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[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by onawbtngr546

Amazing how many brainwashed people there are. Truly, I'm sorry. Think of what your parents or grandparents, who lived through the cold war, would had felt about their descendant supporting Russia's unjustified war...

Amazing how many brainwashed liberals think Ukraine is a "Bastion of Democracy" rather than a corrupt former Soviet republic that's still corrupt and run by a two bit punk.


so if TWK does not support dumping billions into a corrupt punk's corrupt country to fight against another corrupt punk's country then TWK is "Pro Putin"?






you do know what the Minsk accords are, yeah?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minsk_agreements


The agreement failed to stop fighting,[5] and was thus followed with a revised and updated agreement, Minsk II, which was signed on 12 February 2015.[6] This agreement consisted of a package of measures, including a ceasefire, withdrawal of heavy weapons from the front line, release of prisoners of war, constitutional reform in Ukraine granting self-government to certain areas of Donbas and restoring control of the state border to the Ukrainian government. While fighting subsided following the agreement's signing, it never ended completely, and the agreement's provisions were never fully implemented.[7]


notice the part about granting self-government to areas of the Donbas. who didn't do that? Not Russia. Ukraine never fulfilled this part of the revised agreement so the conflict never stopped in 2015. you can make a case that Ukraine's failure to grant self-government to a large part of the Donbas validated Putin's eventual decision to invade.



now to be fair here, Zelenzky had nothing to do with Minsk accords in 2015. he was just a punk comedian running around in high heels and leather pants lip sync'ing Ukraine pop songs.


but it was his issue when he was elected. so why didn't Ukraine allow the Donbas self-government? why didn't Zelenky abide by the Minsk accords?



it's obvious. given self-government, the Donbas being by far ethnic Russians would have legally voted to leave Ukraine and join Russia.



so keep saying "Ukraine Good! Putin Bad!"


see how that aligns with inconvenient truths

[bambino]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

Amazing how many brainwashed liberals think Ukraine is a "Bastion of Democracy" rather than a corrupt former Soviet republic that's still corrupt and run by a two bit punk.


so if TWK does not support dumping billions into a corrupt punk's corrupt country to fight against another corrupt punk's country then TWK is "Pro Putin"?






you do know what the Minsk accords are, yeah?


https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minsk_agreements


The agreement failed to stop fighting,[5] and was thus followed with a revised and updated agreement, Minsk II, which was signed on 12 February 2015.[6] This agreement consisted of a package of measures, including a ceasefire, withdrawal of heavy weapons from the front line, release of prisoners of war, constitutional reform in Ukraine granting self-government to certain areas of Donbas and restoring control of the state border to the Ukrainian government. While fighting subsided following the agreement's signing, it never ended completely, and the agreement's provisions were never fully implemented.[7]


notice the part about granting self-government to areas of the Donbas. who didn't do that? Not Russia. Ukraine never fulfilled this part of the revised agreement so the conflict never stopped in 2015. you can make a case that Ukraine's failure to grant self-government to a large part of the Donbas validated Putin's eventual decision to invade.



now to be fair here, Zelenzky had nothing to do with Minsk accords in 2015. he was just a punk comedian running around in high heels and leather pants lip sync'ing Ukraine pop songs.


but it was his issue when he was elected. so why didn't Ukraine allow the Donbas self-government? why didn't Zelenky abide by the Minsk accords?



it's obvious. given self-government, the Donbas being by far ethnic Russians would have legally voted to leave Ukraine and join Russia.



so keep saying "Ukraine Good! Putin Bad!"


see how that aligns with inconvenient truths

I’m sure he won’t understand a word you posted. Ukraine has been apart of Russia in some way since the 1600’s. But somehow the US needs to rescue them. It’s a corrupt, DS playground.


https://t.me/realKarliBonne/158312

[HDGristle]

Russia's violations of Minsk I led to Minsk II and it was never implemented. Ukraine wouldn't agree to modify its constitution to facilitate Russia installing a puppet gov in the Donbas just so it could regain "control of its border" with Russia.

Russia was far and away the aggressor with the Ukraine seeing 650% more explosions on its side of the line than occurred in the Donbas and Russia blocking 40% more of the OSCE SMM's monitoring activities than Ukraine.

You don't hear Tucker discussing that, just parroting Kremlin rhetoric

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by HDGristle

Russia's violations of Minsk I led to Minsk II and it was never implemented. Ukraine wouldn't agree to modify its constitution to facilitate Russia installing a puppet gov in the Donbas just so it could regain "control of its border" with Russia.

Russia was far and away the aggressor with the Ukraine seeing 650% more explosions on its side of the line than occurred in the Donbas and Russia blocking 40% more of the OSCE SMM's monitoring activities than Ukraine.

Ukraine did agree to allowing self-government in the Donbas. the Minsk II agreement says so. that they didn't is the fault of Ukraine and means they reneged on an agreement they signed.

prove the Ukraine didn't agree to Minsk II

[Jacuzzme]

Since we’re talking puppet regimes, shouldn’t we mention that Ukraine is exactly that? It was The US, under Obama, who engineered the coup to oust Yanukovych with Svoboda shock troops. We put hostile foreign power (us) on Russia’s border and brought the world a major step closer to a war between nuclear powers.

And we did it all so a few people could get rich.

[HDGristle]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

Ukraine did agree to allowing self-government in the Donbas. the Minsk II agreement says so. that they didn't is the fault of Ukraine and means they reneged on an agreement they signed.

prove the Ukraine didn't agree to Minsk II

I don't have to prove it. They couldn't agree on order of implementation, which is why it was never implemented fully. And both sides said fuck all to the ceasefire and were bombing each other with one side absolutely the more egregious violator.

Kyiv wasn't going to follow through unless they got control of their borders. Not concede all points, modify their constitution, permit a sham referendum AND THEN maybe get control of its borders with an entrenched Russian controlled Donbas.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by HDGristle

I don't have to prove it. They couldn't agree on order of implementation, which us why it was never implemented.

Kyiv wasn't going to follow through unless they got control of their borders. Not concede all points, modify their constitution, permit a sham referendum AND THEN maybe get control of its borders with an entrenched Russian controlled Donbas

prove Minsk II was not signed. i'll wait.

[HDGristle]

Don't hold your breath, TWK

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by HDGristle

Don't hold your breath, TWK

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Minsk_..._February_2015


Signatories

The document was signed by:[38]

• Separatist's leaders Alexander Zakharchenko and Igor Plotnitsky
• Swiss diplomat and OSCE representative Heidi Tagliavini
• Former president of Ukraine and Ukrainian representative Leonid Kuchma
• Russian Ambassador to Ukraine and Russian representative Mikhail Zurabov

post all the pro Ukraine rhetoric you want. the truth is Ukraine signed. excuses about why they didn't implement what they signed are ... excuses.




FUCK UKRAINE

[HDGristle]

Neither side fully implemented or abided by that agreement, so stop pretending it's a pretext for Russia's actions or justification for the atrocities they've carried out.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by HDGristle

Neither side fully implemented or abided by that agreement, so stop pretending it's a pretext for Russia's actions or justification for the atrocities they've carried out.

and Ukraine atrocities? what about those? don't make excuses for Ukraine. i'm not defending Russia. i'm showing why neither are trustworthy and why dumping billions into their conflict isn't a US issue.


FUCK UKRAINE
FUCK RUSSIA


let them kill themselves off.

[HDGristle]

No, in reality you're giving Putin cover by pushing the same things as Tucker.

The Russians have been exposed heavily and their losses so far have been enormous. The corruption that's stifled their military and ineptitude of their planning.

And the cost to us of pennies on the dollar vs ROI in degrading the military capability of one of our greatest geopolitical foes has been fantastic lyrics successful. They helped galvanize unity within NATO and its likely expansion. China has to recalculate its plans for Taiwan and continue its grey zone tactics far longer now that they've seen the results.

The US and Qatar have displaced them with LNG exports. Their military exports are drying up due to the failures of their equipment on the field. They have lost massive numbers of their best and brightest who fled conscription.

And Ukraine continues to resist.

The Russian industries that were propped up and held together with Western investment and knowhow are becoming much more clearly apparent since their largely Soviet Era infrastructure doesn't work nearly as well now that the West's money, and contracts and knowledge have been stripped away and they're trying to hold it together with duct tape.

And we've seen Putin's Obama-esque red lines mean jack shit.

But, by all means let's focus on Tucker's latest greatest Putin talking points instead. Pretend Ukraine should have rolled over for Russia instead of fight tooth and nail for their country.

If you don't want your tax dollars going to Ukraine they can have mine.

[berryberry]

It's amazing to see ill informed leftists and the Nazi lovers here be fooled by the DNC Russia rhetoric over and over to the extent they continue to want to support a corrupt puppet regime in Ukraine with American taxpayer money while our country is massively in debt and get closer and closer to WWIii with a nuclear power.

I posted this in a previous thread.

It's not the fact that we are indirectly (in some cases directly as in blowing up the Nordstream 2 pipeline) fighting a war with Russia. It's the fact that we have no reason nor business to fight a war with Russia.

Russia did not attack the USA. Russia did not provoke the USA. For those of you nazi loving, warmongers who support starting WWIII with a nuclear power, please explain all the reasons why this is a good thing. And make it substantive - not pejoratives about those "damn commies

Alas it was telling that none of the warmongers here were able to explain why they think starting a world war with a nuclear power over corrupt Ukraine is a good thing

So I will challenge them again to answer the question in a substantive manner, not the BS they spew about 'damn commies'

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by HDGristle

No, in reality you're giving Putin cover by pushing the same things as Tucker.

The Russians have been exposed heavily and their losses so far have been enormous. The corruption that's stifled their military and ineptitude of their planning.

And the cost to us of pennies on the dollar vs ROI in degrading the military capability of one of our greatest geopolitical foes has been fantastic lyrics successful. They helped galvanize unity within NATO and its likely expansion. China has to recalculate its plans for Taiwan and continue its grey zone tactics far longer now that they've seen the results.


what's the ROI on provoking Russia and China into a military alliance that takes advantage of the US draining our stockpiles to give them to a punk Ukraine comedian dictator?



what new language do you think we should learn? Mandarin or Russki? hedger yer bets and learn both?


The US and Qatar have displaced them with LNG exports. Their military exports are drying up due to the failures of their equipment on the field. They have lost massive numbers of their best and brightest who fled conscription.

And Ukraine continues to resist.

The Russian industries that were propped up and held together with Western investment and knowhow are becoming much more clearly apparent since their largely Soviet Era infrastructure doesn't work nearly as well now that the West's money, and contracts and knowledge have been stripped away and they're trying to hold it together with duct tape.

And we've seen Putin's Obama-esque red lines mean jack shit.


you mean Obama is a pussy and Putin knew he is a pussy.


But, by all means let's focus on Tucker's latest greatest Putin talking points instead. Pretend Ukraine should have rolled over for Russia instead of fight tooth and nail for their country.

If you don't want your tax dollars going to Ukraine they can have mine.

okay. let me know how that works out for ya when you retire. oh wait the gov won't let you .. so they can tax your earning longer.


given your blind faith support of corrupt Ukraine by any means necessary which blind mouse are you?

[HDGristle]

I'll be dead long before retirement age, TWK. Zero concerns there unless the government reanimates me and converts me into a servitor.

Even then, I'd be less of a puppet than Tucker is.

I think your fears of a Russian / Chinese alliance are wildly overplayed. Both want to be the power top, and China isn't going to bend over for Russia like they did as second-fiddle to Stalin and accept the same type of lopsided deals.