Build a Better Mouse Trap And The World Will Beat A Path To your Door: "Vaccines"?

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by NoirMan

...You are 80% or so less likely to get infected when vaccinated and 90% less likely to get seriously ill. ...

I'm sure you meant to post the data to support your out of your keester claim on the 80% figure. Maybe you should poll the people that have died from the shot and the claimed 10% that landed in the hospital and died as well.

[Yssup Rider]

How many have died from the shot?

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Begging for others to censor people so he doesn't have to? How lazy can he get?.

"...President Joe Biden called upon social media companies and television channels to silence what he claims is “dangerous misinformation” regarding coronavirus vaccines on Tuesday, making his latest call for a state-private partnership against protected political speech.

“These companies and personalities are making money by peddling lies and allowing misinformation that can kill their own customers and their own supporters. It’s wrong. It’s immoral. I call on the bearers of these lies and misinformation to stop it, stop it now,” said Biden of criticism of vaccines..."

[NoirMan]

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

I'm sure you meant to post the data to support your out of your keester claim on the 80% figure. Maybe you should poll the people that have died from the shot and the claimed 10% that landed in the hospital and died as well.

Since evidently you get your information from conspiracy sites and such, let me help you out.

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...uce-risks.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...-benefits.html

A new CDC study finds the mRNA COVID-19 vaccines authorized by the Food and Drug Administration (Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna) reduce the risk of infection by 91 percent for fully vaccinated people.

Other study findings suggest that fully or partially vaccinated people who got COVID-19 might be less likely to spread the virus to others. For example, fully or partially vaccinated study participants had 40 percent less detectable virus in their nose (i.e., a lower viral load), and the virus was detected for six fewer days (i.e., viral shedding) compared to those who were unvaccinated when infected. In addition, people who were partially or fully vaccinated were 66 percent less likely to test positive for SARS-CoV-2 infection for more than one week compared to those who were unvaccinated. While these indicators are not a direct measure of a person’s ability to spread the virus, they have been correlated with reduced spread of other viruses, such as varicella and influenza.

https://www.healthline.com/health-ne...ure-vaccinated

https://patient.info/news-and-featur...tting-infected

60-80% reduction in infections and 90% reduction in hospitalization.

Now it’s your turn to provide the proof that it doesn’t provide any protection against getting the disease, or a far lower number than I provided.

I’ll wait.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by Salty Again

...."Co-vid is just something we're gonna need to learn to live-with."...

And do you why? Because it is Zoonotic. It can live in mammals and transfer back and forth. Which may or may not be a problem, compared to the constant and entirely normal mutations a virus goes through - except for an inconvenient thing called "original" antigenic sin, which is why it's Booster shots 4Evah.

To break down the antigenic sin in simple terms: If you catch a garden variety virus and your body's immune system wins the battle, you are immune to it for a long period of time, unless of course a mutation of it comes along that your body does not recognize - more correctly, does not respond to it as it did with the "original" virus - in which case the immune system battle begins anew.

For those history buffs out there, a simple question: What ended the Spanish flu of 1918? Most likely, it mutated out. Well... that and people became naturally immune to it. Ruh-Rho, do you smell that?

Speaking of Omicron; Is that a narrative starting to fail?!?

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

How many have died from the shot?

Evidently Joe Biden had restricted his free speech...so at present, he can not answer.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Quoting a CDC study that backs up the CDC guidance?!? Seems akin to asking Francisco Pizarro if Emperor Atahualpa willingly gave Pizarro control of Peru. Oh snap! We can't 'cause Francisco killed Emperor Atahualpa !

Then you bolster your lack of empirical data with "...Other study findings suggest that fully or partially vaccinated people who got COVID-19 might be less likely to spread the virus to others.... " That's your proof-positive - that it might!?! Notwithstanding the duplicity of slyly slipping in the 'partially vaccinated', while excluding them from the VAERs and death tolls. Nice try, but busted.

I won't even address the rest of the regurgitated bologna. I would recommend you get some new sources of information. Try Dr Robert Malone or Dr Mike Yeadon or Dr. Simone Gold for starters. Then we can work you up to Dr. Matthias Desmet.

Wait no more

Originally Posted by NoirMan

Since evidently you get your information from conspiracy sites and such, let me help you out.

https://www.cdc.gov/media/releases/2...uce-risks.html

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019...-benefits.html

A new CDC study finds the mRNA COVID-19 vaccines authorized by the Food and Drug Administration (Pfizer-BioNTech and Moderna) reduce the risk of infection by 91 percent for fully vaccinated people.

Other study findings suggest that fully or partially vaccinated people who got COVID-19 might be less likely to spread the virus to others. For example, fully or partially vaccinated study participants had 40 percent less detectable virus in their nose (i.e., a lower viral load), and the virus was detected for six fewer days (i.e., viral shedding) compared to those who were unvaccinated when infected. In addition, people who were partially or fully vaccinated were 66 percent less likely to test positive for SARS-CoV-2 infection for more than one week compared to those who were unvaccinated. While these indicators are not a direct measure of a person’s ability to spread the virus, they have been correlated with reduced spread of other viruses, such as varicella and influenza.

https://www.healthline.com/health-ne...ure-vaccinated

https://patient.info/news-and-featur...tting-infected

60-80% reduction in infections and 90% reduction in hospitalization.

Now it’s your turn to provide the proof that it doesn’t provide any protection against getting the disease, or a far lower number than I provided.

I’ll wait.

[Jacuzzme]

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

This pic is accurate. If you need to beg someone to get your freedom back, you’re a slave.

[NoirMan]

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

Quoting a CDC study that backs up the CDC guidance?!? Seems akin to asking Francisco Pizarro if Emperor Atahualpa willingly gave Pizarro control of Peru. Oh snap! We can't 'cause Francisco killed Emperor Atahualpa !

Then you bolster your lack of empirical data with "...Other study findings suggest that fully or partially vaccinated people who got COVID-19 might be less likely to spread the virus to others.... " That's your proof-positive - that it might!?! Notwithstanding the duplicity of slyly slipping in the 'partially vaccinated', while excluding them from the VAERs and death tolls. Nice try, but busted.

I won't even address the rest of the regurgitated bologna. I would recommend you get some new sources of information. Try Dr Robert Malone or Dr Mike Yeadon or Dr. Simone Gold for starters. Then we can work you up to Dr. Matthias Desmet.

Wait no more

So you won’t accept data from the CDC or the vaccine makers but you accept some opinion pieces that aren’t backed by data. Gotcha. Conversation is done.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by NoirMan

So you won’t accept data from the CDC or the vaccine makers but you accept some opinion pieces that aren’t backed by data. Gotcha. Conversation is done.

I do peruse their data. In fact, waiting on some data from them now about their vaccines testing. But 55 years is a long time to wait. Oh rats, they just said it was going to be 75 years before the finish releasing it. Funny how they can design one in 2 days and release it in 10 months, yet take 75 years to release the data. R-e-a-l funny.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

I would recommend you get some new sources of information. Try Dr Robert Malone

If you left it up to Bannon and Malone, we might spend 10 years studying vaccines before making them available to the public. Actually I think Malone might have let the elderly and those at high risk have them earlier, but perhaps not before a lot of them had already been infected and died. Trump deserves serious praise for pushing the vaccines through the FDA.

It's debatable how important a part he played in mRNA technology. One of the pioneers of mRNA vaccines, Katalin Karido, says there are "hundreds of scientists who contributed more to mRNA vaccines than he did." While another, Stan Gromkowski, who views Malone as an underappreciated pioneer, says "He's fucking up his chances for a Nobel Prize" because of his sensational assertions."

This article is a comprehensive rebuttal to Malone and Navarro's claims, if you've got the patience to read it, https://healthfeedback.org/evaluatio...accine-safety/

Some other points Malone made in the video were about risks related to clots, myocarditis, and immune diseases. Well, the problem with his argument is that risks for clots (which may only apply in the USA to the J&J vaccine when used in women of a certain age), myocarditis and pericarditis (which may only apply to younger males and the mRNA vaccines), and immune disease are much higher if you get the disease than if you get the vaccine.


https://www.eccie.net/showthread.php?p=1062577367

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

or Dr Mike Yeadon

Yeadon falsely claimed that the COVID-19 pandemic in the United Kingdom was "effectively over" in October 2020,[16][17] that there would be no "second wave" of infections,[6][18] and that healthy people could not spread the SARS-CoV-2 virus.[1][19] He has claimed without evidence that COVID-19 vaccines were unnecessary,[20][19][18] unsafe,[1][21] and could cause infertility in women.[1][6][22] In a letter to the European Medicines Agency, Yeadon and the German physician Wolfgang Wodarg called for all vaccine trials to be stopped, falsely suggesting[23][24][25] that mRNA vaccines could target the syncytin-1 protein needed for placenta formation.[26][a] In an interview with political strategist Steve Bannon, Yeadon falsely asserted that children were "50 times more likely to be killed by the COVID vaccines than the virus itself", citing a high number of events following COVID-19 vaccination reported on the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) database.[30][31][3] The US Centers for Disease Control, which operates the database, cautions that such reports are not verified and do not prove that vaccines caused any given adverse event.[30][31] Yeadon has also discouraged COVID-19 lockdowns and the use of face masks despite evidence for their effectiveness.[21] Several of Yeadon's claims have been amplified on social media.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Yeadon

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

or Dr. Simone Gold

Dr. Simone Gold, Beverly Hills Physician Indicted In Capitol Riot, Spreading Misinformation About COVID-19 Vaccine Across The Country

A Los Angeles-area emergency room doctor who has been indicted for taking part in the Jan. 6 Capitol riot has been traveling across the country spreading misinformation about the COVID-19 vaccine.

In one appearance, Gold claimed that that all the COVID vaccine candidates cause diseases, rather than help prevent them. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention say this is not true, and that the unvaccinated are 11 times more likely to be killed by COVID.

Gold was arrested in Beverly Hills on Jan. 18 after she was photographed with a bullhorn inside the Capitol building. She was indicted on Feb. 5 and pleaded not guilty to the charges later that month. A status conference for her case is scheduled for Sept. 28, and she remains free on her own recognizance.

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2021...cross-country/

Originally Posted by Why_Yes_I_Do

for starters. Then we can work you up to Dr. Matthias Desmet.

Matthias Desmet? Who the fuck is this guy anyway? He's a psychoanalyst. He may be uniquely qualified to tell you why you enjoy dressing up in women's lingerie but he probably doesn't know any more about COVID than you or me.

Welcome back by the way! I'm tired of arguing about COVID. I figure you've already had it or had the vaccine by now, so it's unlikely I'll save your life by persuading you of what's right and true.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by ICU 812

From the get-go, I have always wondered why there was not as strong an effort to work on the therapeutic treatment of infected patients as there was on a 'vaccine". A two-path approach to fighting our way through this as a society would make sense.

I am not an anti-vax guy as my OP shows. I just wish they had gone after figuring out
a treatment options with as much aggressive action as they did to develop the shots

And now that we know the shots are less effective than we initially thought (by a LOT), why aren't they now working on a really good preventive shot. Maybe using some other approach than gene therapy mRNA technology?

That's just not right.

Huge efforts have been devoted to finding therapeutics. We have the monoclonal antibody treatments. And Pfizer has come up with a pill that works well. There are undoubtedly a lot of other treatments that have been pursued and that resulted in dead ends. Others that are currently being researched. And some like the Merck treatment that don't appear to be super effective.

There has also been a lot of work done on preventive shots that don't involve mRNA technology. You've got the J&J vaccine, Astra Zeneca, Novavax, Covovax, Covishield, Covaxin, Sinopharm, and Sinovac. None of these are mRNA vaccines. And none work as well as Moderna's and Pfizer's mRNA vaccines.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

So four quickie thoughts before I churn through your thoughts more thoughtfully below:
- Please don't quote Wikipedia to me. They've been compromised for a long time. Ask their founder
- The psychoanalyst is more important than you realize - IMHO. Think United we stand, divided we fall

- Myocarditis is not misogynistic. It hits young people mainly, but also soccer players and more
- Not sure if I regret dropping back in. It tends to slow down my productive reading. Though I appreciate your info and will churn thought it.We'll see.

Originally Posted by Tiny

If you left it up to Bannon and Malone, we might spend 10 years studying vaccines before making them available to the public. Actually I think Malone might have let the elderly and those at high risk have them earlier, but perhaps not before a lot of them had already been infected and died. Trump deserves serious praise for pushing the vaccines through the FDA.

It's debatable how important a part he played in mRNA technology. One of the pioneers of mRNA vaccines, Katalin Karido, says there are "hundreds of scientists who contributed more to mRNA vaccines than he did." While another, Stan Gromkowski, who views Malone as an underappreciated pioneer, says "He's fucking up his chances for a Nobel Prize" because of his sensational assertions."

This article is a comprehensive rebuttal to Malone and Navarro's claims, if you've got the patience to read it, https://healthfeedback.org/evaluatio...accine-safety/

Some other points Malone made in the video were about risks related to clots, myocarditis, and immune diseases. Well, the problem with his argument is that risks for clots (which may only apply in the USA to the J&J vaccine when used in women of a certain age), myocarditis and pericarditis (which may only apply to younger males and the mRNA vaccines), and immune disease are much higher if you get the disease than if you get the vaccine.


https://www.eccie.net/showthread.php?p=1062577367




Yeadon falsely claimed that the COVID-19 pandemic in the United Kingdom was "effectively over" in October 2020,[16][17] that there would be no "second wave" of infections,[6][18] and that healthy people could not spread the SARS-CoV-2 virus.[1][19] He has claimed without evidence that COVID-19 vaccines were unnecessary,[20][19][18] unsafe,[1][21] and could cause infertility in women.[1][6][22] In a letter to the European Medicines Agency, Yeadon and the German physician Wolfgang Wodarg called for all vaccine trials to be stopped, falsely suggesting[23][24][25] that mRNA vaccines could target the syncytin-1 protein needed for placenta formation.[26][a] In an interview with political strategist Steve Bannon, Yeadon falsely asserted that children were "50 times more likely to be killed by the COVID vaccines than the virus itself", citing a high number of events following COVID-19 vaccination reported on the Vaccine Adverse Event Reporting System (VAERS) database.[30][31][3] The US Centers for Disease Control, which operates the database, cautions that such reports are not verified and do not prove that vaccines caused any given adverse event.[30][31] Yeadon has also discouraged COVID-19 lockdowns and the use of face masks despite evidence for their effectiveness.[21] Several of Yeadon's claims have been amplified on social media.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Michael_Yeadon



Dr. Simone Gold, Beverly Hills Physician Indicted In Capitol Riot, Spreading Misinformation About COVID-19 Vaccine Across The Country

A Los Angeles-area emergency room doctor who has been indicted for taking part in the Jan. 6 Capitol riot has been traveling across the country spreading misinformation about the COVID-19 vaccine.

In one appearance, Gold claimed that that all the COVID vaccine candidates cause diseases, rather than help prevent them. The Centers for Disease Control and Prevention say this is not true, and that the unvaccinated are 11 times more likely to be killed by COVID.

Gold was arrested in Beverly Hills on Jan. 18 after she was photographed with a bullhorn inside the Capitol building. She was indicted on Feb. 5 and pleaded not guilty to the charges later that month. A status conference for her case is scheduled for Sept. 28, and she remains free on her own recognizance.

https://losangeles.cbslocal.com/2021...cross-country/




Matthias Desmet? Who the fuck is this guy anyway? He's a psychoanalyst. He may be uniquely qualified to tell you why you enjoy dressing up in women's lingerie but he probably doesn't know any more about COVID than you or me.

Welcome back by the way! I'm tired of arguing about COVID. I figure you've already had it or had the vaccine by now, so it's unlikely I'll save your life by persuading you of what's right and true.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

Originally Posted by Tiny

...Huge efforts have been devoted to finding therapeutics...

Like HCQ and Ivermectin?!? Thought not. However, turns out the FDA is running an Ivermectin study now and expects to complete it by late 2023. Odd, an existing and cheap drug would take 2 years to study compared to a never used gene therapy being designed in 2 days and tested for 10 months and is reaping windfall profits. Go figure.

[Why_Yes_I_Do]

I am still reading through this new one. Interesting to say the least. Have not cross referenced it yet, but wanted to share it. Basically, Benadryl and milk. A-N-D, since it's already had some testing in monkeys, we know it will work for Demonicrats.

Two Common Over-the-Counter Compounds Reduce COVID-19 Virus Replication by 99% in Early Testing

A pair of over-the-counter compounds has been found in preliminary tests to inhibit the virus that causes COVID-19, University of Florida Health researchers have found.

"The combination includes diphenhydramine, an antihistamine used for allergy symptoms. When paired with lactoferrin, a protein found in cow and human milk, the compounds were found to hinder the SARS-CoV-2 virus during tests in monkey cells and human lung cells..."