When do you say something, and when do you keep quiet?

[Guest053011]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

I once had my revenge that way. I got put into mud and one year later i had my revenge. You could call that the game of mud and pigs but for me it was proofing a point, the point that no one is allowed to play games with me without getting the answer he/she deserves.

A difference of philosophy.

I don't believe in or desire revenge. I may be wrong, but feel it is spiritually unhealthy. I also do not believe in games, and would prefer peace over making a point. I never feel games are appropriate in a relationship where you care about someone, and I imagine a mistress would care a great deal for the man she is with. If someone I don't respect doesn't see my point, I can't say I much care, they aren't important. They deserve nothing, and should get nothing - this woman (I feel) doesn't deserve to have her existence acknowledged.

I feel it would only backfire if she added further comments, but it would be foolish to say I can judge the actions of a man I know nothing about.

How was the mistress indiscreet? She did nothing. All she did was receive an email.

I don`t think its appropriate from clients to talk about their mistresses, and he should have never told this new woman about the "old" one.

True. I personally don't care if mine does once he gets to know them because I enjoy meeting and befriending women. I trust him completely. I don't know about the woman who emailed me, but with the gent I know it's not about competition, just introducing good people to each other.

Camille made an excellent point - what he said is the missig piece of the puzzle. However, another woman's bad behaviour is not proof he did anything - she might just be crazy.

I don't think a lady should toss an intense friendship she's had for years at the first sign of turbulence. It would make her affection Terribly insincere and her friendship worthless. We all make mistakes, working through them and granting forgiveness builds strength between two people.

[Guest053011]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

If I were the gent in question I would prefer the lady delete the note. Eventually the understudy would show her true nature and that would be that. I would like to think that if I had a "mistress" type of arrangement that a newcomer would not be able to affect it.

True.

[discreetgent]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

We all make mistakes, working through them and granting forgiveness builds strength between two people.

Excellent point; a potential silver lining to it all.

[charlestudor2005]

OK, I've tried to stay out of it, but I don't really see anyone promoting my initial reaction.

When you think about how to respond, what do you anticipate the client would want? Lauren, your friend knows him better than anyone, even the "new" blood. What is her sense about where he is? In your OP, you said he was "long ago retired" (meaning elderly, I assume), extremely wealthy, and that he and your friend had a falling out. So, I repeat, how would the client want her to respond?

Loyalty is one of the most sought after qualities in human existence. Especially by wealthy people who always have that niggling fear that people are only catering them for their wealth. Your friend has two advantages that the "understudy" doesn't have: she knows the client intimately, and she's earned a certain amount of trust over the years.

So what if they've had a falling out? Not all relationships are perfect. But she can at least show him her loyalty. He may appreciate that more than she knows.

[discreetgent]

Charles,

As I read the OP: the client and a second lady had a falling out; he did not have a falling out with the lady who received the email.

[pjorourke]

Thats not how I read it. See annotations:

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

She (Lauren's acquaintance) has a multi-year arrangement with a very wealthy man long ago retired. He has always had a second lady, but he and the second lady had a falling out, so now he's looking for a new one.

He has a date with the new "understudy". The new lady (i.e., the 3rd one) contacts his mistress (i.e., Lauren's acquaintance) after their first date, sending an email saying "Enjoy it while it lasts, he'll be mine! No more trips around the world for you!"

Does she (Lauren's acquaintance) say nothing to him? Does she forward the email?

[LynetteMarie]

My first reaction was to hit delete, but then I thought about the men I've been mistress to...

I would so want to just delete an email like that if I ever were to receive one. The woman who sent it clearly would have ill intentions, whether just to stir up a "cat fight" between the two of us (which I would never participate in, by the way) or on a mission to manipulate the man. I'd like to think that as mistresses, we enjoy the company of the men we are spending time with and are not out to compete against other women. Hopefully, as DG pointed out, "eventually the understudy would show her true nature and that would be that."

However, as I think about the men I spend time with and how close I am with some of them, I can't imagine myself not bringing it up in a conversation. I care about my patrons and would want to point out her behavior as a "red flag."

I think back to a man who got his heart absolutely torn out by another woman he was seeing. Long story but I sensed from the beginning that she was not being sincere with him. I never voiced my opinion about the "red flags" as I thought it wasn't my place but in hindsight, I wish I had.

That said, I would mention it during a phone conversation or the next time I saw him.

It's a tough choice, Lauren. I wish her luck.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

Charles,

As I read the OP: the client and a second lady had a falling out; he did not have a falling out with the lady who received the email.

Originally Posted by pjorourke

Thats not how I read it. See annotations:

OK, OK. My only defense is that I woke at 3:30 & couldn't get back to sleep, and been scanning some of these posts.

I still think she knows him better than anyone.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

A difference of philosophy.

I don't believe in or desire revenge. I may be wrong, but feel it is spiritually unhealthy. I also do not believe in games, and would prefer peace over making a point. I never feel games are appropriate in a relationship where you care about someone, and I imagine a mistress would care a great deal for the man she is with.

How was the mistress indiscreet? She did nothing. All she did was receive an email.

I meant the mistress the new one. she was indiscreet. and the man was. The old one obviously wasn`t. Its sad. I have been thru similar things. But it was quite a different story. I don`t believe in revenge either, but sometimes - even if you don`t - you have to step down in the mud because its what these people are used to. You have to beat them with their own weapons. its called empowerment. I was almost drowned into sh*t by a man and his wife and his new mistress (who all played games , lied, did not know anything about unconditional love - compared sex lives and the new mistress thought she is so good in bed that a married man gets divorce for her but would not for me :-)....(i never wanted him to). I respected such people for more than 4 years and i never did this guy anything wrong. He did me wrong plenty. And he deserved this response, although its just a small part of my character. I actually reported to his wife that he has a new mistress after i found out about it :-).
He is a guy who does not respect anyone`s privacy except his own. He outed me to his wife because he claimed he loved me and wanted to try polyamory with me and the wife and whatnot. The she outed me to his whole family and whatnot and all they had to do was to discuss what an evil bitch i was and how i ruined a marriage ? That i am a money greedy escort and polyamory is shit?? Hello?? And that after i never took money from that guy and his wife is dependent financially and i never wanted him to get a divorce - but his new mistress wanted that? And i could do NOTHING absolutely nothing to defend myself. NOTHING.
Reporting his new mistress to his wife was making the point that the sh*t they are talking about has nothing to do with me at all.

It was between them all the time no matter of my existence. He should not have told his wife about me in the first place and if he did so, he should not have hidden behind my back like a baby and make me take all the responsibility that he deserved to take. That was my point. He came back to me asking for help after all his so called "friends" and his wife left him and when they were nice again he stabbed me in the back. His wife thought if she got rid of me - the evil - then she will have her husband alone for herself, because it is actually my fault he is cheating and not HIS (gosh some people are really unbelievably NOT smart). Ha ha. She did not . She wanted to proof that polyamory is bullshit and i proofed to her that her monogamy is bullshit. Its a power game. In the end it all happened like i anticipated :-)

so i think you can`t judge all situations with same standards. If you had been thru what i have been thru then maybe you would have also reacted similar. No one knows :-).

I think its called empowerment to make people respobsible for their actions, rather than let them go unanswered. But i agree it depends on the way of the answer. If you cater to new mistress in a way that fuels the fire its certainly wrong. If you find different ways of adressing these issues other than ignoring it, i`d rather try to adress the issues.

But i absolutely agree with you on the points you made. Especially about the mistake stuff.
We have different opinions about being a mistress. I am too much of a consciousness explorer and meditation person to only cater to the happiness of my client. For me its an interplay between my personality and his. Its climbing different stages of consciousness together, crossing boarders. I believe someone can`t do that if you only cater to one person. But its ok to have different opinions, the world would be boring if we all do things the same way, so i respect your way of seing a mistress. Some even see it as fulfilling clients fantasies. Its ok too. Different philosophies.

[Guest053011]

I can really relate to your post Lynette. I watched a gent go headlong into disaster with a woman and said nothing each time I saw a warning sign.

In her shoes, I imagine the problem with speaking about the topic, is imposing my views. If I said nothing and sent the email: her actions speak for itself.

I'm not sure I would ever speak against a lady I felt was a terrible choice, unless directly asked, and aware of unethical behavior through direct experience.

I think ladies are often asked when a gent is in a confusing situation, and if they have a board presence, asked questions by men they have never met, about women they have never met. People have a hard time putting themselves in our shoes and understanding motivation and cause and effect. It's a hard situation to be in, as one has to feel sympathy for the confused, but can't really understand the situation as it really is. One can only hope to provide as much perspective from as many angles as possible, without giving an answer, leave ti to them to make a decision.

I do not envy her position.

Originally Posted by LynetteMarie

My first reaction was to hit delete, but then I thought about the men I've been mistress to...

I would so want to just delete an email like that if I ever were to receive one. The woman who sent it clearly would have ill intentions, whether just to stir up a "cat fight" between the two of us (which I would never participate in, by the way) or on a mission to manipulate the man. I'd like to think that as mistresses, we enjoy the company of the men we are spending time with and are not out to compete against other women. Hopefully, as DG pointed out, "eventually the understudy would show her true nature and that would be that."

However, as I think about the men I spend time with and how close I am with some of them, I can't imagine myself not bringing it up in a conversation. I care about my patrons and would want to point out her behavior as a "red flag."

I think back to a man who got his heart absolutely torn out by another woman he was seeing. Long story but I sensed from the beginning that she was not being sincere with him. I never voiced my opinion about the "red flags" as I thought it wasn't my place but in hindsight, I wish I had.

That said, I would mention it during a phone conversation or the next time I saw him.

It's a tough choice, Lauren. I wish her luck.

[EJunkie]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

... I have always made a point of insisting on transparency between me and the gentlemen.

I think this is the key as to why at least the gist of the note should be passed on.

[atlcomedy]

First of all your friend felt something, even if it wasn't "threatened," if she took the effort to reach out to you to seek your counsel.

I'm a believer that in about 99% of cases when someone communicates with you on a personal level (e.g. I'm not talking about the credit card ads you get in the mail) it is appropriate to respond in some way, directly or indirectly. Indirectly could be letting him handle it, as was suggested.

[Camille]

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

Camille made an excellent point - what he said is the missig piece of the puzzle. However, another woman's bad behaviour is not proof he did anything - she might just be crazy.

Hi Lauren:

It just struck me as really odd that after one meeting with the gentleman in question, this woman felt confident enough to reach out and make not only a powerful statement, but one that she must have known could be repeated back to the gent by the lady she contacted. There is just a sense that she was working from a false sense of security, perhaps dervied from a joke that fell flat or a misunderstanding? As you said though, she might just be crazy....

Good luck to your friend. Not a pleasant situation to have to deal with.

C xx

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Camille

Hi Lauren:

As you said though, she might just be crazy....



C xx

Well, i`d stop short to play judge jury and executioner on some other persons behaviour like that . As Lauren pointed out, the story is really nothing more than a second or even third hand story, so who knows what REALLY happened. In my experience the client must have played a huge role too. No one seems to judge him . Seems the one who pays $$ is always innocent :-) ?

I think what this mistress did was not on a very high level of interaction, but posting things like this on eccie is catering to exactly what she wants. A fight and a lot of attention. And i assume her client is not innocent of putting fuel into that fire as well. It seems to be likely he just got the new mistress to offend the old one and the new mistress put that game on a different level wiht her strange reaction. If the original provider does not want to response to what this newbie lady did, then now this newbie got plenty of response :-). Its already way past the stage of "just ignoring" since everyone plays into that game already. Here she got the biggest response by far :-).

Life is not so easy and calling people crazy without having sufficient background information is something i consider wrong and spiritually very unhealthy.

Who knows if "old" mistress is telling the truth? People lie on every occassion. Stories mostly have more than just one side, we all know that. Who knows what really happened, who knows why she wrote that message? Its too much of a second or third hand story to really judge in terms of mental illnesses. Its a system of interaction and there is most likely not only one person to blame. Who knows if old mistress is as innocent as she likes to be portrayed? In my case for example the new mistress very much liked that i informed wife of my ex, and thought he deserved it, but officially towards him she was also pretending to be outraged, while in reality i was catering to her sense of revenge for what he did to her as well. Later on , HE even told me that he is kind of reliefed that his wife knows about new mistress so she does not have the illusion of being the only one. So overall, my need for empowerment and revenge catered to also two other people :-) - some men need immense help with making a statement towards their wives and some free mistresses need a lesson in feminism and empowerment :-) . so - my point being: you can`t judge interactions between people based on second hand stories. Its most of the time more complicated than that. Plus, it strikes me as a but suprising that someone like this new mistress would write an email like this out of the blue and out of any kind of context. Does not sound REALISTIC to me. I don`t think people that stupid do exist :-). So i tend to believe there is more behind that story than what had been told to Lauren. And we have to be aware of that.


People lie, and sometimes the one who "acts out" caters to a fight that everyone wants to fight. Ever considered that part of a system of interaction between people? Posting stories like that in the www is not behaving better or more wise than attacking an old mistress with an email that lacks courtesy. Its the same kind of battle. Why don`t we just all write to her and degrade her a little? As a revenge for her degrading old mistress? (just kidding)

If within a family system one child gets bulimic you don`t necessarily blame it on the bulimic child, but look at the whole system of interaction gone wrong, and set stage there. a symptom is a reaction towards something more. People interact different with different people. It would be wiser to step aside from quick judgements and differ a little more.

Just my five cents. There should always be a reason of doubt. If judging was so easy then we would not need attorneys, lawyers, courts and whatnot.
Or posting things on eccie to get several strains of opinions :-) for one situation. Calling people crazy is the easiest way out and i`d want mistresses and courtesans and escorts like us beg to differ a little more. Especially because some people might call us crazy too for doing what we do :-).

[Claudia Cole]

Discretegent...I'm totally with you! A pronounced lack of proper conduct will ill manners shall have already quickly made themselves apparent! Her true colors will come through. At the end of the day, a person always demonstrates whom they really are.