NFL and Houston Texans Superthread: Are we ready for some football?

[Satin]

Guys: (Dj, Don & Bigtex) man I love all of you but seriously, you guys need to stop with the Schaub defending. First, I'm just having fun with the Dopey dude. If you boys like him, God Bless you, it's all good. I'm the biggest Texan fan (or homer) ever, so I pull for him and want him to do well, not fail. I'm a freaking season ticket holder , so relax boys...lol

But the reality is, this dude is NOT a top 10 QB and you guys know it. You are being too much of a " homer" if you really believe that. Also, like I mentioned earlier, it's not all about stats. It's about wins, losses, playoffs & leading your team to game-winning drives. Be honest, if the game is on the line, do any of you feel 100% confident that Dopey will come through? Or do you cringe every time he goes back to pass that he will throw a pick 6 to end the game (like he has many times)? Come on now, be honest...

Also, you have to also take into account he has arguably the best receiver in football to throw to. (personally I think it's Calvin Johnson, then Larry Fitzgerald, and many experts do too, but that's another story)

I was hoping to get comments or feedback on other players, the defense or the stats I threw out. But instead you boys wanna focus on one comment about Dopey and make him out to be Montana. Come on gentlemen, you're better than that.....

[DEAR_JOHN]

Schaub is not the second coming of Montana, Bradshaw, Starr or anybody else. He is what he is, an adequate quarterback trying to move up in the rankings. He's in the top half, borderline top third.

But the question is this, who can we realistically get to replace him? The top tier quarterbacks, we can't possibly get. We won't be able to get Luck, or most likely any other top rated quarterback. I don't see Smithiak drafting any quality quarterback in the first few rounds. Matt2 won't get a shot unless Matt1 gets injured.

I just go with the flow and root for my guys. It is what it is, and wishing for a new quarterback won't make it happen.

[Jusanotherdude]

Ok... been a minute since I commented on this thread.... Gotta hit some of this....

Originally Posted by Satin

First, I'm just having fun with the Dopey dude.

Damn! I thought we were boys too!

Originally Posted by Satin

But the reality is, this dude is NOT a top 10 QB and you guys know it.

Now here is something that is right and wrong IMHO...... The NFL is Chalk full of "Pretty Good" QBs.... You have maybe 5 or so "Elite" QBs (Rogers, Brady, Brees, Peyton* and most likely Roethlisberger) then you have a group of 10 or so at that next level to which Schaub is in..... Most days you can shake them up and come out about the same..... Schaub is what he is.... he is a facilitator... he's VERY accurate within 20 yds and he executes the offense... he is not a super exciting, explosive, play-making kinda guy..... But he is good, not great, for the offense we have here in Houston..... Can you win with him? Absolutely! Will he win games by himself? No chance..... He is the perfect reflection of his coach as an OC... steady, makes consistant plays, productive, and unsexy.....

Originally Posted by Satin

Also, you have to also take into account he has arguably the best receiver in football to throw to. (personally I think it's Calvin Johnson, then Larry Fitzgerald, and many experts do too, but that's another story

I was hoping to get comments or feedback on other players, the defense or the stats I threw out. But instead you boys wanna focus on one comment about Dopey and make him out to be Montana. Come on gentlemen, you're better than that.....

Ok.... here is where I hate to do this.... but I am going to Validate SOME of their comparisons.....

But first... Megatron is BY FAR the most menacing and feared WR.... but I won't Argue Dre being best either.... Fitz is a definate 3rd in my book here....

As far as the Montana-Schaub comparisons.... ugh! Schaub is NOT Montana... but they share MANY similar attributes.... Montana was also not really a playmaker.... he was much a facilitator as well.... he is great... no doubt.... but he was also the benificiary of having a completely innovative offense and head coach that changed the way games are played.... he had EXTREMELY skilled playmakers his entire time at San Fran... Clark, Rice, Taylor, Rathman, Craig, etc.... he was VERY accurate under 20 yds, and was an extension of his OC..... But early success in College and in the NFL playoffs made him something Schaub is not.... someone who will step on your throat, and rip your heart out at the end of a game.... (which consequently is the ONLY reason I put Roethlisberger in the "Elite" status.... cause he will do the same).

But I just want to reitterate my earlier comments about losing Mario not being that big of a deal.... I LOVE the way that D-line plays now.... Every one of those guys looks like they are fighting to keep thier jobs on every play and it is infectous to the rest of the D....

JaD

[TheDon]

Originally Posted by Jusanotherdude

Now here is something that is right and wrong IMHO...... The NFL is Chalk full of "Pretty Good" QBs.... You have maybe 5 or so "Elite" QBs (Rogers, Brady, Brees, Peyton* and most likely Roethlisberger) then you have a group of 10 or so at that next level to which Schaub is in..... Most days you can shake them up and come out about the same..... Schaub is what he is.... he is a facilitator... he's VERY accurate within 20 yds and he executes the offense... he is not a super exciting, explosive, play-making kinda guy..... But he is good, not great, for the offense we have here in Houston..... Can you win with him? Absolutely! Will he win games by himself? No chance..... He is the perfect reflection of his coach as an OC... steady, makes consistant plays, productive, and unsexy.....

I said something like this a couple pages back, very much agree!

Originally Posted by Satin

It's about wins, losses, playoffs & leading your team to game-winning drives. Be honest, if the game is on the line, do any of you feel 100% confident that Dopey will come through?

Bra, do you remember all the games Schaub nearly lead us back in last year? There were a ton, it's just that our defense sucked at lost all the games for us, I have complete faith in Schaub to led us to victory with the game on the line, here are some of last years games:

Week 2: We outscored Redskins 20-7 in the second half and won in OT. WIN
Week 6: 28 Seconds left, Schaub hits Dre for the game winning TD against the Chiefs after struggling for most game WIN
Week 9: Schaub throws a perfect pass to Dre that bounces off his hands and gets picked off by a guy from the Chargers, we lose LOSS
Week 11: He was great in the second half, we outscored NY Jets 20-10 in the 4th Quarter but lose because of our defense LOSS
Week 13: Schaub lead to us to two straight scoring drives in the 3rd Quarter to take a lead against the Eagles before our defense blew the lead. LOSS
Week 14: Down 28-7, Schaub leads to team to OT, where he did throw the pick six to lose the game, but at least got us there. LOSS

And after week 14, we, like a lot of other teams, just started giving up on the season so they get a higher draft choice.

Granted, the offense was inconstant, but the defense really did suck, plus we had the number one strength in schedule, personally, he proved that he was worthy for my standards (And I have some high and slightly irrational standards for the QB position). But if we had just a mediocre defense last year, we at least win half of these games above. not to mention a lot more which we never allowed ourselves to even have a chance in because they were so bad. But we didn't make the playoffs, this year we are, he's simply going to have to prove it to his critics and his supporters that he's fit for the job. Plain and simple.

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by Don91

Week 2: We outscored Redskins 20-7 in the second half and won in OT. WIN
Week 6: 28 Seconds left, Schaub hits Dre for the game winning TD against the Chiefs after struggling for most game WIN
Week 9: Schaub throws a perfect pass to Dre that bounces off his hands and gets picked off by a guy from the Chargers, we lose LOSS
Week 11: He was great in the second half, we outscored NY Jets 20-10 in the 4th Quarter but lose because of our defense LOSS
Week 13: Schaub lead to us to two straight scoring drives in the 3rd Quarter to take a lead against the Eagles before our defense blew the lead. LOSS
Week 14: Down 28-7, Schaub leads to team to OT, where he did throw the pick six to lose the game, but at least got us there. LOSS

And after week 14, we, like a lot of other teams, just started giving up on the season so they get a higher draft choice.

Granted, the offense was inconstant, but the defense really did suck, plus we had the number one strength in schedule, personally, he proved that he was worthy for my standards (And I have some high and slightly irrational standards for the QB position). But if we had just a mediocre defense last year, we at least win half of these games above. not to mention a lot more which we never allowed ourselves to even have a chance in because they were so bad. But we didn't make the playoffs, this year we are, he's simply going to have to prove it to his critics and his supporters that he's fit for the job. Plain and simple.

If I am not mistaken, you left out the most gut wrenching loss of all last year. The improbable Jacksonville Hail Mary! As I recall, Schaub had a remarkable 2nd half. But it was still another LOSS!

[Guest040616]

6-3. Moving right along!

[TheDon]

TATE

[Satin]

First, to all 4 or 5 members of the "Dopey Fan Club"....you guys have to be joking me or just trying to be comedians, because you can't really be serious... I just wish my civilian football buddies could read some of this stuff you boys are writing. I will say a few more things and just leave it alone about Dopey unless someone says something really smart or really stupid..

First, I hope you all read my remarks about Dopey very carefully because I don't think you understand what I wrote because you're not responding to the basis of what I'm saying.
@Don, I'm most surprised by you bro, after you had some credibility on some things. Dude, you go and "cherry pick" some highlights on Dopey to try to make a point. That's lame. Any QB in the NFL has some great moments. I can come up with a list of stuff 3 times longer on the stupid shit he has done to cause us to lose or greatly contributed to us losing. Let me jar your memory on something very recent...
You do remember the recent Oakland game in which Dopey throws a fucking interception on the last play to lose the game again right? You forgot about that huh?

Bottom line is this on Dopey: he hasn't won shit yet, he's a barely above average QB who can't move or throw well under pressure. He is similar to Sanchez in that he can "manage" the game. He's in the 2nd tier of the top QB's in the NFL.
There are 3 things I wanna see Dopey do:
1. Hand the ball to Foster
2. Hand the ball to Tate
3. Throw "check-down" passes to the tight ends or running backs.

Lastly: Consider this, he has one of the 3 top running backs (Foster) and
receivers (Andre) in the league to take a lot of pressure off him. He also has a
great offensive line that gives him good protection.

I just wanna celebrate our record and great game today. Texans took care of business and played smart. I am thrilled to see Tate doing so well. He seems slow but noone can stop him. (what's his 40 yard dash time?) I am also happy with Brooks Reid. I stand by my earlier position on Mario. I have always said he was overrated as a #1 pick. I have no problems letting his ass go now, after seeing Brooks perform.
Texans first place baby.....

[TheDon]

Originally Posted by Satin

First, to all 4 or 5 members of the "Dopey Fan Club"....you guys have to be joking me or just trying to be comedians, because you can't really be serious... I just wish my civilian football buddies could read some of this stuff you boys are writing. I will say a few more things and just leave it alone about Dopey unless someone says something really smart or really stupid..

First, I hope you all read my remarks about Dopey very carefully because I don't think you understand what I wrote because you're not responding to the basis of what I'm saying.
@Don, I'm most surprised by you bro, after you had some credibility on some things. Dude, you go and "cherry pick" some highlights on Dopey to try to make a point. That's lame. Any QB in the NFL has some great moments. I can come up with a list of stuff 3 times longer on the stupid shit he has done to cause us to lose or greatly contributed to us losing. Let me jar your memory on something very recent...
You do remember the recent Oakland game in which Dopey throws a fucking interception on the last play to lose the game again right? You forgot about that huh?

Bottom line is this on Dopey: he hasn't won shit yet, he's a barely above average QB who can't move or throw well under pressure. He is similar to Sanchez in that he can "manage" the game. He's in the 2nd tier of the top QB's in the NFL.
There are 3 things I wanna see Dopey do:
1. Hand the ball to Foster
2. Hand the ball to Tate
3. Throw "check-down" passes to the tight ends or running backs.

Lastly: Consider this, he has one of the 3 top running backs (Foster) and
receivers (Andre) in the league to take a lot of pressure off him. He also has a
great offensive line that gives him good protection.

I just wanna celebrate our record and great game today. Texans took care of business and played smart. I am thrilled to see Tate doing so well. He seems slow but noone can stop him. (what's his 40 yard dash time?) I am also happy with Brooks Reid. I stand by my earlier position on Mario. I have always said he was overrated as a #1 pick. I have no problems letting his ass go now, after seeing Brooks perform.
Texans first place baby.....

Again, I'll say this again, I'm no member of the Matt Schaub fan club. But he's easily a top 10 QB right now, I have no issue with defending him on that.

I only cherry picked those highlights because one of your points was that he couldn't get a win if the game were on the line. I simply pointed out that he has, and is capable of doing so. No team had more 4th Quarter comebacks than the Texans last year, I gave out all the games to prove it.

I'm aware he threw a pick to lose against Oakland. Did you watch the games a couple weeks back when Rivers and Romo threw the ball out of bounds at the final seconds of the game? That was Schaub simply trying to make a play, at least he gave the guy a chance. And out of 9 games this year, that has been his only bad game. And the only 2 other games we've lost, we had chances to win, and at one point, were leading in the second half. There isn't really much more you can ask from your starting QB. Yes, he absolutely is in the second tier of the top QB's in the league, he's arguably the best QB in the league who's not considered an elite QB. That's not something to feel bad about.

This is only Fosters second year here, Schaub hasn't been playing with him for that long, and the defense sucked through the first half of Shcaubs career here. And even in this year, Foster and Dre have only played one quarter together, and it was against the Steelers, and we dominated them in that quarter.

There's a reason Matt Scahub has been ranked a top 8 QB in Madden for two years in a row now. And you mention how you wish how some of your buddies can read this? Players AND fans around the league and country know he's top 10 QB. The majority of his are the local fans, who are also mostly the irrational fans (Not saying you're on of them).

[DEAR_JOHN]

Originally Posted by Satin

You do remember the recent Oakland game in which Dopey throws a fucking interception on the last play to lose the game again right? You forgot about that huh?

I put that play on Jacobi as much as Schaub. Once the called play is blown up, like that play that originally went to the right, the play is over and it's time to improvise. If Jacobi would have taken a move toward the sideline, he would have at least given Schaub a chance. At it was he continued to run the same pattern. WWJD (what would Johnson do), he would have taken a hard move to the middle, then broken back to the corner. Schaub couldn't have run the ball in, he would have gotten killed at around the two yard line.

I repeat what I posted earlier, name someone better we realistically have a chance to get. Someone proven in the pro's. There are only a few elites, and nobody in their right mind would give them up.

It is what it is. Like Schaub or not, we're stuck with him. Maybe one day he will meet some of the high expectations some have set for him.

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by DEAR_JOHN

Maybe one day he will meet some of the high expectations some have set for him.

I am the first to say that Schaub is not one of the NFL's 4 or 5 elite qbs but he is much better than most. I would even go a step further and say that he could be a Super Bowl qb with the right team around him. It remains to be seen whether this Texan team will be that caliber. As Don accurately pointed out, we have only seen Schaub, Dre and Foster on the field together for 1 quarter this year. I was in the stadium that day and the first drive where they took Pittsburgh's opening kickoff and held the ball for 11 minutes before scoring a TD was the best offensive series in the team's history.

Bottom line: Schaub is a very good but not an elite NFL qb. Even if he had a qb rating of 100+ every week (which would make him elite), there would still be those who complain that he is not elite enough!

[Daddio]

Great game today, or actually great first half today. Schaubler was very good early in the game but then reverted to his slow ass self again. On the pick he thru he was very slow and late with the ball to I believe it was driessen. It caused the defense to close on dreissen and stick him good. He fumbled into the air and the browns snagged it. Several times we ran the bootleg play and he wasn't fast enough with a decision and had to throw it away.

My beef with schaub is he is ok but could be damn good if he would just speed up his decision making or awareness. He also needs to get much more consistent and drink some fucking coffee or slam a monster before the game to help him speed the fuck up.

Chaulk one up for dopey and the "D" today. It's good to be 6 and 3. The browns suck badly. If we get to 7-3 I will be very happy. Go texans.

[DEAR_JOHN]

Originally Posted by Daddio

If we get to 7-3 I will be very happy.

After reading your whole anti Schaub post, consider me skeptical if you'll be very happy if we win next win.

I read several Texan forums and a lot of people don't like Schaub or Kubiak. I can't help but wonder how many of those people have ever strapped on pads and taken snaps, or walked the sidelines as a coach, head coach, or coordinator.

[Guest040616]

Originally Posted by DEAR_JOHN

After reading your whole anti Schaub post, consider me skeptical if you'll be very happy if we win next win.

I read several Texan forums and a lot of people don't like Schaub or Kubiak. I can't help but wonder how many of those people have ever strapped on pads and taken snaps, or walked the sidelines as a coach, head coach, or coordinator.

Football Fans are Fickle (with a capital "F"). That is another way of saying "the grass is always greener on the other side."

The Texans have met my expectations thus far. In many ways, you could say they have exceded my expectations. If you would have told me prior to the season that we would be 6-3 at this point in the season despite the fact that (1) Mario was hurt early and is out for the season, (2) Foster would miss 4-5 games entirely and (3) Dre would also miss 4-5 games entirely. I would have said "no way in hell the Texans would be 6-3."

Not only have they done so, they have done so impressively, winning 4 of the 6 by 10 or more points! They have been forced to overcome a lot of obstacles and have played the most consistent football in their short history! Of course, that is not saying much! Yet for many it still is not enough, the team should be better. Schaub should be better as if we cannot settle for anything less than the very best!

After 9 games, the defense is playing much better than I expected. Cushing and Joseph are playing at an All Pro level. While Kareen Jackson was a total bust in 2010, he is now playing at a much more consistent level. He is not where he needs to be but at least we are seeing there is hope for his future! The MVP for the Defense has been Wade Phillips.

Offensively, they seem to have improved their consistency on their performances of the past few years. We all knew they were capable of doing good things offensively but something was missing. The one thing that is most impressive about this years offense is that they have improved despite the fact that Dre and Foster have both missed significiant playing time. The MVP for the offense has been the Offensive Line!

Which brings us to the Team MVP for the first 9 games of the 2011 season. I would have to say it has been Matt Schaub. I know the detractors are going to pile on but I say "give it your best shot, cuz you ain't gettin' no cherry!" Schaub has held things together despite the offense only having their two most explosive weapons playing on the same field for 1 quarter this year! He has not been flashy but he has carried out the offensive game plan fairly well, with a minimum number of mistakes! His QB rating is in the mid 90's and his yards per pass attempt has consisitently been among the best in the NFL this year. All things considered, I can't ask for much more than that!

Schaub has a quarterback rating in the mid 90's which is just a tad below what is considered to be the ratings needed to qualify for upper tier quarterback status! If the running game is clicking, which normally seems to be the case, he is content to hand the ball off. I won't give him an A+ for the first 9 games of the season but he deserves an A- for holding things together! The most overlooked benenfit of having a healthy Schaub on the field is what we would do without him. We have proved we can win without Dre and Foster. We have not proven we can win without Schaub. Had we lost our QB to injury early in the year, I suspect our record would be closer to 3-6 than 6-3!

Prior to the season, I was hoping for a 10-6 Texan's season and a playoff appearance. I am going to up the ante a little to 11-5, with an outside possibility of ending the season 12-4. They have proved to me they can play with the top tier AFC teams despite the fact they have had significant injuries to both their offense and defense. I am not predicting a Texan Super Bowl appearance, although it would not surprise me if they end up being the AFC representative next January! As an aside, I feel Baltimore, Pittsburgh and NE are the teams to beat in the AFC. My prediction is Green Bay will return to the SB and beat Baltimore!

Baltimore? YIKES!!!!! They have another one of those awful 2nd tier quarterbacks leading them! Shit, I have seen it all now!!!!!!

That's my story and I'm sticking to it!

[Daddio]

This is by far the best Texans team we have had so far. To be 6 - 3 is great, especially with the injury trouble we have had so far. Brooks Reed and all the linemen have stepped up and look great. JJ Watt is the man!!! The secondary is playing much better also even cough cough Kareem Jackson.

However, Lets not get ahead of ourselves however because we have only beaten 1 quality team, the Steelers and the Steeler O line was in disarray when we beat them. Other than that we have beaten 5 very weak teams and lost to the only quality opponents on the schedule in New Orleans and Baltimore and also lost to the crappy Raiders at home.

Now mark my words, "Schaub will be the reason this team can't finish off a truly great season" When the chips are down, his lack of mobility and quick decision making will cost us that playoff game.

Getting to the playoffs will be great fun for all of us, but I don't want just to get there, I want to win the Super Bowl baby!! I will gladly hook Dopey up with a latina of his choosing if we win the Super Bowl. Do you hear me Dopey, a date with Esmerelda will wake you the fuck up!!

Go Texans, Go Dopey, prove me wrong!!