A barrel of oil is worth nothing!

[Grace Preston]

Point blank... AOC and Trump are flip sides of the same coin. Both blinded by their own bullshit and so convinced in their own brilliance that they cannot accept when they are blatantly wrong. When I mention I'm not a huge fan of Trump-- I always get some iteration of "So you like that dumbassed AOC". Um... no, they're the same damn person, just on opposite ends of the spectrum.



Reminds me of a hat my grandpa used to have hanging on the wall "If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit".

[Jacuzzme]

Best I can find is she graduated in 2011 but never had a real job until the House in 2018. Why does someone supposedly so bright not have a job waiting after graduation, or at least manage to land one in her field in 7 years? She certainly comes across dumb AF so my hypothesis is bad interviewer.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by Grace Preston

Reminds me of a hat my grandpa used to have hanging on the wall "If you can't dazzle them with brilliance, baffle them with bullshit".

I question whether the Trump fans actually believe all of it. I mean, how can you? AOC's supporters on the other hand are true believers. They drank the Kool Aid.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

Best I can find is she graduated in 2011 but never had a real job until the House in 2018. Why does someone supposedly so bright not have a job waiting after graduation, or at least manage to land one in her field in 7 years? She certainly comes across dumb AF so my hypothesis is bad interviewer.

She's hot. With tips maybe she got more than she could from an entry level position. She graduated in 2011 when the economy wasn't exactly booming.

[eccieuser9500]

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

Best I can find is she graduated in 2011 but never had a real job until the House in 2018.

Is a Representative government job where you just talk, and get paid other peoples money, a real job?

Maybe another alphabet soup of labor programs? Like a Green New Deal? Real jobs? To bring us out of the dark? Or just go to war for oil? Right Tiny? It is big business.

All I am saying, is give war a chance.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by eccieuser9500

Is a Representative government job where you just talk, and get paid other peoples money, a real job?

Maybe another alphabet soup of labor programs? Like a Green New Deal? Real jobs? To bring us out of the dark? Or just go to war for oil? Right Tiny? It is big business.

All I am saying, is give Communism a chance.

FTFY


BAHHAAA

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by eccieuser9500

Is a Representative government job where you just talk, and get paid other peoples money, a real job?

Maybe another alphabet soup of labor programs? Like a Green New Deal? Real jobs? To bring us out of the dark? Or just go to war for oil? Right Tiny? It is big business.

All I am saying, is give war a chance.

The Green New Deal would increase the chances we'd get into a war over oil, or at least it would make us more dependent on foreign oil. It calls for rapidly cutting net carbon emissions in the USA to zero. And for drastically reducing oil and gas production in the USA by banning hydraulic fracturing. There's no way we could walk away from fossil fuels as quickly as AOC et al think. So we'd end up dependent on oil imports. We're the Saudi Arabia of natural gas, a clean burning, lower carbon fuel. We'd end up importing that too.

Yeah, if there were any kind of a silver lining in being ruled by AOC or Bernie Sanders, it's that we'd be less likely to go to war. By that time it wouldn't make any difference to me as I'd be long gone. Goodbye USA, hello Costa Rica.

[Levianon17]

Originally Posted by HedonistForever

I hear that AOC just posted that she is glad the oil industry has collapsed.


So this idiot thinks the oil and gas industry could shut down and the world would survive? And this is the future of the Democratic party? Their best and brightest? Of course we should get to renewable energy as fast as possible but that isn't tomorrow.


The American way of life would cease to exist if oil companies all went bankrupt and shuttered.

That's what this whole thing is about collapsing the economy. It's been in the making for a long time. I always wondered how they would pull it off. I saw an 8 0z. bottle of fucking sanitizer today that was worth more than a Barrel of oil. This was all done by design. Our so called leaders are not looking out for us at all. I will no longer comply.

[Sienna91]

Why are we surprised. There are so many things going on in the news beside the coronavirus and no one else is paying attention.

And that's exactly what they want.

[Sienna91]

And you're right about hand sanitizer being more than oil. Stores are literally selling peroxide, water, and glycerin mixed for about $13 for 30 ounces . Before the coronavirus popped off I believe hydrogen peroxide was around $0.50 to a dollar for 16 oz. And the companies that distribute liquor are the ones that are selling it for those prices.

And yet they say stores are not allowed to price gouge. but that's definitely what it is because before this happened you could literally buy all the supplies for less than they're selling one bottle

[lustylad]

Here's a good analysis of yesterday's price collapse:

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/artic...d-inelasticity

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by eccieuser9500

And this is where the current deal-making genius got us.

Just had to chime in Tiny. She knows the value of hard work. Not capital gains. Workers of the world take power.

Neither you nor AOC knows the value of taking risks, of which capital gains are the fruit and capital losses are the agony.

If you don't think having open, legal and free-functioning markets (in oil and everything else practicable) to price signal our individual and collective decisions is a good thing, try not having them.

[lustylad]

Originally Posted by Tiny

Being a free marketer I tend to think the U.S. government shouldn't get involved. But if prices remain low for a long time it'll be a pity to see the power back in the Saudis' and Russians' hands, after North American production has slowed to a trickle. They'll be able to raise prices at will...

I don't follow your logic. If and when prices recover, why wouldn't we be able to resume producing? I think low energy prices hurt the Russians and Saudis more than us, both short term and long term.

(Calling Daniel Yergin. Please pick up the white courtesy phone.)

[nevergaveitathought]

Originally Posted by lustylad

I don't follow your logic. If and when prices recover, why wouldn't we be able to resume producing? I think low energy prices hurt the Russians and Saudis more than us, both short term and long term.

(Calling Daniel Yergin. Please pick up the white courtesy phone.)

if the recovery takes time

there wont be any independents left to resume producing

and the service companies wont be manned and all their equipment will have been stacked

and leases will have expired and so on and so on

we'd have to groom a new generation of risk takers and they aren't so easy to come by in todays world

so yeah, a little while we can resume, a long while, not so easy to bounce back

and to bounce back we need at least $40 oil (in todays cost structure) to make it worth someone's while

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by lustylad

I don't follow your logic. If and when prices recover, why wouldn't we be able to resume producing? I think low energy prices hurt the Russians and Saudis more than us, both short term and long term.

(Calling Daniel Yergin. Please pick up the white courtesy phone.)

Low energy prices do hurt government revenues and GDP in Russia and Saudi Arabia much more than they hurt us. If you ignore the effect on energy security and if prices stay low I'm not even sure this would have a net negative effect on our economy. This is where YOU need to pick up the white phone and call Yergin. He's not going to take my call, but there's no way he's going to fuck around with Steve Mnuchin.

Low prices however do hurt our oil and gas industry worse than theirs. Saudi Arabia is one of the world's lowest cost producers. Their industry can go through this unscathed. The Russians are low cost producers too. In percentage terms, the Russian government taxes its producers at much higher rates when the price of oil is high. From a link I'll place below, “Under the current tax regime, it is the Russian state that shoulders most of the risks associated with low oil prices, Marinchenko said. With crude at $50 Russian producers pay more than 40% of their revenues in taxes, his calculations show. If the price falls to $25 the share of taxes declines to just around 20%, and in the $15-$20 scenario, the fiscal burden nearly disappears, Marinchenko said."

Russian companies supposedly can break even around $20 a barrel. It's the Russian government that takes the biggest hit from low prices, in the form of lower government revenues.

Nevergaveitathought gives a excellent summary of the effect on the U.S. industry. I'd place the break even point for independents, with no return on capital, at about $45 per barrel in 2019, but that's quibbling. Based on past booms and busts, if this lasts long enough you'll see rigs salvaged for steel, wells plugged, and the labor force will leave the oil field and do something else. The financial effect on the producers and the service companies will be severe. The producers have way too much debt and at $35 per barrel the majority will go under.

A lot of U.S. production is now from shales and the like. You can drill these wells and get them on stream in months instead of the years that it takes to develop an offshore oil field or an enhanced recovery project. Shale wells come on at high rates and decline like a bat out of hell. The rate at the end of the first year of production is typically less than 50% of the rate at the start. This has its pluses and minuses. A minus is that it means in a relatively short period of time U.S. production will decline precipitously and we'll become a net importer of oil again, because we won't be drilling more wells with low oil prices. A plus is that when you ramp back up the industry when prices come up you can increase production quickly. But that's only if you've got the equipment, the manpower and the capital to do the job. And those are going to disappear if prices stay low long enough.

So should we do something about this? Tariffs on oil? Enforce limits on U.S. production? My gut tells me no, but that's above my pay grade. Another good question for Yergin.

Russian oil article:

https://fortune.com/2020/03/12/saudi...oil-price-war/