when I knew the first pop was tough to get. I wanted to still be presentable at my kids' PTA meeting or my real job later that day. Just because I can "suck some hella good dick" doesn't mean there aren't repercussions to myself after the fact - especially if the client takes a lot longer than usual or likes it a lot rougher than usual. Add those two together, and well yeah...I can't do that for another go round. I don't see many girls doing it like that over and over and over again with 4 clients a day, 5 days a week.

What are they going to have? BJ callouses inside their mouths from covering their teeth?

Be a bit more realistic here.

TC provided some good insight.

I know we are a fantasy for you all - and some of you don't like thinking about how many clients the ladies see before or after you - so on and so forth...but there might be other reasons for that. Who knows.

I like how I run my biz - and I let the other ladies run their biz. I don't care how much they make. Let their CPA deal with it. Not me.

[guest043013-2]

Originally Posted by tntangie

tigercat....
are you a hooker?
wow...that's some serious insight....

No, but I have spent a few hours with some, both BCD and across from the table.

I did have Logan accuse me once of actually being a provider.

Somewhere, either here or on ASPD, I once broke down a rough idea of expenses for providers, and how a gross take of $400K or whatever you may think these ladies are making ends up being much less when you subtract out the expenses. I think I even took it to an hourly take home pay, and it was not that great.

Of course, if there is a pimp taking a cut, then all of my calculations are way off.

[Prolongus]

Was with a traveling Provider this summer and she LOVED to gossip; she saw a client the day before who told her he knew of a Dallas-area Provider that was pulling in $250,000 a year...asked her who the client was; she couldn't remember. Or the Provider's name.

And that's not the first time I've heard of Providers making 6 figures.
But...it's none of my business...just thought it odd she would bring it up.

[Prolongus]

Traci Brooks posted an OUTSTANDING thread about Provider expenses and time frames a while back...a real eye opener...should've been a Sticky. Just remembered it was so good, I copied it and kept it. Really worth reading if anyone hasn't:

Expenses:
Hotel rooms: $65-$120/night (taxes and fees included). Let's say average $95/night. Since I'm traveling full time now, I have to get a hotel room every night, whether I get an appt that day or not, plus I have to get an extended stay room for the week I'm off, which a half-decent one will cost about $400/week or more. So that's almost $2600 in hotel expenses alone. 9 appointments just to pay for a place to work and sleep.

Travel: Traveling full-time, it's easy to log hundreds and hundreds of miles in a month. My next trip is to Memphis and Nashville. Were I not having to take that next week off, I would continue my trip outward from there. That's about 650 miles, and lets add another 50 just for driving around the cities, going to get supplies, going out to eat, etc etc. And that's not even a full week's trip. But let's just say it is. Plus, add another, oh, 50 miles for my week off. 2000 miles/mo in my truck, which averages 20 MPG, and with gas at about $3.50/gallon, that's almost $350 in gas. Not to mention wear and tear on my truck, all my maintenance costs, etc. I'd say over the past 3 months (which admittedly have been particularly bad for my poor truck) I've spent about $400/mo on maintenance. Total: $750

Food: Let's just make this one easy and say I spend $7/meal, three times a day. I aimed a little low, because sometimes I get free breakfast at the hotels (though most 4 star hotels I've stayed at do not offer free breakfast) and sometimes I eat fast food, or even just get to grocery shop. Remember, I'm on the road, and I don't have a fridge to store groceries. If I end up eating at restaurants a lot, this number can go up significantly. So, $21/day, 30 days a month. Total: $630

Supplies: I'm lumping ALL of my work supplies together. Sexy dresses, condoms, candles, lotion, lube, panties, shoes, baby wipes, mouthwash, mints, shower gel, make up (yes, I consider this a work expense, because frankly, I don't wear much make up very often when I'm not working).. and the list goes on. I would say I spend somewhere between $150-$200/mo on supplies. Let's average that. Total: $175

Self Maintenance: Fact is, I have to be as flawless as possible for you guys. I know some of you will say that for you I don't need mani-pedis and hair care and all of that, but the fact is, most of you DO expect such self care from us. If I answer the door without looking my best, and the next lady DOES look her best, it's not hard to figure out who you might prefer to see. Anyway, hair color and cut = $150 tip included. Mani-Pedi and eyebrow wax every two weeks = $60 each trip, tip included. Keep in mind, I go to cheapish places, that number can be higher if the lady likes expensive treatment. Also, I have to get expensive facial washes and moisturizers and such to avoid break outs, lotion, hair spray/gel, etc etc that can easily cost me $100/mo in all. I'm also getting laser hair removal for $700 and I got cosmetic dentistry recently which was about $3000 including travel expenses, PLUS it cost me a month off work. But since those are one time things, we won't include them in the total. Personally, I do not get massages, but many ladies do, and I probably should, so I'm saving a bit of money there. I also don't tan, get facials, leg/lip/bikini waxing, or a number of other things that other ladies might. Adding in a fraction of less frequent self-maintenance things (brazillian blowouts, for example)... Total: $400/mo

I'll stop here with expenses. If you took my 25 appts a month and multiplied that by my 1 hour rate (which is the majority of my appointments) you came up with a seemingly very cushy number. We've gone through 2/3 of that already, and this is not in any way how much I have to spend to live, simply to work and eat and sleep. I also have a phone bill, a storage room bill, a dog to support (and a petsitter to pay while I'm traveling), car insurance, etc etc etc. I know it seems like we as providers should be living the high life and have thousands to save a month, but that's simply not reality.

Labor:
Now, for those of you who are like "But Traci, that's still a pretty good damn living for only working 25 hours a month." The fact is, I work WAY more than 25 hours a month. Here's a basic breakdown of my labor:

Advertising/Website maintenance: This I pay someone for, but at one time, I did do it myself (and not nearly as well, I might add). At that time, I'd say I averaged about an hour a day on these things.

Emails/Phone Calls/Screening: Time. Consuming. You can believe that I spend around 3-5 hours a day answering emails and making/receiving phone calls or text messages, and researching and screening clients. Easy. Sometimes more. I know you're sitting there thinking "But you only average 1 or 2 appointments a day, how could you possibly spend that much time on client communication and screening?!" Well, there are usually many more than one or two phone calls and email exchanges per client/per appointment that walks through my door. Not to mention most guys do not send screening information in their first message, and do not send ALL of their screening info in the second or third, even. Also, a majority of guys that contact me are time-wasters that will never come see me. Then I have to track down ladies who may or may not get back to me, ask for replacement references for those who didn't, answer questions, maintain a little flirtation (not too much, please), and so on.

Getting ready: 2 1/2 hours a day, initially. Shower, shave, hair, makeup, get dressed, get room ready. If I have a second appointment, 1 hour to bathe, freshen up, and get the room ready again. Also, another half hour to clean up after appointment, if I don't have another one coming.

Appointment: If it's a one hour appointment, I'm actually probably spending 75 minutes here. A few minutes waiting for you to arrive, and then most gents do not actually leave within the hour, but maybe 5 or 10 past. And those are the respectful ones.

I'd say even on days when I only have one appointment, I'm easily spending 6 hours on work. And for those of you that did the math and thought "That's still a pretty good hourly wage," please see the expenses section.

This post is only meant to reflect MY expenses/labor. Another lady's may be very, very different from mine. Also, this post is in no way meant to be all inclusive, just sort of a general idea of what it's like and some food for thought. Keep in mind, I don't have kids, and MANY ladies do. Imagine adding the cost of a supporting a whole other person or two to this mix. Jeez.

[Red Tex]

I would imagine that after incall expenses that most girls clear less than 40k a year. Yes some make more than that but I imagine the number is cut in half for each 10K in increase.

I am "friends" with a retired dancer. She told me at Clubhouse she could make a grand a night on weekends. That is 50 dances! She said she could barely move on Sunday. Her honesty is rare and refreshing.

[cowboyesfan]

Originally Posted by tigercat

gals who are under pimp required quotas

Yep, thats exactly who I was thinking of.

[Guest020720]

TC - i wasn't accusing...i was teasing.

But you and prolongus added a very refreshing insight into a fulltime provider's life.

this is yet another reason i A. stayed low volume from the beginning (never had an incall of my own) and B. prefer to stay low volume now and focus on the hobby being a "side income".

I don't have the energy or desire to make this a "full time job".

My day job is something I really do want to do - even though it isn't at the income level I want right now. Yes, it pays the bills. Yes, it is flexible enough while I am in college. And it leaves my evenings and weekends open for being able to do the provider thing on the side.

It does help that I have a stable background as a provider that I can set my schedule at a level I'm comfortable with and know I will still have interest from clients even as I slow down during the semester.

[samantha thom]

Originally Posted by tigercat

Got to love these threads. Got to believe that gals who are doing 20 hours of sessions a week, assuming MSOG & the rest, still ain't charging more than $150/hour.

At 20 hours of session a week, considering a 40 hour work week, what is she doing the rest of her 20 hours.

1. Showering & clenaing up: I do hope she is doing this between each session, figuring 1/2 hour for each session, there went 10 hours.

2. Cleaning up the incall. Takes a bit of time to pick up all of the used condoms you guys claim to have blown through while achieving 5-10 orgasms in an hour. (Hope I am not revealing too much ROS information.) At least, change the sheets, tidy up a bit. 6 minutes per session, or 2 hours a week.

3. Going to the store to buy condoms in bulk. Figure she is doing 20 sessions, average of 5 condoms per session if these reviews are correct, then needs 100 condoms per week. Figure 2 hours per week for condom shopping and other misc. supplies for incall.

4. Getting hair, nails done, figure once every 2 weeks, at 2 hours, or 1 hour per week average.

If you are keeping track, we have 20 hours of sessions and 15 hours of prep work, probably missed a few items.

5. Scheduling johns through the revolving door of the incall. Based on my model above, a 2 hour window has to be allotted for each one hour session: on top of the 1 hour session, half hour cleanup, 6 minute room prep, so this means back-toback johns actually should have 1 hour between them. Great for a lady's private parts to have time to recover from all of the well hung guys who are pounding them for the full hour they describe in their reviews.

What actually goes into scheduling:

a. Back in forth calls/texts/emails/PMs to schedule. 15 minutes per session scheduled. With 20 sessions, that adds up to 5 hours per week. Ding-ding, we have hit 40 hour work week.

b. Back in forth with guys who eventually do not schedule or who are just wasting a gal's time: Bet that involves as much time as the ones that do schedule: add another 5 hours.

c. Screening new guys, figure that 1/2 of the guys a gal sees are repeats. I have no idea if this is a good guess, for some it may be high, others low, but hell, it is good for a guess. So 10 new guys a week to screen. If lucky, most are P411, so maybe 15 minutes a piece. 2 1/2 hours of screening a week.

d. Time spent advertising, checking out reviews on multiple websites, replying to threads on websites to stir up interest, replying to threads on websites to stroke some dufus so he will be a repeat and you don't have to take risks with some new guy, etc. Varies, I bet a good average is 4-5 hours a week.

Ladies, I am not trying to suggest how you run your business, how you should run your business, or that I even think any of you are doing 20 sessions a week. The only providers I imagine doing that volume are AMPs, BP gals who are under pimp required quotas, & massage providers who are not providing FS.

I know how sore my jaw & tongue have gotten after an intense 20-30 minute daty session. I can't imagine a gal providing 20 oral sessions a week and having a jaw left. Especially with all of the 9+ inch wonders who brag about the face fuck they do to you.

Since I have no vagina, and have never experience (& never plan to experience) anal sex performed on me, I can't begin to imagine what 20 sessions of FS would do to a lady. I do know that my little tickler has left more than one lady sore after a FS session to the point where she said it was closed for business for the next day. Twenty repeats in a week has got to leave a lady's private parts totally useless.

Woww...that is a very long post! With my ADHD, you almost lost me there, tigercat! LOL
If the reality of providing is close to what you described above, I would have quit a looong time ago!!! Wow...that's depressing!

[guest043013-2]

Ms. Thom,

I will say that what I described is a reality for some ladies. Ladies in AMPs, I would guess are seeing this type of volume. Ladies on BP with their pimps or managers have quotas that require this to be their life.

I would hope that few if any of our DFW mainstream ECCIE providers find themselves enduring a life as described. Those that do will burn out, turn to things we don't talk about here for an escape, or end up on the street, a shell of their former selves.

I have seen what happens to ladies who participate at these high levels, and it ain't pretty. I am glad you recognize the quality of life you desire and choose to set your limits accordingly.

Angie,

I did not take any offense at your comment, rather I took it as a compliment that I was able to see the female side of things. (Of course, when you are a dumb schmuck like me, being naive allows you to ignore actual insults and go through life a happy, care-free schmuck. There are advantages, after all.)

I think the biggest thing for many of the ladies to take from this is that they need to have a plan, or they will find themselves one day perhaps being a living, breathing sex doll to multiple clients a day. Angie has a plan. I have spoken to others with a plan to leave the hobby when the kids grow up, when the kids start school, etc. All of these are good. Just make sure that your plan has the details to enable you to actually move forward.

A plan and a dream are not the same thing. I dream of being a millionaire on my own island in the Carribean. My plan is to work my ass off for the next 20 years, hope I can start collecting SS in a few less than that, and die a broke, horny, dirty old man.

[LovingKayla]

What is up with money lately. Austin has a thread about where providers spend their money and how it matters sooooo much to some people (I personally give mine to save gay baby whales in the muslim brotherhood.)

The numbers listed here in the OP thread are not that far off IF IF IF, there were not such a thing as summer and holidays and historically slow seasons.

I would argue that out of 700 providers in Dallas, only 300 are solid, well reputable providers. The other 400 are flavor of the month, come and go types. Even in a bad economy pussy will still sell like.... well.... pussy.

Most providers have no idea how much money flows through their hands. I hated looking at my numbers last year. Over head takes up about 30% for me. If you include taxes, that would be another 30-40% or more depending.


It should be the providers doing these numbers for themselves. It can be both depressing and exhilarating to see the sort of numbers that are possible with a well informed and business savvy provider (overhead and profit.)


Cheers!

~K~

Originally Posted by tigercat

A plan and a dream are not the same thing. I dream of being a millionaire on my own island in the Carribean. My plan is to work my ass off for the next 20 years, hope I can start collecting SS in a few less than that, and die a broke, horny, dirty old man.

Tiger there's a rather expensive convention class in dallas the last weekend of Jan to teach Covered Calls. If you have a portfolio of any kind, you may want to check this out. My results on covered calls are astonishing. I will actually be able to retire in 10 years. I'll be free of kids and leaving every flipping day for a job by 43.

[Guest112916]

Don't let the Occupy Hippies find out about all this money. They might show up and demand a thread wanting their share. Or even worse, Providers that don't make as much as they feel they should will start camping out at the incalls of Providers that make more $.

[guest043013-2]

Originally Posted by LovingKayla

...It should be the providers doing these numbers for themselves. It can be both depressing and exhilarating to see the sort of numbers that are possible with a well informed and business savvy provider (overhead and profit.) ...

And Kayla, that was the main reason for my posting on this thread. We have a lot of new ladies, BP transplants in many cases, that have probably been surviving on a wing & prayer, and sadly, on what their pimp doles out to them.

Those are the people who need to see these threads and get an understanding of the potential they can achieve, and the price they may have to pay to achieve that success.

The Class A providers like Kayla, Angie, Samantha, and many others who have probably ignored this thread, don't need it. They understand their business plan. They know how to manage their money. Sure, there will be bumps in the road. But proper planning can get you over those bumps.

Good luck to all, it is a hard business. Just cuz you can spend much of the hard labor lying on your back does not reduce the work and stress of this career choice.

[Logan]

Originally Posted by tntangie

tigercat....

are you a hooker?

wow...that's some serious insight.

Originally Posted by tigercat

I did have Logan accuse me once of actually being a provider.

Tigercat, I STILL think you might be Cathy’s male handle….he he