H1B Visa scam in disgusting detail.

[gnadfly]

This has been going on for decades. The only thing that surprises me in this article is the H1B1 workers recording everything electronically and usually in a department of say 50 IT workers they'd keep like 3 Americans thru a transition period.

We discussed this at length on eraps. Candidate Obama said he would do something about American companies that shipped jobs overseas. Nothing. Then President Obama appointed Jeffery Immelt to head up the "Jobs Council." Immelt is the GE head that was shipping GE divisions over to China. Again, nothing from the Jobs Council or our President.

As far as IT work goes, it doesn't matter anymore. As I said in the 1990's that "giant sucking sound" was coming thru a fiber optic line. We've offshored most of our IT. Our systems are housed mainly in Asia. Bad infrastructure issues we just have to live with it which isn't that hard because the jobs that used those systems also were offshored to Asia. A lot of our US taxes are done...guess where...Asia.

[Rey Lengua]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

I didn't even read past the first two sentences, because it wasn't in english and I don't speak idiot cocktard.

Again, you were asked a real question and you spent a shitload of words saying absolutely NOTHING.

Somewhere in there, you said something about wanting to keep Americans in american jobs, yes? Well, lookee here what I found:

"On Feb. 17, 2009, President Obama signed into law the American Recovery and Reinvestment Act of 2009 (“stimulus bill”), Public Law 111-5.[38] Section 1661 of the ARRA incorporates the Employ American Workers Act (EAWA) by Senators Sanders (I-Vt.) and Grassley (R-Iowa) to limit certain banks and other financial institutions from hiring H-1B workers unless they had offered positions to equally or better-qualified U.S. workers, and to prevent banks from hiring H-1B workers in occupations they had laid off U.S. workers from."

Here is the hated Obama, your sworn enemy, actually trying to save american jobs being taken by foreigners. Now, you would never hear about this on Faux news, because it doesn't fit the story of Obama being against america. Here, it clearly states that these companies must offer positions to equally or better-qualified AMERICAN workers BEFORE they can hire a foreigner.

Now, what do you have to say to that? Can you respond without using the words 'gloryhole', 'puto', 'swishy', etc.? I doubt it. You don't have the brains.

Why sure I can woomby ! But before I respond to YOUR question and your typical liberal DEMAND, how 'bout YOU respond to my question from WEEKS ago ? As in ( to refresh your lying liberal selective memory... ) What branch of the U. S. military did YOU serve in, during what years, for how long, what was your MOS, AFSC, RATE ? So you'll get a response to your " Queery-ey " when you answer, COMPLETELY, my long time pending question. If you didn't serve and admit it, it's better for you that you own up to it rather than tell me that your Rambo , Chuck Norris and ( meaner than those two candy asses combined ) Master Sargent Roy Benavidez all combined. Those blisters that form in your mouth, FROM TELLING THE TRUTH FOR ONCE IN YOUR MISERABLE LIFE, won't last forever. And we all know that it's different taste than your used to, but show us that a eunuch can speak the truth AT LEAST ONCE !!!! If not .... well it's back to normal and you know where for YOU.

[DSK]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

This is your beloved capitalism in action. Are you honestly surprised? I told you weeks ago that it is predicated on cheap labor.

Regulated capitalism is what we have in effect, as I'm sure you know. It has rules, and our government should have a certain predilection for the workers as well as the owners of the means of production. It should enforce the rules that benefit American citizens, not foreign interlopers.

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

Your highlighted statement is incorrect

http://www.forbes.com/2009/06/03/har...mployment.html

http://www.eremedia.com/tlnt/u-s-emp...ineering-jobs/

http://www.kansascity.com/news/busin...cle652498.html

Thank you for - once again - confusing cause and effect.

If engineering and math jobs PAID BETTER - instead of wages being artificially depressed by imported foreign engineers - there would be more math and science students.

I have a BS and an MS in a technical field and there were plenty of engineers back in the 1980s when I got those degrees. Because the jobs promised a solid, upper middle class income back in those days.

Can you say the same now? Tuition costs are through the roof, but math/engineering wages have been flattened (after adjusting for inflation) since the 1990s.

So, the smart minds end up going into finance or something else.

And Disney keeps bringing in Indian engineers who have low tuition or NO tuition costs to work for a fraction of the American's wage.

Students go where the money is. There a lot less people going to law school now than there were back in the 1990s and early 2000s because an oversupply of lawyers depressed wages. The situation was made worse when we sank into a deep recession in 2008, which greatly reduced the number of business transactions and the need for lawyers. The 1-2 punch greatly reduced law firm income and increased unemployment among law school grads. The result? A huge drop in law school enrollment.

So, if you keep depressing math, science, and engineering wages by letting in 65,000 foreigner per year, why would you be surprised that US students pursue other disciplines?

You would understand that if you knew anything about economics. Which you clearly do not.

Cause and effect - try to keep them straight.

[i'va biggen]

One of Trump's subsidiarity's got visa's for 1,100 foreign workers, wonder if they were H1B'S?

[Rey Lengua]

QUOTE=ExNYer;1057167918]Thank you for - once again - confusing cause and effect.

If engineering and math jobs PAID BETTER - instead of wages being artificially depressed by imported foreign engineers - there would be more math and science students.

I have a BS and an MS in a technical field and there were plenty of engineers back in the 1980s when I got those degrees. Because the jobs promised a solid, upper middle class income back in those days.

Can you say the same now? Tuition costs are through the roof, but math/engineering wages have been flattened (after adjusting for inflation) since the 1990s.

So, the smart minds end up going into finance or something else.

And Disney keeps bringing in Indian engineers who have low tuition or NO tuition costs to work for a fraction of the American's wage.

Students go where the money is. There a lot less people going to law school now than there were back in the 1990s and early 2000s because an oversupply of lawyers depressed wages. The situation was made worse when we sank into a deep recession in 2008, which greatly reduced the number of business transactions and the need for lawyers. The 1-2 punch greatly reduced law firm income and increased unemployment among law school grads. The result? A huge drop in law school enrollment.

So, if you keep depressing math, science, and engineering wages by letting in 65,000 foreigner per year, why would you be surprised that US students pursue other disciplines?

You would understand that if you knew anything about economics. Which you clearly do not.

Cause and effect - try to keep them straight.[/QUOTE]
What ? !!! ANOTHER thread where woomby gets his swishy walking, well hammered ass handed to him over economics ? Say it ain't so !!!!! :cla p:

[WombRaider]

Originally Posted by Rey Lengua

Why sure I can woomby ! But before I respond to YOUR question and your typical liberal DEMAND, how 'bout YOU respond to my question from WEEKS ago ? As in ( to refresh your lying liberal selective memory... ) What branch of the U. S. military did YOU serve in, during what years, for how long, what was your MOS, AFSC, RATE ? So you'll get a response to your " Queery-ey " when you answer, COMPLETELY, my long time pending question. If you didn't serve and admit it, it's better for you that you own up to it rather than tell me that your Rambo , Chuck Norris and ( meaner than those two candy asses combined ) Master Sargent Roy Benavidez all combined. Those blisters that form in your mouth, FROM TELLING THE TRUTH FOR ONCE IN YOUR MISERABLE LIFE, won't last forever. And we all know that it's different taste than your used to, but show us that a eunuch can speak the truth AT LEAST ONCE !!!! If not .... well it's back to normal and you know where for YOU.

What does any of that have to do with Obama and answering this question? Typical, you have nothing, so you deflect using some bullshit. I never said I served in the military. Not once did I ever state that, so your question is without merit. Are you going to comment on Obama trying to save American jobs?

[WombRaider]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

Thank you for - once again - confusing cause and effect.

If engineering and math jobs PAID BETTER - instead of wages being artificially depressed by imported foreign engineers - there would be more math and science students.

I have a BS and an MS in a technical field and there were plenty of engineers back in the 1980s when I got those degrees. Because the jobs promised a solid, upper middle class income back in those days.

Can you say the same now? Tuition costs are through the roof, but math/engineering wages have been flattened (after adjusting for inflation) since the 1990s.

So, the smart minds end up going into finance or something else.

And Disney keeps bringing in Indian engineers who have low tuition or NO tuition costs to work for a fraction of the American's wage.

Students go where the money is. There a lot less people going to law school now than there were back in the 1990s and early 2000s because an oversupply of lawyers depressed wages. The situation was made worse when we sank into a deep recession in 2008, which greatly reduced the number of business transactions and the need for lawyers. The 1-2 punch greatly reduced law firm income and increased unemployment among law school grads. The result? A huge drop in law school enrollment.

So, if you keep depressing math, science, and engineering wages by letting in 65,000 foreigner per year, why would you be surprised that US students pursue other disciplines?

You would understand that if you knew anything about economics. Which you clearly do not.

Cause and effect - try to keep them straight.

You're stuck in the 80s. What good does production of talent do if we aren't paying them?

[DSK]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

You're stuck in the 80s. What good does production of talent do if we aren't paying them?

WormRaider, you are moderately smart and somewhat imaginative, rising slightly above the level of a hack writer. Unfortunately for you, ExNyer is far smarter than you are, and regularly slaps you down. My advice to you is to try and back-peddle your way out of an argument with him, lest you further embarrass yourself.

He is playing professor to your version of a pampered freshman girl, out in the world for the first time, and not smart enough to know how over matched she is.

Go play with your gay male cheerleader buddies.

BTW, I don't even like ExNyer, so that makes me a neutral observer.

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

You're stuck in the 80s. What good does production of talent do if we aren't paying them?

Idiot.

We WOULD be paying them if the Disneys and Cal Edisons of the world had no choice but to pay them.

The companies HAVE the money. They just don't want to pay employees fair market value. So they pay off the Congress to reduce that fair market value by flooding the market with cheap foreign engineers.

One of the articles says Disney cancelled the replacement program after the word got out about what they were doing.

Which goes to show at least two things:

1) Disney had the money to pay the Americans, they just didn't want to pay them; and
2) The imported foreigners were NOT bringing in skills that Americans do not have because Disney would not have cancelled the program if the foreigners were indispensible.

[WombRaider]

Originally Posted by DSK

WormRaider, you are moderately smart and somewhat imaginative, rising slightly above the level of a hack writer. Unfortunately for you, ExNyer is far smarter than you are, and regularly slaps you down. My advice to you is to try and back-peddle your way out of an argument with him, lest you further embarrass yourself.

He is playing professor to your version of a pampered freshman girl, out in the world for the first time, and not smart enough to know how over matched she is.

Go play with your gay male cheerleader buddies.

BTW, I don't even like ExNyer, so that makes me a neutral observer.

He said we never had a problem producing engineering and science talent. Then he goes on to agree with me that less people are going that route now than used to. The lower wages are perhaps the cause, but the point remains that we are not producing talent in those areas, regardless of WHY that is. I wasn't confusing anything. I wasn't questioning the why of it. He created that argument to try and flip it around on me, even though that was not my contention. I'm not concerned with why we aren't producing them.

[WombRaider]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

Idiot.

We WOULD be paying them if the Disneys and Cal Edisons of the world had no choice but to pay them.

The companies HAVE the money. They just don't want to pay employees fair market value. So they pay off the Congress to reduce that fair market value by flooding the market with cheap foreign engineers.

One of the articles says Disney cancelled the replacement program after the word got out about what they were doing.

Which goes to show at least two things:

1) Disney had the money to pay the Americans, they just didn't want to pay them; and
2) The imported foreigners were NOT bringing in skills that Americans do not have because Disney would not have cancelled the program if the foreigners were indispensible.

So you favor more government intervention? You know as well as I do that Capitalism is about the bottom line. If they can get it cheaper, they will. It's like you're complaining about getting in a cage with a wild tiger and then acting surprised when he tries to kill you. What did you THINK was going to happen? I didn't bring up cause and effect earlier, because I didn't really care, but what do you think is going to happen to a field where the people are underpaid? That it won't flourish only makes sense. It was so basic, it didn't require explanation.

[DSK]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

He said we never had a problem producing engineering and science talent. Then he goes on to agree with me that less people are going that route now than used to. The lower wages are perhaps the cause, but the point remains that we are not producing talent in those areas, regardless of WHY that is. I wasn't confusing anything. I wasn't questioning the why of it. He created that argument to try and flip it around on me, even though that was not my contention. I'm not concerned with why we aren't producing them.

No, his point is right. We managed to invent modern mass manufacturing, go to the moon with 16kb, internet, etc - with US born and bred engineers. The issue is a lot like immigration in general - Americans can and will do the work - if you pay them enough. For stopping illegal immigration alone I would support 15 bucks an hour. We could further tax imports enough to make them wage neutral.

[WombRaider]

Originally Posted by DSK

No, his point is right. We managed to invent modern mass manufacturing, go to the moon with 16kb, internet, etc - with US born and bred engineers. The issue is a lot like immigration in general - Americans can and will do the work - if you pay them enough. For stopping illegal immigration alone I would support 15 bucks an hour. We could further tax imports enough to make them wage neutral.

The point isn't whether we as Americans could or can do it. Our STEM programs at universities could not survive without foreign students. Period.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...reign-students

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WombRaider

The point isn't whether we as Americans could or can do it. Our STEM programs at universities could not survive without foreign students. Period.

https://www.insidehighered.com/news/...reign-students

Changing the subject now?

Whether or not the universities would have to reduce class size if foreign students were cut out is a separate issue than H1B visas.

In fact, the H1B visas for Disney and Cal Edison are for JOBS, not college slots. The foreign engineers already have the degrees. Cutting off the H1B visas just means the foreign students have to go back home.