Obama vs. Perry: Who Would You Vote For?

[Billy_Saul]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

You're wrong Billy. The Democrats at their highest point held only 58 seats in the senate,

+ Bernie Sanders - self proclaimed socialist, Sanders caucuses with the Democrats and is counted as a Democrat for the purposes of committee assignments, calls himself a socialist democrat

+ Joe Lieberman - life long democrat, currently a registered democrat, democratic appointed chairman of Senate committee for Homeland Security, ex democrat nominee for vice president, calls himself an independent

equals 60 filibuster proof Democratic majority, you can call yourself a communist, socialist, nazi, penguin, elm tree, or whatever but a democrat is a democrat is a democrat

[F-Sharp]

Oh Billy, Pahleeze! Even if we were to follow your logic, that 58 + 2 majority only held true for two months, July and September of 2009. Democratic numbers were as low as 55 at the beginning of the first session. Here's a nice little graph:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/111th_U...tates_Congress

Besides that, what is your point? I fail to actually see one. Are you trying to say that the GOP and the 112th Congress has written and passed jobs legislation, or are you trying to say the Democrats and the 111th Congress did not? Here's some examples of the 112th Congress at work...

Creating American Jobs And Ending Offshoring Act - Clotured 9/28/2010

Economic Development Revitalization Act of 2011 - Clotured 6/6/2011

Small Business Innovation Research Reauthorization Act - Died in the senate after being bogged down with ammendments by Senate Republicans including everything from repealing healthcare and financial reform to expanding offshore drilling.

This is your GOP Congress at work my friend. You might be better off addressing the Healthcare legislation question.

[Billy_Saul]

I watched a show on CNBC this week on Infrastructure where one of the features was on the levees surrounding Sacramento and the severely poor shape they were in. Breech of this levee system was said to be able to cause 10 to 20 feet of water standing in the streets of downtown creating a Katrina like disaster.

Estimated repair cost to this system was half a billion dollars. So I am immediately thinking why would we pay over half a billion dollars to Solyndra shortly before they went bankrupt when the same amount of money would actually do some good somewhere and actually create some jobs that would last longer then a few days.

This is the problem with your administration. They are incapable of spending money efficiently. $800 billion dollars for stimulus was wasted on political favors and stupid projects where as simple mathematics would dictate that 4 million workers could be employed for two years on a salary of $100,000 each for that amount of money. Think about that for a minute. 4 million jobs instantly. Jobs that could be building roads, bridges, railroads etc. That money was spent but where are the jobs.

Obama doesn't need congressional approval to create 100s of thousands of jobs, yet out of political expedience he holds up a decision on the keystone pipeline project which would create 200,000 jobs at the snap of a finger. Obamas policy is to fuck national security, fuck energy independence, fuck a bunch of jobs, fuck the collective good, my reelection is what is important. This is but one of many examples.

This administration is corrupt, inefficient, incompetent and thankfully on its way out.

[Booth]

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

This administration is corrupt, inefficient, incompetent and thankfully on its way out.

I'll concede the first two but the jury is still out on the others.

[F-Sharp]

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

This is the problem with your administration.

Why is it anytime someone shares some basic facts around here it becomes "my administration" or I get labeled a liberal, socialist, and any dozen of other names. Once again for the record, there are plenty of things I do not like about Obama and *HIS* administration. Nor can I call myself fiscally liberal.

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

$800 billion dollars for stimulus was wasted on political favors and stupid projects where as simple mathematics would dictate that 4 million workers could be employed for two years on a salary of $100,000 each for that amount of money. Think about that for a minute. 4 million jobs instantly. Jobs that could be building roads, bridges, railroads etc. That money was spent but where are the jobs.

Emmm, I guess you didn't get the memo.

"The White House says the multiyear $814 billion stimulus program passed by Congress in 2009 boosted employment by 2.5 million to 3.6 million jobs and raised the nation's annual economic output by almost $400 billion. A recent study by two prominent economists generally agrees, crediting the pump-priming with averting "what could have been called Great Depression 2.0."

http://www.usatoday.com/money/econom...lus30_CV_N.htm

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

Obamas policy is to fuck national security

Nothing but conjecture Billy, care to try and back that statement with some bonafide facts?

Let's see...he increased defense budget and funding for Afghanistan, broke his campaign promise to remain in both Iraq and Afghanistan, has taken out an endless list of top names in both Al Queda and Taliban, including Osama Bin Laden. If you ask me, Obama was far effective at eliminating our so-called enemies than Bush ever was.

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

fuck energy independence

What you refer to as "energy independence" is nothing more than a temporary band-aid. Drilling our soil on or off shore is nothing but a feeble attempt to prolonge the inevitable. We will run out of oil in the next 50 years Billy. Drilling is not a solution and certainly wont bring about energy independence.

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

fuck a bunch of jobs,

Again, see above. 3 million + jobs created by the stimulus, another 1.1 saved by the auto-bailout and chose to extend the Bush tax cuts against all logic and in defiance of his own party. What has your party done for job creation? ZIP!

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

fuck the collective good,

Now who's the socialist?

Originally Posted by Billy_Saul

This administration is corrupt, inefficient, incompetent and thankfully on its way out.

Conjecture, conjecture, conjecture, and ...wanna make a bet?

[WyldemanATX]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

Oh Bullshit Wyldeman. Why don't you give us some examples of this over-regulation? It hurts small business if you have lots of government regulation. Think about it and take emotion out of what you are saying for once. If you want to start up a company and you have to deal with a lot of red tape you may just give up before even starting.

Do you know what percentage of U.S. revenue is paid by corporations? 8%! U.S. corporations are currently paying the lowest amount of taxes to GDP in all our history. Do you ever know what that means? In a nutshell it means they are making more money, while giving less of that money to the government. Here's a pretty picture in case the words evade your ability to comprehend.

Now where exactly do you get this completely unsubstantiated bullshit of yours? Further, why do you insist on forming your opinions around ideas that have no merit what-so-ever?

You sure do leave out a bunch of taxes don't you.... Payroll taxes, taxes paid on operation expenses, Taxes on EQ, and capital gains taxes..... Raising taxes does not exactly make people want to jump up and start a company.

[F-Sharp]

Originally Posted by Wyldeman30

You sure do leave out a bunch of taxes don't you.... Payroll taxes, taxes paid on operation expenses, Taxes on EQ, and capital gains taxes..... Raising taxes does not exactly make people want to jump up and start a company.

What the hell are you talking about now Wyledman?

"It hurts small business if you have lots of government regulation. Think about it and take emotion out of what you are saying for once. If you want to start up a company and you have to deal with a lot of red tape you may just give up before even starting."

That's funny. I've owned and run three seperate businesses in my life, in two seperate states and abroad, and other than a few forms that needed filling out, there wasn't any of this magical red-tape you speak of. Hell, you don't even need a business license here in Texas!

Payroll taxes? Taxes withheld from an employees paycheck include Social Security, Medicare and Federal income taxes. That's the employee's salary and employee's salary is always considered a write-off by the company filing.

Operational expenses? I don't even know what the hell you mean by this. A company's electrical bill is not a tax, and again, these expenses (including the taxes paid on those expenses) are considered a write-off at the end of the year.

Excise tax? This cost is passed on to the customer and helps determine the price of whatever product or service a company is selling. In fact, through Obama's stimulus package vehicle excise tax can now be used as a write-off.

Capital gains? Now you're just fucking with me right? If a company chooses to invest it's money in order to make a profit, why in the hell would they not be expected to pay tax on that income? Incidentally, long term capital gains tax was reduced from 5% to 0% by Obama in Dec. 2010 through the tax cut extension for those in a 10-15% income bracket.

Now I'm begging you Wyldeman, please start reading something besides comic books and this forum. At least pick up a newspaper once in awhile.

[WyldemanATX]

Originally Posted by F-Sharp

Now I'm begging you Wyldeman, please start reading something besides comic books and this forum. At least pick up a newspaper once in awhile.

I am begging you Fshard please stop drinking the cool aid and acting so emotional. Go play a manly game or have a beer dude. You obviously are wound way too tight...

[LaredoZeta]

Que estupido!

It is esport to watch you Norteamericanos argue about your presidente. The less brilliante of the group always makes most sound.

HAHAHA!~

[WyldemanATX]

No more Obama. His days are numbered...

You could also take all the wealth away from the rich in this country and you still would not solve the debt problem.

Fsharted 8% is complete bullshit we tax our most wealthy the in this country more than most.

[F-Sharp]

Originally Posted by Wyldeman30

Fsharted 8% is complete bullshit we tax our most wealthy the in this country more than most.

Again, where exactly do you get this bullshit of yours from? You have me wondering Wyldeman... Knowing full well that everything you *think* you know is completely wrong, doesn't that make you question the source(s) of your knowledge and (lack of) education? If it were me, I think I'd be pretty pissed off to learn that any knowledge or education I possessed was completely wrong and that I had been bamboozled my whole life. What's more? You've been corrected on some of these points before right here in this forum, and you still pretend like you don't know better. Can you seriously not be bothered to perform the even the most basic of fact checking?

Anyway, looks like my info was slightly dated. I've got 7.4% in 2003 and 12% in 2008. I am fairly certain that number is currently down to 8% due to the impacts of the recession, but I wont waste my time and efforts correcting you any further. It just gets old.

"Corporate revenues represented only 7.4 percent of all federal tax receipts in 2003. With the exception of 1983, this represents the lowest level on record (these data go back to 1934)."

http://www.cbpp.org/cms/index.cfm?fa=view&id=1311

[F-Sharp]

Here ya go Numbnuts..2009 numbers straight from the IRS. Total corporate revenue collected before returns for 2009 amounted to 9.6% of all revenue collected.

http://www.irs.gov/taxstats/article/...102886,00.html


...and again from the previously posted report:

"Corporate income tax revenues are lower in the United States than in most European countries. According to data from the Organization for Economic Cooperation and Development, total federal and state corporate income tax revenues in the United States in 2000, measured as a share of the economy, were about one-quarter less than the average for other OECD member countries. Thirty-five years ago, the opposite was true — corporations in the United States bore a heavier burden than their European counterparts."

[WyldemanATX]

Let me simplify your logic for you..... Business owner has a 100K and he can hire either 2 Employees or pay 100k extra in taxes.....Which would you do Ftard??????

The logic you are using is take away 100k from business owner to give to government so they can do more research on some lizard or rat...Some how that stimulates the economy. It boggles the mind the logic you speak....

Our rich in this country are taxed over 35% dude. IRS is a separate and unregulated entity. I say fuck the IRS and put in the fair tax.

Lets talk true trickle down economics! This is when you are giving the government more money and they actually waste more than what they are given. Lets instead reverse this disease of looking for the almighty government to handle our problems with our money and go with an upside down funnel economics system. Less money for our government to spend and more money for their working American to reach out and do good things for community.

[F-Sharp]

Originally Posted by Wyldeman30

The logic you are using is take away 100k from business owner to give to government so they can do more research on some lizard or rat...Some how that stimulates the economy. It boggles the mind the logic you speak.....

That's *my* logic?

Originally Posted by Wyldeman30

Our rich in this country are taxed over 35% dude. IRS is a separate and unregulated entity. I say fuck the IRS and put in the fair tax.

Again, BULLSHIT. The average "rich" pay 7% - 25% in taxes, and often times nothing at all.

I'll prove it to you...corporate profits currently amount to a little better than $5 trillion a year. If corporations were paying 35% of that profit in taxes as you claim, that would amount to $1.75 trillion in revenue, or roughly 75% of all Federal revenue collected last year. You're not even close Numbnutz. Not by a LONG SHOT. Total corporate revenue collected in 2009 amounted to $225 billion, or as previously stated, 9.6% of federal revenue.

Originally Posted by Wyldeman30

Lets talk true trickle down economics! This is when you are giving the government more money and they actually waste more than what they are given. Lets instead reverse this disease of looking for the almighty government to handle our problems with our money and go with an upside down funnel economics system. Less money for our government to spend and more money for their working American to reach out and do good things for community.

So you're proposing that the average "working American" begin taking it upon themselves to build roads and schools, to maintain National Parks and subsidize public education, provide for our national defense and pay for our wars overseas instead of paying taxes? That might just be the stupidest thing I've heard in a long time Wyldeman. Are you currently taking prescription medication? Are you actively seeing a mental health professional? Please tell me this is not just you own personally concocted idiocy. PLEASE!

[Billy_Saul]

Originally Posted by Booth

I'll concede the first two but the jury is still out on the others.

MSNBC Matthews Turns On Obama...

The tingle is gone