Apparently, HIV Doesn't Cause AIDS

[Mr. Bill]

Bogus Skepticism
Seven Warning Signs of Bogus Skepticism

1. The Skeptic has reached her skeptical opinion not after careful research and examination of the claim, but simply based on media reports and other forms of second-hand knowledge.

2. Making uncontrolled criticisms. A criticism is uncontrolled if the same criticism could equally be applied to accepted science.

3. The Pseudoskeptical Catch-22: "unconventional claims have to be proved before they can be investigated!" This way, of course, they will never be investigated or proved.

4. Evidence of refutal is anecdotal or otherwise scientifically worthless. Pseudoskeptics tend to accept conventional "explanations" for unconventional phenomena very easily, no matter how weak, contrived or far-fetched. A good historical example is the rejection of the crop circle phenomenon.

5. The Skeptic rejects a discovery or invention merely because it has been believed for a long time that such a thing as the claimed discovery or invention is impossible.

6. The Skeptic claims that the claimed effect contradicts the "laws of nature" (and therefore has to be wrong, since the Skeptic and the scientific community he presumes to represent have of course already complete knowledge of the laws of nature).

7. The Skeptic believes in scientific mob rule. "In Science, the Majority Consensus is Always Right".


The unfortunate reality is that there is a complex sociology of science. Scientific truth is frequently not determined by right or wrong, but by ego, prestige, authority of claimants, conflicts of interests and economic agendas.

Scientists who propose research that threatens the viability of basic theories on which authorities in the field have built their careers, and governments and corporations have bet lots of money will find themselves out of a job very soon.

The list of of great scientists who became scientific outcasts after they published research that contradicts establishment dogma is long, and includes such names as Peter Duesberg, Brian Josephson, Jacques Benveniste, and of course Professors Pons and Fleischmann.

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[Sa_artman]

Ok...I'll bite. Soooo..."simply based on media reports and other forms of second-hand knowledge." isn't that what you're doing? Copy paste research is not science. So prove me wrong. Show me your 'hard scientific' proof with your HIV tests. What's a man of science like you to do without a control? So easy to be the arm-chair extremist crying the skies falling when you sit and copy paste all day. Skeptic? No, sensible. Until you can show you're willing to take the next step in proving your point, you have NO credibility.

Originally Posted by Mr. Bill

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[Mr. Bill]

Neville Hodgkinson



Neville Hodgkinson reported on AIDS as medical correspondent of the Sunday Times. From 1991, as the London newspaper's science correspondent, he wrote a series of highly controversial questioning reports about HIV and AIDS.

Go here for an interview.

Click here for his first article on the HIV-AIDS controversy.

Hodgkinson travelled through Africa. Here is a report from Kenya, here is one from Zambia, and here you will find one from Tanzania. Here is his story of what happened after publication.

Here you find an article about the 12th World AIDS Conference in Geneva.

For a recent article about AIDS in South Africa go here.

Hodgkinson is the author of the book 'AIDS: The Failure of Contemporary Science'.

Go here for more...

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[Mr. Bill]

Originally Posted by Sa_artman

Ok...Show me your 'hard scientific' proof with your HIV tests. What's a man of science like you to do without a control?

I'm not a scientist you fucking moron ...unlike you, I have common sense and the ability to discern corruption of science via comparative research and unbiased analysis. You on the other hand, stand on the sidelines doing nothing - only blabbing meaningless comments as some demented imbecile.


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[Mr. Bill]

AIDS since 1984: no evidence for a new, viral epidemic -- not even in Africa.

Duesberg PH, Mandrioli D, McCormack A, Nicholson JM, Rasnick D, Fiala C, Koehnlein C, Bauer HH, Ruggiero M.
Source

PubMed ~ US National Library of Medicine National Institutes of Health
Department of Molecular and Cell Biology, UC Berkeley, CA 94720, USA. duesberg@berkeley.edu

Abstract

Since the discoveries of a putative AIDS virus in 1984 and of millions of asymptomatic carriers in subsequent years, no general AIDS epidemic has occurred by 2011. In 2008, however, it has been proposed that between 2000 and 2005 the new AIDS virus, now called HIV, had killed 1.8 million South Africans at a steady rate of 300,000 per year and that anti-HIV drugs could have saved 330,000 of those.

Here we investigate these claims in view of the paradoxes that HIV would cause a general epidemic in Africa but not in other continents, and a steady rather than a classical bell-shaped epidemic like all other new pathogenic viruses.

Surprisingly, we found that South Africa attributed only about 10,000 deaths per year to HIV between 2000 and 2005 and that the South African population had increased by 3 million between 2000 and 2005 at a steady rate of 500,000 per year. This gain was part of a monotonic growth trajectory spanning from 29 million in 1980 to 49 million in 2008.

During the same time Uganda increased from 12 to 31 million, and Sub-Saharan Africa as a whole doubled from 400 to 800 million, despite high prevalence HIV. We deduce from this demographic evidence that HIV is not a new killer virus.

Based on a review of the known toxicities of antiretroviral drugs we like to draw the attention of scientists, who work in basic and clinical medical fields, including embryologists, to the need of rethinking the risk-and-benefit balance of antiretroviral drugs for pregnant women, newborn babies and all others who carry antibodies against HIV.

SOURCE: http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/22303636

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[Mr. Bill]

Rice mill worker's HIV ordeal after flawed medical report


Ganesh Prasad: Wrongly diagnosed
as HIV positive

When Ganesh Prasad was diagnosed HIV positive in 2010, his initial emotions ranged from shock to disbelief.

The next nine months were filled with fear and exasperation as the 38-year-old was needlessly thrust upon death's doorstep.

The Ghaziabad-based rice mill worker's ordeal began in October 2010 when he visited Noida's ESI Hospital for a health insurance related routine medical checkup.

'I am covered by the government's ESI scheme. The company that provides health insurance to workers also checks their HIV status.

'I, too, was subjected to the test at the Noida hospital and, to my utter surprise, the result was positive,' Prasad recalled.

The sole breadwinner of his family, Prasad was left wondering how he had contracted the dreaded disease without exposing himself to any of the virus's transmission risk factors.

'But I trusted the doctors' judgement and requested them to treat me. They performed more tests and subsequently confirmed that I was HIV positive. Though I did not suffer from any health problem, treatment got underway in earnest,' he said.

With the anti-retroviral treatment (ART) - the staple for AIDS patients - Prasad's condition started deteriorating. 'There was a general feeling of being unwell.

'They asked me to stop taking the medicines immediately because they were harming me. I went back to ESI Hospital in Noida in December 2011 and got the HIV test done yet again. This time, the result indicated that I was not HIV positive,' Prasad said.



'To reconfirm the test, I went to Delhi's Lady Hardinge Medical College and the report was negative. ART was causing all the side effects,' he said.

According to doctors, ART includes the administration of toxic drugs that can lead to rashes, nausea, anaemia, pancreatitis and lipid abnormalities. In rare cases, it can cause anaphylaxis (a sudden reaction) which can cause death.

ART medicines can also trigger heart, kidney, bone, liver and metabolic problems. He was shifted to a private hospital after six months. Doctors gave Prasad a 50-50 chance of survival.

He battled for life for nine months and is believed to have recovered now. A mentally, emotionally and financially drained Prasad moved the consumer court for damages.

He also approached the director of ESI Hospitals as well as the National AIDS Control Organisation (NACO) secretary in Delhi for relief. 'For six months, I spent a lot of money on the treatment for a disease I was never suffering from. I borrowed at least Rs 5 lakh.

People ostracised me thinking that I had AIDS. The errant ESI Hospital in Noida is responsible for all this. I want the hospital authorities to compensate me and my family for the trauma,' Prasad said.

'The hospital authorities have intentionally lost my papers, reports and records. I have also sought help from the health department of the Delhi government,' he pointed out in despair.

When Mail Today contacted of Noida ESI Hospital director Dr J.S. Sarang, he said he was looking into the matter.

Apart from this, I had eruptions all over my body and experienced loss of stamina. Upon divulging these details to the hospital's doctors, I was told that death was inevitable and my treatment was abruptly brought to a halt,' he said. 'I became weaker day by day and was very worried about the future of my family, particularly my children,' Prasad recounted.

He has two daughters and a son. 'My relatives admitted me to a private hospital in Ghaziabad. The doctors there conducted the HIV test again. The report was negative.


Story: http://www.dailymail.co.uk/indiahome...#ixzz1lp1JQwiH

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[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by Sa_artman

Well, you've had your 15 minutes of disinformation. I think Joe Blow like most crazy loons on street corners this one just needs to be ignored.

I wonder if Mr Bill is just baiting us. Maybe it's some sort of practical joke. If he had started this thread on April 1st that would explain everything. Mr Bill sounds like the crackpots that say there's been a cure for cancer for decades but the evil drug companies won't allow us to have it because they make too much money off of chemotherapy drugs or the guy that says there's a gizmo that will make your car run for a year on thimble full of gas, but the evil oil companies have suppressed it.

Mr Bill will never concede that he's wrong no matter how completely his claims are refuted. At this point it would be too embarrassing for him. Occassionaly, non-conformist views in medicine that are dissmissed as crackpot theories actully turn out to be true, such as the guy that claimed that bacteria causes ulcers not stress or diet; but the vast majority of times lunatic fringe views are just loony.

[CuteOldGuy]

Originally Posted by Mr. Bill

I'm not a scientist you fucking moron ...unlike you, I have common sense and the ability to discern corruption of science via comparative research and unbiased analysis. You on the other hand, stand on the sidelines doing nothing - only blabbing meaningless comments as some demented imbecile.


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Now Mr. Bill, although I am not sold on the information you have provided, I have defended your right to say it. It is very interesting, to say the least.

But now you have gone too far. Comparing Sa_fartman's blabbing meaningless comments to a demented imbecile, is totally unfair. Demented imbeciles are far more intelligent and in touch with reality than Sa_fartman. You owe them an apology.

[Mr. Bill]

HIV=AIDS - Fact or Fraud --- The HIV FRAUD EXPOSED

A powerful 2 hour video documentary boldly reveals the modern medical-industrial complex’s dire descent into utter corruption.

HIV/AID$ - A deadly and dangerous DECEPTION.

This feature-length expose explains how the 300-Billion-dollar AID$ fraud began, why HIV can NOT be the cause of AIDS, what the real causes could be, and who manipulates the public’s good intentions while poisoning hundreds of thousands with toxic drugs that cause the very disease they are supposed to prevent.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v...YajQ&vq=medium


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[Mr. Bill]

Why HIV 'Experts' Accept AIDS Fraud

The Asch conformity experiments were a series of studies published in the 1950s that demonstrated the power of conformity in groups. These are also known as the "Asch Paradigm."

The premise represented in this 2 minute video illustrates how the public and even well-meaning doctors are influenced to go along with the status quo's unproven theory that HIV = AIDS - even when all evidence and logic points to the opposite.

http://www.youtube.com/watch_popup?v...9nNw&vq=medium

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[Sa_artman]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Now Mr. Bill, although I am not sold on the information you have provided, I have defended your right to say it. It is very interesting, to say the least.

But now you have gone too far. Comparing Sa_fartman's blabbing meaningless comments to a demented imbecile, is totally unfair. Demented imbeciles are far more intelligent and in touch with reality than Sa_fartman. You owe them an apology.

That's the most intelligent put down you have? In the battle of the wits your only half armed, and that's being kind. Go find whirlies skirt tales to hang on to since it's obvious your extremist ilk like to troll in packs.

[Sa_artman]

Originally Posted by Mr. Bill

I'm not a scientist you fucking moron ...unlike you, I have common sense and the ability to discern corruption of science via comparative research and unbiased analysis. You on the other hand, stand on the sidelines doing nothing - only blabbing meaningless comments as some demented imbecile.


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Unfortunately I don't you wing nut. I work with disabled vets, some with HIV. You're simply another extremist spewing armchair disinformation from anywhere you can copy paste from. You have no real world knowledge outside your Google world. Face it. You're a fraud.

[CuteOldGuy]

Why don't you prove him wrong, Sa_fartman? I'd be interested. I'm not taking chances anyway, but I would like to know where his info is wrong.

[Mr. Bill]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Why don't you prove him wrong, Sa_fartman? I'd be interested. I'm not taking chances anyway, but I would like to know where his info is wrong.

Sa_fartman may harass only me about the HIV/AIDS issue at the moment, however, the punk has a long row to hoe to debunk the growing number of THOUSANDS who also realize the truth.

He/she/it and their ilk never offer any proof of their assertions nor can/do they debate any relevant point. Instead, they obfuscate details and incorporate ad hominem attacks against those who would shine an intelligent light.

The real question is...

How is it that we have this unproven HIV hypothesis in the first place?

How is it that scientists and AIDS researchers march to the drums of HIV=AIDS without ever considering any of the questions that have been raised by Peter Duesberg or Robert Root-Bernstein - or any of the other THOUSANDS of doctors, PHDs, microvirologists, scientists, researchers, clinicians and investigative reporters worldwide?

How is it that they all mindlessly follow along?

How did we as a society get trapped in an HIV hypothesis that has NEVER been proven and was started by a fucking liar?

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[Sa_artman]

Originally Posted by CuteOldGuy

Why don't you prove him wrong, Sa_fartman? I'd be interested. I'm not taking chances anyway, but I would like to know where his info is wrong.

You want me to copy past as well? That's proving him wrong? If it's so important to this your miserable life you live trolling this board, I'll work on it. On the the other hand...how about all the dead people from AIDS with HIV as the precursor and no access to anti-virals? How about the dead pre-80's AIDs cases long since gone? There's a lot smarter people than idiot Mr. Bill who put a lot of work into research, real work, not Google. Get a life COG.