Young Adults In The Work Place

[discreetgent]

re: EU and US differences; I think the following sums it up.

Years ago I was with a US multinational and spent a considerable amount of time in Germany. On one occasion the only chance I had to set up some things I absolutely had to have on Monday morning for a major presentation was on Sunday. Having been there before I had the requisite badge and access cards to get into the facility. When I signed in the security person informed me that I had an hour to do what I needed. I knew that it would take a lot longer than that. Sure enough, after an hour he came and said I needed to leave; I explained that I could not do so. (This was in days that laptops and easy remote access were not yet widespread). He left me alone and I thought that was that.

A couple of days later the high level executive that I dealt with at that facility asked to see me. We had a pleasant lunch and then he explained that the local union was thinking of filing a grievance since I had spent more than the allowable hour at the office on the weekend. He informed me that he would also need to notify my management of the potential issue. At the end the union decided that it was not worth their while to file the grievance. When I got back to the US my manager asked me about it; I explained and he said that we really should be more careful about local regulations and then handed me a letter that bumped up the stock options that I had already been granted for that year.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

My European counterparts are lazy and arrogant. In at 9, out by 5. They simply will not work past 5. Conference call? It will be during European working hours - Asia and US be damned. They hate the Americans but any progress is made by the US. The EU is simply the gatekeepers of the process. BTW, we have to work 10 years at my company before you get 4 weeks vacation, in EU they get 4 weeks right off the bat.

To answer the original post, it depends on the job and the employee.

Today's young people seem to believe the lies of Disney, the Kardashians, the Democratic party and Nike. They are identifiable by their tattoos. If you graduated in the upper part of your class or have a special talent you'll likely do OK. But there aren't many factory jobs paying $40 an hour anymore. Nor can you make 80K a year dealing blackjack in Vegas. If you were 22 working a miminum wage job and knowing the 8% in FICA taxes your paying you'd never get back how would your work ethic be?

Now get off my lawn.

Lazy and arrogant :-) hahaha.... it kind of reminds me when i was dancing at a party with one of my exes a few weeks ago. Some mediocre intelligent blonde tried to chalk herself up to him and when asked for her job she answered she is a "mental trainer" (someone who trains your mental capacities for performing - its a bogus job non existent its like some esoteric job like oh i lay tarot cards just smarter). My ex and me laughed (of course not in her face) about that and he said it is completely obscure these days that no one seems to be able to just hold a normal job. You can`t just be a secretary , no you have to be a "mentat trainer".

And that is something - sorry to say - i realized largely in the USA happening. The stuff with escorts and their sometimes braggadacious webpages that lack every form of reality is one thing we discussed here already.
But it seems to be so american - sorry to say - that people pretend to be something they really aren`t. I mean i have already lived in the USA for a while and i know plenty of escorts who have probably just some BA in some orchid studies (that is a field of study that never gets you anywhere serious - in austria that would be studying philosophy or art history or political science - its something that is called "orchid" because you can "orchid" yourself with a title in front of your name, but other than that its not going anywhere)

but they are thinking of themselves as what nots and the most intelligent species of the planet. I am not saying it doesn`t happen that some people really are, but being arrogant in the education department while in reality not being really something is something i have seen plenty in the USA.

I don`t know why that is. In Europe the people don`t brag so much about their capabilities in general. And if they hold degrees they also don`t pretend to be better than they are. In the USA people seem to be "mental trainers" when they are in reality "secretaries". Why is that? (don`t kill me for asking such things on american boards - i do love americans....but the distance between reality and pretentiousness is bigger than in europe in so many things :-) and since you started with pointing out that europeans are lazy and arrogant, well....;-)

[heidilynnla]

Horrible. They have no clue, no concept of hard work. When I was that age, I either worked while in school or I had two jobs.

[CarolinaGent]

The work habits of some of the younger people at my company do leave alot to be desired. They are late alot and don't think it's a big deal, they like to text and some expect recognition for little effort. There are quite a few though who know what hard work is and apply themselves each and every day. I do see a reason for a decline in work ethics though. When the economy tanked, yearly increases were down. The next year profits went up, increases went down again. If they bust their ass for peanuts and the only people who are rewarded justly are division heads and the like, what is the incentive to over achieve ?

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by CarolinaGent

The work habits of some of the younger people at my company do leave alot to be desired. They are late alot and don't think it's a big deal, they like to text and some expect recognition for little effort. There are quite a few though who know what hard work is and apply themselves each and every day. I do see a reason for a decline in work ethics though. When the economy tanked, yearly increases were down. The next year profits went up, increases went down again. If they bust their ass for peanuts and the only people who are rewarded justly are division heads and the like, what is the incentive to over achieve ?

One thing to consider when more senior managers reflect on "the younger generation" is that likely they had the work ethic necessary to attain the positions they have. It would be interesting to have less successful older managers or the ones that were "weeded out" join the discussion with candor. What was different about them and their more successful peers? Work ethic? Luck? Talent? Life balance/choices (which may be code for work ethic)? Now I realize this is isn't going to happen but would be interesting.

The other interesting point you make is around recognition. Seems like there has been an uptick in it for years but for the last couple years "management" owns a bunch of the "blame/credit" for it. If you can't give 'em a raise or bonus you need to find something to do for em: public recognition at a meeting, lunch, trinkets, pat on the back...I hate that shit...

[heidilynnla]

Sometimes I feel I have no choice but to hire anyone with a pulse. The criteria I expect is non-existent.

[gnadfly]

I seem to have hit a nerve Nina. I have many first hand tales of European arrogance and laziness. They are not "generalisations" but real experiences. Your intelligence remark is just the typical jealousy backlash that proves my point. I'd tell you the nations but that would give away my employer. Many of my co-workers have a similar viewpoints and experiences. BTW, it isn't Spain or Italy. Also, these are 'employees' and not contractors. I know contractors in EU have a different status and contract terms that the contractors in the USA.

I totally believe discreetgents story. In a related story, I was responsible for a massive data migration for my companies global web portal with data from the five major continents. I was finally was able contact my Asia counterpart by phone who was in Australia but responsible for the Malaysian IT complex. He asked me if it was Labor Day over in America. I replied "yes". He told me that I could be arrested in Australia for working on a national holiday. Working limited hours dictated by the govt ensured maximum employment according to him.

No I didn't get any stock options out of it.

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

I seem to have hit a nerve Nina. I have many first hand tales of European arrogance and laziness. They are not "generalisations" but real experiences. Your intelligence remark is just the typical jealousy backlash that proves my point. I'd tell you the nations but that would give away my employer. Many of my co-workers have a similar viewpoints and experiences. BTW, it isn't Spain or Italy. Also, these are 'employees' and not contractors. I know contractors in EU have a different status and contract terms that the contractors in the USA.

I totally believe discreetgents story. In a related story, I was responsible for a massive data migration for my companies global web portal with data from the five major continents. I was finally was able contact my Asia counterpart by phone who was in Australia but responsible for the Malaysian IT complex. He asked me if it was Labor Day over in America. I replied "yes". He told me that I could be arrested in Australia for working on a national holiday. Working limited hours dictated by the govt ensured maximum employment according to him.

No I didn't get any stock options out of it.

Different cultures different habits. Vice Versa a lot of europeans tell a lot of stories about how arrogant americans are when they work in their countries, and some regulations are just more than different and ridiculous. So what? Either you like working with many different cultures (and many of my friends and clients do) or you don`t. One of my best friends worked (now he is in pension) with japanese , americans and arabs and he always used to tell funny stories about how interesting certain cultural habits were.

Its just that, nothing more. A little understanding is a bit better than bashing different cultures and europeans as lazy. Because - to be honest - i am the one defending americans when europeans do this gross stereotyping. I hate that. If people work cross cultural and cross national i expect them to have a fluid personality and not only see everything on how it would be done in their country.

There are many pros and cons and - frankly - i don`t see why it would be such a bad idea to work 9 to 5 (yes employees, because CEOs usually don`t have such working hours .- they work anyway 24/7 also in europe) , get a high living standard, have 5 weeks and more vacation time per year and no one pushes you to work more hours.

The drawback is the financial income. In europe - if you are not born rich - you have a hard time getting there. There are some jobs that get you there, but frankly - me as psychologist? forget it! The USA is way better for that. I have my reasons why i came here. But i don`t think i would bash cultures therefor. Not everyone lives for their work and i see that point too.

The friend i mentioned before (arabs, japanese etc.) was offered a job in the USA for the same company he worked for in Austria (international they are) and he said there is no f-ing way he ever would take that offer, because its paid not enough and he has to work way more hours AND pay his own insurance. So maybe that is arrogant, but maybe its also just because people have a choice. The american health system and how its managed is a big turn off for anyone that wants to profit financially and not work THAT much. Of course - participants of the tea party see anything contribbuting to society as bad, but they are also incapabe of seing the long term benefits that can arise.

All in all i see a mixture between USA and EU as not such a bad idea when ti comes to marketing strategy. Just my POV. Lazy is a point of definition.

[Ed Highlight]

Oh, they'll never amount to anything....next thing you know, they'll be the adults chatting on some Adult Content Forum...complaining about their kids and young adults of the next generation...just like our parents did, only I don't think my dad was chatting with women this hot!!

OMG Nina, I read every word you write just so I can off-set most of the brain cells I lose by reading the drivel that other people post....Thanks!!

[Iaintliein]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

but they are also incapabe of seing the long term benefits that can arise.

LOL, like Greece you mean?

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Ed Highlight

Oh, they'll never amount to anything....next thing you know, they'll be the adults chatting on some Adult Content Forum...complaining about their kids and young adults of the next generation...just like our parents did, only I don't think my dad was chatting with women this hot!!

OMG Nina, I read every word you write just so I can off-set most of the brain cells I lose by reading the drivel that other people post....Thanks!!

It seems to me that old men have a problem with the younger generation in generally. (except when it comes to 20 year old providers - I`ve seen some of them hiring them in their own companies for free BJs and sex - but but but but..... if THAT is the quality you are hiring then you have to not complain about the outcome, right :-)....).

When it comes to incapacities of EU versus USA, i know plenty of things USA lacks too and i will not point it out there. DG and others have posted stories i can post same as in reverse, especially when it comes to inflexibility of bending certain rules that are. First thing i could get a kick out of being nasty about is the INS when you come to the USA. .... aaaarghhhhh...........
One thing just talking about abiding the rules : I use to shortcut the long lines when no one is there and ignore these fences they built. No problem in Europe! Do that in USA and some officer shouts at you and tells you you can`t do taht and have to walk along the fences! Even when NO ONE is there! Are they ..... completely out of their minds?

But generally speaking: Cars? Suck in the USA (i mostly get seasick from this way the people drive and the cars are build - gas stop gas stop - i mean Jesus christ?? - learn to use sticks for heaven`s sake!

Streets? suck too. drive as fast as i drive in europe and you have the feeling the car falls apart.

Subways and technics ? Are from the 40ies mostly - suck plenty. I knew a guy who got hired to ( i think he does that now) renovate the NYC subway system, he said its a freakin mess and as a european you cannot even begin to grasp where this mess starts because it would never happen like this in europe. Every single meter is a different method of technique and its like a lousy patchwork carpet instead of anything useful. In europe you at least use one technique or rebuild and renovate the whole system and not patch it together like old rugs and then complain when it all sucks.

Subway tickets? Ever been to San francisco? you gotta be FUCKING kidding me!!!!! I have to change what? dollar bills into coins to get on a subway?? Dear lord!!! God already invented swipe cards and monthly payment options.

Then talking about lazy and arrogant: Ever been shopping in the USA and wanting to get a T-mobile card? It takes AGES - i mean literally speaking AGES - until the customer service moves their precious behind and manages to plug in a SIM card into a phone - and THAT only to reveal that number has been used before and she has to exchange it.
How do they train their customer service personal? Compare Europe USA: Getting a SIM card with all you need - done 15 minutes maximum - Europe
Getting a SIM card with all you need - done 60 minutes MINIMUM -USA (and afterwards i needed a xanax really!)
Oh and even when they see a ton of people waiting in line would you imagine they move their butts and help?
I am sorry but i have worked years that line of work and if i had been so inefficient my boss would have given me a kick in the ass. And fired me. We are trained to provide efficient service in as quick as time as possible.

Oh and don`t even get me started on all these useless service hotlines where you don`t even talk to real people anymore.

[Marcus Aurelius]

[NinaBrooke]

Originally Posted by Iaintliein

LOL, like Greece you mean?

ha funny... but who sits in glass house shouldn`t throw stones, right

[Iaintliein]

Originally Posted by ninasastri

ha funny... but who sits in glass house shouldn`t throw stones, right

Let he (or in this case she) who is without stones cast the first sin. Texas is well ahead of the rest of the country economy wise, which, of course, puts it ahead of most of the EU.

This is a little dated certainly, but probably still a fair representation, so, I guess alot depends on where one's "glass house" is located.

http://www.governor.state.tx.us/file...omparisons.pdf

Meanwhile, those of us who like a little TEA will continue to put the socialist agenda back where it belongs. . . buried with Marx.

Have a great day!

[Sensia]

Originally Posted by gnadfly

My European counterparts are lazy and arrogant. In at 9, out by 5. They simply will not work past 5.

... BTW, we have to work 10 years at my company before you get 4 weeks vacation, in EU they get 4 weeks right off the bat.

I think it is sad that we as Americans don't demand more paid vacation time off.

"The US is the most overworked Nation in the world."

http://20somethingfinance.com/americ...vity-vacation/

The US is the ONLY country in the Americas without a national paid parental leave benefit (Compared to 20 weeks paid leave in Europe.)

Roughly 134 Countries have laws setting the maximum length of the work week, the US does not.

Americans work 137-140 more hours per year than Japaneses workers, 260 more hours per year than British workers, and 499 more hours per year than the French.

The U.S. remains the only industrialized country in the world that has no legally mandated annual leave.

In every country included except Canada and Japan (and the U.S., which averages 13 days/per year), workers get at least 20 paid vacation days. In France and Finland, they get 30 – an entire month off, paid, every year

Then there’s this depressing graph on average paid vacation time in industrialized countries:


In general more work leads to more stress, less of a social life, and lower quality of life.

Without time to unwind, take care of your home, spend time with loved ones, enjoy our hobbies, connect with friends, and generally live a more balance life. Stress is the #1 cause of health problems – mentally and physically. And there are few things that stress us out on a consistent basis like work does, especially when it takes away from all of the other things that life has to offer.