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Trump has calculated for the China moves.
Uh, like He calculated the jobs creation.
Above Expectations! ... Go look.
... And China's gonna blink in the tariff battle.
As the other nations start to roll over.
#### Salty
A friend of mine who's just as or more pro Trump than you are was making a similar argument today. He believes Trump's using this as a negotiating tool. And admittedly, often when people thought Trump was bat shit crazy, he was really crazy like a fox. One example was telling Kim he was going to blast North Korea off the face of the planet, before buddying up to him. The result was that North Korea stopped testing intermediate and long range ballistic missiles, at least until Biden was elected. The other was sending planes to bomb Iran and then recalling them at the last minute.
Trump likes for world leaders to believe he's bat shit crazy. So is it possible they'll think he's going to put the world into a recession if they don't back off on their tariff rates? And the world will end up with with freer and fairer trade after Trump finishes negotiating with them?
I don't think so Salty. Trump's believed in tariffs all his life. He was spouting off about it in the 1980's, the 1990's, etc. He wants an America like it was during his childhood in the 1950's, with lots of unskilled and semi-skilled manufacturing jobs. He doesn't realize we'll be worse off if we go back to that.
Today he was golfing in Miami when the market was in melt down mode. I'm somewhat worried that he's slipping mentally, like Biden did during his term. Maybe he's a true believer in tariffs, but the Donald Trump of 8 years ago wouldn't be oblivious to the carnage going on around him.
If Trump doesn't reverse course we'll probably go into a recession.
Tiny, dummy Trump was championing President Mckinley's tariffs while he was campaigning and talking about how great tariffs were back then. Well, forget about the fact that McKinley was assassinated in 1901, but aren't we living in a slightly different economy now due to technology and global labor arbitrage? Somebody needs to explain that to Trump.
Trump has no fucking clue what he is doing. He is an idiot and needs to be stopped before he crashes people's life worth of savings while also increasing inflation at the same time. It's that simple.
How fucking irresponsible, reckless and stupid do you have to be to have the market lose over 6 trillion dollars in 2 fucking days? This is a game to him. It's not a game for the millions who can't afford to play his game.
Trump has no fucking clue what he is doing. He is an idiot and needs to be stopped before he crashes people's life worth of savings while also increasing inflation at the same time. It's that simple.
Tiny, dummy Trump was championing President Mckinley's tariffs while he was campaigning and talking about how great tariffs were back then. Well, forget about the fact that McKinley was assassinated in 1901, but aren't we living in a slightly different economy now due to technology and global labor arbitrage? Somebody needs to explain that to Trump.
Trump has no fucking clue what he is doing. He is an idiot and needs to be stopped before he crashes people's life worth of savings while also increasing inflation at the same time. It's that simple.
How fucking irresponsible, reckless and stupid do you have to be to have the market lose over 6 trillion dollars in 2 fucking days? This is a game to him. It's not a game for the millions who can't afford to play his game.
McCain, Because he survived two assassination attempts he believes the Lord put him on this planet to impose tariffs and Make America Great. In the words of Jake and Elwood Blues, he's on a mission from God!
That's what one of the pundits said today anyway, except for the part about the Blues Brothers. The pundit may have exaggerated, but Trump does truly believe he's anointed. And that's going to make it more difficult for him to change course.
Trump likes for world leaders to believe he's bat shit crazy. So is it possible they'll think he's going to put the world into a recession if they don't back off on their tariff rates? And the world will end up with with freer and fairer trade after Trump finishes negotiating with them?
I don't think so Salty. Trump's believed in tariffs all his life. He was spouting off about it in the 1980's, the 1990's, etc. He wants an America like it was during his childhood in the 1950's, with lots of unskilled and semi-skilled manufacturing jobs. He doesn't realize we'll be worse off if we go back to that.
Earlier in this saga, I thought there was a good chance that Trump, who fancies himself as quite the dealmaker, would play the game to something closer to an American fare-thee-well resulting in some sort of free trade/fair trade hybrid that might be better than the status quo ante. But, like you, I've been quickly losing confidence in his ability to avoid leaving a massive quantity of wreckage in his wake.
If Donald doubles down on the worst of his impulses, I'm afraid this is what we have to look forward to:
"Mister, we could use a man like Herbert Hoover again."
(At the 23-second mark)
Way back as a 20-something lad, I was rather startled to see that line in the TV show's intro. (We could use a man like Herbert Hoover again? For what, pray tell?)
Well, unless Donald starts course-correcting -- and fast! -- we may have our 21st Century Herbert Hoover.
A friend of mine who's just as or more pro Trump than you are was making a similar argument today. He believes Trump's using this as a negotiating tool. And admittedly, often when people thought Trump was bat shit crazy, he was really crazy like a fox. One example was telling Kim he was going to blast North Korea off the face of the planet, before buddying up to him. The result was that North Korea stopped testing intermediate and long range ballistic missiles, at least until Biden was elected. The other was sending planes to bomb Iran and then recalling them at the last minute.
Trump likes for world leaders to believe he's bat shit crazy. So is it possible they'll think he's going to put the world into a recession if they don't back off on their tariff rates? And the world will end up with with freer and fairer trade after Trump finishes negotiating with them?
I don't think so Salty. Trump's believed in tariffs all his life. He was spouting off about it in the 1980's, the 1990's, etc. He wants an America like it was during his childhood in the 1950's, with lots of unskilled and semi-skilled manufacturing jobs. He doesn't realize we'll be worse off if we go back to that.
Today he was golfing in Miami when the market was in melt down mode. I'm somewhat worried that he's slipping mentally, like Biden did during his term. Maybe he's a true believer in tariffs, but the Donald Trump of 8 years ago wouldn't be oblivious to the carnage going on around him.
If Trump doesn't reverse course we'll probably go into a recession.
And while we set in the Persian Gulf in 1990, George Bush mispronounced Saddam's name and played golf to show his disdain.
Don't engage in high finance if you don't understand it. What would Axelrod of Axe Capital do?
Don't engage in high finance if you don't understand it. What would Axelrod of Axe Capital do?
He would have borrowed every share of the Vietnam ETF's he could locate and sold them short. Obviously foreign exporters that sell a large percentage of their production to the USA are good candidates to short as well.
Then there are the people who will actually be paying the tariffs. You can't really short the American Consumer. So how about clothing retailers, who import 90% of what they sell, and companies like Apple. Which American exporters depend a lot on imported raw materials and parts? Short those suckers too! They can't compete, they won't be around much longer.
Just as you can't short the American Consumer, you also can't short The American Farmer. So how about Archer Daniels Midland? Anybody who will get hit by retaliatory tariffs imposed by foreign countries. Are there any distillers with a high % of export sales? Not only are they going to get hit with big duties, but the foreigners will stop buying bourbon and Tennessee whiskey because they're "made in America." That's already happening in Canada. Canadians are quaffing Molson and Labatt Blue and boycotting Budweiser. And short any exporters based in red states, because Macron and Xi and the others will take particular delight in taking jobs away from Trump supporters.
Now if Axe had been really prescient, he would have shorted the banks too. They took a big dive. When people start worrying about a meltdown they worry about loans going bad and companies going bankrupt. Axe might have been so negative he just would have shorted the U.S. index futures. That would have been great in hindsight. Based on the declines in the indices, the market appears to believe that U.S. companies will get hit worse than foreign companies. Maybe it's because U.S. companies and the consumers they sell to will bear most of the cost of actually paying the tariffs. Since Trump's announcement in the Rose Garden, the Shenzhen Composite is down 1.1% and the Shanghai composite is down 0.24%. The S&P 500 is down 10.5%. All thanks to The Very Stable Genius.
Quote:
Originally Posted by Schwarzer Ritter
Do you know what Herbert Hoover was guilty of doing?
Please take that over to Winn Dixie's Transexual Transvestite thread. This is no place for it.
Yesterday Trump said, “Sometimes you have to take medicine to fix something.” What does he want us to take? Arsenic?
He’s bragging about lower oil prices and interest rates. They’re lower because his tariffs have radically increased the probability of a slowdown or recession.
corporate income taxes are on profits. everyone got paid. this is the money we have left over. your point lacks merit.
if we dont pay off the debt, eventually the market will come for us. Trump's approach is planned fuckery: more red ink til the markets cut up our credit cards. hyperinflation ensues..
Quote:
Originally Posted by farmstud60
To be honest I think Trump is trying to find a way to get rid of the totally corrupt Income Tax system that seems to only benefit the politicians in Washington DC.
The United States Federal government used to be funded on tariffs alone.
What I find amazing is how people want to say tariffs are inflationary, but they ignore than raising corporate income tax rates are also inflationary.
The man is an idiot that has surrounded himself with idiots. People who are afraid to speak their mind and just reinforce Trump’s ignorance through their constant ass kissing.
I predicted this last year.
Quote:
Originally Posted by txdot-guy
It doesn’t take a psychic to see that chaos is coming to the economy. Nobody thrives on chaos. Higher prices, higher inflation, poorer people are the new norm in my opinion. All because of Trump and his dumb ass tariffs.
corporate income taxes are on profits. everyone got paid. this is the money we have left over. your point lacks merit.
if we dont pay off the debt, eventually the market will come for us. Trump's approach is planned fuckery: more red ink til the markets cut up our credit cards. hyperinflation ensues..
Another consideration, about Farmstud's thoughts, is that today only 14% of US GDP is imports. Back in the day, the USA was much more dependent on imports, and the beast (government) wasn't nearly as large. Small Caribbean countries that import a lot can pay for government largely through tariffs. We're not in the same boat.
I don't see tariffs generating $700 billion a year in revenues, which appears to be the top end estimate within the Trump administration. But if they did, that's not enough to eliminate a $1.8 trillion budget deficit, let alone generate revenues equivalent to the income tax.
The man is an idiot that has surrounded himself with idiots. People who are afraid to speak their mind and just reinforce Trump’s ignorance through their constant ass kissing.
I predicted this last year.
He's got some intelligent people in his administration. The problem until a couple of days ago at least was that he was listening to the idiots, like Peter Retarrdo. (That Elon Musk's nickname for Peter Navarro, not mine.)
After the huge drop in share prices and the increase in yields of longer duration bonds, now Treasury Secretary Bessent has his ear. Let's hope and pray he continues to.
Depending on the source, the effective tariff rate on imports was 1.5% to 3% before this year. If the tariffs that have been delayed by 90 days do NOT take effect, one research shop is expecting that to rise to 17%, AFTER Chinese exports shift to other countries. (They estimate the rate will be higher initially.) That's way too high. Zero percent, except on products that are important for national security, would be a whole lot better.
