Sign the Second Bill of Rights

[joe bloe]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Funny, when I was in Europe for a couple of weeks in late July, they didn't seem to be bankrupt! Restaurants were full, food markets were full of great fruits and produce. Real estate prices hadn't fallen in either Paris or Provence, or so I was told. Not in Tuscany, either.

In light of your new post, I'd like to revise my prior post. YOU GUYS ARE NUTS!!!!!
Europe is in a financial crisis, and it's because of unsustainable social welfare spending. That is an undeniable fact. You can pretend that everything is fine if you want to. Liberals are doing the same thing with our debt crisis; they seem to think we can keep on funding entitlement spending, at the current level, forever. We can't.

Apparently you didn't go to Greece.

[ss4699]

Originally Posted by joe bloe

...; they seem to think we can keep on funding entitlement spending, at the current level, forever. We can't.

I would agree. When JFK had Kennedy killed, he opened a flood gave of give aways that are heading down hill now. I never missed a days work for over 40 years and ended you on unemployement for 13 months. I had paid in way more than I got back. The welfare state is when those who don't pay in, just take out go to do that?

Originally Posted by joe bloe

Apparently you didn't go to Greece.

Stacy SOF and Auburn Jewel have taken me there but that is a different topic!

I did do a post on another site a couple of months ago. There is a big "payoff" in Greece from what I found out. Folks file wrong on in to the "tax man" to settle and bribe their way out at a mimumum payment!

Good discussion!

[theaustinescorts]

Hankering,

To put it mildly your notions about recent world history are wacked.

Let's look at the facts instead of your paranoid delusions.

1.Alaska wasn't part of the United States in WWII. Duh......
It was a territory not much different than Guam, Hawaii, Midway, etc....
And besides the Japanese who dug in on those abandoned islands where no Americans lived is not an invasion. If you knew history you would know that the Japanese occupation of those islands was in the hopes of drawing US naval forces north to defend them while the Japanese navy struck at southernly targets. It was nothing more than a ruse.

2.Every archive, document, interview and record indicates that Germany in WWII absolutely had no plans to invade the United States. This is of course ridiculous.
Now FDR did read on radio a speech where he said a map had fallen into his hands which the Germans produced showing how they intended to split the Western Hemisphere up....but guess what?

That map was a forgery concocted by William Stephenson, a Canadian-British agent, one of 3,000 such agents working in the US, and the Germans had nothing to do with it.

When FDR found out it was a forgery he ordered Stephenson out of the country and ordered the FBI to start deporting British agents, but then Dec. 7th happened and he reversed his orders.

3.The propaganda from Claire Sterling and Arno DeBorgrave in the 1970s that the Soviet Union was behind terrorism turned out to all be lies. The Atlantic monthly is a hopelessly retarded rag run by Robert Kagan, a known foreign agent, and nothing it prints on foreign affairs is true.

The TRUTH is that after the Munich attack in 1972 President Nixon ordered the CIA to go to Libya and Uganda and help those governments arm and train all terrorist groups in exchange for their agreement that they would not target Americans.

Even the George Jonas book VENGEANCE, which was made into a Speilberg film [Munich] deals with this issue, as the Israelis discovered that after Munich the CIA began giving large amounts of money and personal protection to Black September in exchange for their pledge not to target Americans.

This plan was carried out by two retired CIA officers, Fank Terpil and Ed Wilson. Wilson sent active duty US Marines and Green Berets to train in Lybian terrorist training camps as well as shipped to Kadaffi 20 tons of C-4 explosive. This is the explosive that turned up everywhere in almost every terrorist explosion thereafter, including the bombing of a 747 over Lockerbee, Scottland in 1986.

In the 1970s it was the US which was supporting almost all international terrorist groups.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

Hankering,

To put it mildly your notions about recent world history are wacked.

Let's look at the facts instead of your paranoid delusions.

1.Alaska wasn't part of the United States in WWII. Duh......
It was a territory not much different than Guam, Hawaii, Midway, etc....
And besides the Japanese who dug in on those abandoned islands where no Americans lived is not an invasion. If you knew history you would know that the Japanese occupation of those islands was in the hopes of drawing US naval forces north to defend them while the Japanese navy struck at southernly targets. It was nothing more than a ruse. Yes, Alaska was a U.S. territory, just like Guam, Midway, and especially Hawaii. Your point? Everyone born in those territories are/were U.S. citizens. The Japanese invaded Alaska: a U.S. territory.

2.Every archive, document, interview and record indicates that Germany in WWII absolutely had no plans to invade the United States. This is of course ridiculous.
Hitler had a "Stufenplan" for world domination.

http://www.amazon.com/TARGET-AMERICA...pr_product_top

Now FDR did read on radio a speech where he said a map had fallen into his hands which the Germans produced showing how they intended to split the Western Hemisphere up....but guess what?

That map was a forgery concocted by William Stephenson, a Canadian-British agent, one of 3,000 such agents working in the US, and the Germans had nothing to do with it.

When FDR found out it was a forgery he ordered Stephenson out of the country and ordered the FBI to start deporting British agents, but then Dec. 7th happened and he reversed his orders.

3.The propaganda from Claire Sterling and Arno DeBorgrave in the 1970s that the Soviet Union was behind terrorism turned out to all be lies. The Atlantic monthly is a hopelessly retarded rag run by Robert Kagan, a known foreign agent, and nothing it prints on foreign affairs is true. Vasili Mitrokin says differently.

The TRUTH is that after the Munich attack in 1972 President Nixon ordered the CIA to go to Libya and Uganda and help those governments arm and train all terrorist groups in exchange for their agreement that they would not target Americans. Vasili Mitrokin says differently.

This plan was carried out by two retired CIA officers, Fank Terpil and Ed Wilson. Wilson sent active duty US Marines and Green Berets to train in Lybian terrorist training camps as well as shipped to Kadaffi 20 tons of C-4 explosive. This is the explosive that turned up everywhere in almost every terrorist explosion thereafter, including the bombing of a 747 over Lockerbee, Scottland in 1986. This doesn't negate the Soviet Union's role in funding terrorists operations such as the PLO and the RAF.

.

[theaustinescorts]

Originally Posted by I B Hankering

.

The particular islands of Alaska, Kiska and whatever, were remote and valueless, and were only held as a ruse, not the prelude for any larger invasion.

The Mitrokin papers have been pretty much trashed.

No one in the know believes the story that Mitrokin copied by hand thousands of papers over the years and just kept them in the event that the Soviet Union collapsed and he would have something to do with them.

What Mitrokin claims to have done is in fact impossible.

The real Soviet records are available, almost entirely, and they do not reflect Mitrokin.

It is true that the Soviet Union provided protection to the PLO, but the PLO was not the malicious terrorist organization that Black September, the PFLP, and others were.

The PLO is the one Palestinian group that the US has supported for decades now, and it's the faction ruling the West Bank that both the US and Israel wish to see succeed.

It was the Americans who supported the really bad guys, including Idi Amin and Kadaffi, and there was a very real national security reason for doing so....

....the safety of Americans.

And until 1980 it actually worked.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

The particular islands of Alaska, Kiska and whatever, were remote and valueless, and were only held as a ruse, not the prelude for any larger invasion. Yeah, and for someone living in Anchorage, Austin is pretty remote a valueless: it's all a matter of perspective.

The Mitrokin papers have been pretty much trashed. Only at your "Conspiracy-R-Us" websites; otherwise, his work is still quite reputable, e.g.:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Vasili_Mitrokhin
http://www.amazon.com/The-Sword-And-...pe=cited#cited

"Yes, Virginia, there really was a KGB, nasty and brutish . . ." The Washington Post.

No one in the know believes the story that Mitrokin copied by hand thousands of papers over the years and just kept them in the event that the Soviet Union collapsed and he would have something to do with them.

What Mitrokin claims to have done is in fact impossible. Just like putting a man on the moon was impossible.

The real Soviet records are available, almost entirely, and they do not reflect Mitrokin.

It is true that the Soviet Union provided protection to the PLO, but the PLO was not the malicious terrorist organization that Black September, the PFLP, and others were.

The PLO is the one Palestinian group that the US has supported for decades now, and it's the faction ruling the West Bank that both the US and Israel wish to see succeed.

It was the Americans who supported the really bad guys, including Idi Amin and Kadaffi, and there was a very real national security reason for doing so....Yeah, Regan was always so totally supportive of Kadaffyduck.

....the safety of Americans.

And until 1980 it actually worked.

.

[theaustinescorts]

Reagan's attack on Kadaffi was in 1986. I said the program lasted until 1980.

As far as Mitrokin is concerned, have you actually read him?

Please just go read him and tell me if you think any of his drivil could be true. It's all disinformation.

Yes you can find a handful of people, like the ones who contribute to Wiki, who defend him but these are the same kind of morons who defended Anatoly Galitsin [a Russian disinformation agent] in the Cold War. He was just someone who told the ultra-hawks what they wanted to believe.

Really all you have to do is listen to Mitrokin's idiotic narrative about how he copied thousands of pages by hand and smuggled them for decades without ever getting caught, and with no prospect of anyone being able to see it....

It's ridiculous, just like Anatoly Galitsin was.

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

Reagan's attack on Kadaffi was in 1986. I said the program lasted until 1980.

As far as Mitrokin is concerned, have you actually read him? Yes!

Please just go read him and tell me if you think any of his drivil could be true. It's all disinformation. No, Chomsky is disinformation which explains your POV.

Yes you can find a handful of people, like the ones who contribute to Wiki, who defend him but these are the same kind of morons who defended Anatoly Galitsin [a Russian disinformation agent] in the Cold War. He was just someone who told the ultra-hawks what they wanted to believe. His works are treated as source documents by scores of scholars.

Really all you have to do is listen to Mitrokin's idiotic narrative about how he copied thousands of pages by hand and smuggled them for decades without ever getting caught, and with no prospect of anyone being able to see it.... Try as you might, you cannot "wish" his accomplishments away simply because his story complicates your belief system.

It's ridiculous, just like Anatoly Galitsin was.

.

[theaustinescorts]

Name one legitimate, peer-reviewed scholar who cites Mitrokin.

There are none. Just hacks and polemicists.

Nothing Mitrokin says counters my "belief system." I already know the USSR supported the PLO.

My point is that the PLO has been the US's baby for the last thirty years Dude.
The PLO is benign.

The groups the US supported in the 1970s were all the really nasty guys, like Black September, etc.

And it was a program that worked.

Until American law enforcement caught up with Wilson and Terpil no American citizen was targeted by any terrorist.

But as soon as the program was ended Americans started getting kidnapped and killed, first in Lebanon and then all over the place.

It was a ruthless, self-interested policy that the Israelis and others hated, but the Israelis are not us.

We are us.

btw people should see the way Speilberg treats the CIA officers in "Munich" as they beat the crap out of the Israeli hit squad that was sent to kill Black September's leader.

Hurry CIA!

[theaustinescorts]

Hey Dude here's the scene from "Munich" were the CIA works to protect the Arab terrorist leader of Black September from the bumbling Israeli morons trying to kill him.

The CIA wins against the Isrealis every time.

www.youtube.com/watch?v=GN7gSRcQwCU&feature=re lated

Yeah America!

[I B Hankering]

Originally Posted by theaustinescorts

Name one legitimate, peer-reviewed scholar who cites Mitrokin. How about two? Already provided the citation which includes these two and probably more:


Rodney Carlisle, Ph.D., is the chair of the Department of History at Rutgers University. His areas of specialization are 20th-century American political history and the history of military technology and intelligence. He is vice president and co-founder of History Associates Incorporated of Rockville, MD.

William Maley, Ph.D., is Professor and Director of the Asia-Pacific College of Diplomacy at The Australian National University, Australia.

There are none. Just hacks and polemicists.

Nothing Mitrokin says counters my "belief system." I already know the USSR supported the PLO.

But you earlier claimed these "wacky zealous groups" were small operations insinuating they were not managed and completely independent, and you also posted this earlier:

My point is that the PLO has been the US's baby for the last thirty years Dude.
The PLO is benign.

The groups the US supported in the 1970s were all the really nasty guys, like Black September, etc.

And it was a program that worked.

Until American law enforcement caught up with Wilson and Terpil no American citizen was targeted by any terrorist.

But as soon as the program was ended Americans started getting kidnapped and killed, first in Lebanon and then all over the place.

It was a ruthless, self-interested policy that the Israelis and others hated, but the Israelis are not us.

We are us.

btw people should see the way Speilberg treats the CIA officers in "Munich" as they beat the crap out of the Israeli hit squad that was sent to kill Black September's leader.

Hurry CIA!

.