WNY Viability/Purpose of ECCIE?

[MajorHands]

I thought about putting this into a new thread but much of the background dialogue is here, so I'll press on with the reviews discussion within this thread.

Clearly, there's a learning curve to becoming a fairly serious Hobbyist and a bit of a process involved in deciding how one chooses to conduct oneself as such. In my case, I've made a few stumbles along the way that have been instructive, and while I have always approached my participation in this arena with deep respect for the provider community, I have unwittingly managed to step on a toe or two.

As it turns out, I had a hand (among other body parts) in creating the situation that prompted China to break radio silence in such impressive fashion (her participation and deeper appreciation for the WNY corner of eccie are part of the several silver lining aspects in all this). She and I have since talked about some of the related issues,and it was definitely an eye-opener. She and I remain cool (we always were, despite the info to follow), and China is on-board with me sharing the salient points of our discussion.

The chronology of what happened and when these things were revealed can get a bit muddled, so I'll try to organize it in a somewhat sane fashion. Feel free to follow along:

I'm not sure what prompted me to do it; except perhaps to give her an idea of how much I enjoyed our session, but a week ago I contacted Chloe to see if anyone had ever shared their ROS/BCD review comments with her, or if it was unprecedented. Chloe indicated that it was pretty common for clients to share their comments about their experiences with her (but have NEVER shared comments made for or about other providers), in some cases to make sure there wasn't anything objectionable before they post them. Since I wasn't treading in new territory I sent Chloe the text of my ROS with her and she responded positively. (In light of the discussion on review details and crassness, I also followed up this weekend to check in and see if she had any issues with the level of details or content and she said "not at all")

Since that went pretty well, I provided China with my ROS/BCD text of OUR session, and also got a positive response, since many of the things I had to say were not all about the carnal specifics. If she hadn't decided to speak up in this thread, I would have been more than content with my review style, so kudos to China. After reading her comments, it occured to me that my reviews were probably ones that she would consider crass, and when I contacted her to ask her, she confirmed I was right.

Here's the thing; while sharing my ROS with her probably prompted her to speak up, the issue was already on her mind. Unfortunately, this was also because of me, to my chagrin.

In my first review of China, there was a follow-on discussion in the comments about the split-scissor position where I posted a pic of me and a swinger lady friend (before the new photo guidelines were posted)...which was followed by links posted by others to animated illustrations of similar positions....

Lo and behold, China suddenly had clients doing that position with her during her sessions (some of whom were repeat clients who'd never used it before)! Realizing that these guys were doing this specific thing she'd never done before because they read about her doing it with me sort of took her out the moment, and was a bit un-nerving.

As it turns out, China told me she actually likes the new position (it's her new second favorite)...which is one of those silver lining things I'd alluded to above. Still, the idea that someone reads and dissects the blow by blow (pardon the pun) of someone else's time with her and then adopts elements of it with her might well make any provider shudder.

It's already been established that individual sensibilities have a lot to do with how a provider might feel about the content of a review, and the absolute necessity to have an area of review not visible to the provider is not disputed. Still, there are clearly cases where elements of an ROS section might come to the attention of a provider. If I discover that PollyProvider (one hopes there is no such person) likes a popsicle up her ass and I disclose that in a review, I should probably not be surprised if that disclosure comes to rest at my feet when guys start showing up at her sessions with their frozen Edy's. Even if it turns out that Polly wanted more "frozen treats", I can see that she might not want that newsflash to come from me.

The challenge then for me is to find a happy medium between an informative and honest assessment/review and honoring the sensibilities of the provider, if I am inclined to do so (which I am not obligated to do, but wish to). Given that the public portion of the reviews frequently provide the laundry list of menu item acronyms (DFK, LFK, BBBJ, CIM, Asian, Greek, Russian, Polyponesian [I made that one up, I think], CFS, MPOPs, etc, etc)....and more than a few providers list these items specifically in their online profiles....it's sometimes a bit murky to figure out which of these acts spelled out in more detail in ROS is too much...

Up til this point, I've been modeling my reviews based upon what I perceived to be generally accepted community standards for the boards based on the submissions of others. Moving forward, I will attempt to size up the respective comfort levels of the providers I see. If I have some doubts whether the review would be objectionable (disclosure-wise, not recommendation-wise), then I may preview it with a provider. I suspect that most reviews won't rise to the level where they'd need screening, so if I see a provider and don't preview the review with you, it isn't necessarily a bad thing...lol!

When you get to the point where specific acts between two (usually) people is broken down into commodities and menu items, it's probably a good idea to remember that despite the transactional nature of all this, there are still substantial elements of human sensibilities to consider....

From where I sit...Hobbyists and Providers are really in this together....

[NormalBob]

Originally Posted by MajorHands

Clearly, there's a learning curve to becoming a fairly serious Hobbyist and a bit of a process involved in deciding how one chooses to conduct oneself as such. In my case, I've made a few stumbles along the way that have been instructive, and while I have always approached my participation in this arena with deep respect for the provider community, I have unwittingly managed to step on a toe or two.

Welcome to the club brother.

I'll add this about provider review preferences...

The preferences among providers are not monolithic. To make this obvious point, menus vary so why wouldn't attitudes towards review styles?

My first cut is whether the experience was good or not. If not, I use whatever language communicates why it was not good.

If the experience is good, I'm a big wimp about trying to be sensitive to the woman's preferences. I still make mistakes but it isn't because I didn't try. It's because I'm a dolt.

Contrary to common opinion, I don't write my reviews out of ego. That would be like saying we all hobby because of our ego.

I hobby and I write because I like to hobby and I like to write.

In an effort to make what I just said more real (or at least far more pretentious), the writer Henry Miller once said,

"It does me good to write a letter... which has accumulated in me like the waters of a reservoir."

An experience with a good provider unleashes a flood in me that builds until I open the gates and let it pour out.

Uhh, call me a pussy; but, don't confuse my writing as an ego thing please.

So back to the point of menus.

Ava Adore makes a great example. When I asked her about her preferences, she looked me dead in the eye and told me to write it as dirty and graphic as I possibly could. When I asked her if she was serious, she got the direct look of porn star in her eyes and spoke more slowly and sensuously. She wanted it. Dirty.

I got to work.

I'm guilty of participating in the drift of this thread. We went from "what do the guys need to do to make eccie more valuable to the providers?" to "what is everyone's personal preferences on how others should write a review?"

Maybe we can agree that the key in all cases with good providers is 'respect' and that they are the only ones capable of determining whether they've been shown the respect they deserve.

[GP]

Originally Posted by Docdave

Now this all being said, reviews are as much about the ego of the gentlemen writing them as much as they are about the lady.

Dave, I could not disagree more. Please do not state this as fact when it is only your opinion. I personally could care less about any ego trip. Others may write reviews for that reason, but not me. I write reviews for two reasons. First to help out my fellow brothers and second to help out the ladies with the business it will generate. PERIOD!

[GP]

Originally Posted by montana1958

Not to drift too much osd but who else is thinking a China Doll/Chloe duo????

TRUST ME.... the subject has been brought up

[Doove]

Originally Posted by Docdave

Now this all being said, reviews are as much about the ego of the gentlemen writing them as much as they are about the lady. This being said, take them with a grain of salt.

GP's thoughts on the matter notwithstanding, i say Amen! I think several of the ladies would be surprised at how many orgasms they have during the course of a typical session.

[cnym]

Originally Posted by Docdave

reviews are as much about the ego of the gentlemen writing them as much as they are about the lady.

I disagree with you totally, reviews have nothing to do with a mans ego. As long as reviews are accurate and state what actually happened then there is no ego issue. each person has a different style of writing and expressing themselves. The reviews about different Ladies can be written in different styles and will include different details. Some ladies are comfortable with me telling all. Just because some do not like us telling what happened, then they need to request "No Reviews" I would be ok with that.

[GP]

Originally Posted by Doove

I think several of the ladies would be surprised at how many orgasms they have during the course of a typical session.

LOL, now that was funny!

[guest111111]

Originally Posted by cnym

. Just because some do not like us telling what happened, then they need to request "No Reviews" I would be ok with that.

Gentlemen,
this is alomost hitting my point on the head. I dont belive that we have an inherent right to do a review, in any style we choose, without letting the lady know that we will be doing so. I dont belive that it is the ladies responsibility to tell the client after each session what kind of review to do. Instead, if i may suggest this, it is our responsibility to ask the lady if she is ok with us posting a review of our session if that is you intention. Again, it goes to the respect issue IMHO.
My comments about ones ego may have been taken too harshly. In no way was i trying to demean anyones reviews as being soley ego-centric. My opinion, again MY OPINION, is that when reviewing, there are too many intangibles that come into play between two people, chemistry being one of them. When posting a review that is read by our members, what can happen is that other clients go into a future appt with this lady and expect to get the treatment that you reviewed, and this is where the YMMV takes place. I feel that when we have that and get "that connection" with someone special, that its between me and her. My point of bringing ego into it was simply meant as this... who doesn't like to to brag about the gorgeous girl they just had a great time with, thats and ego boost, but sometimes, some, not all, but some of the more intimate details, may not necessarily be for public consumption.
I apologize if this was taken wrong as it appears it may have been...

[cnym]

Originally Posted by Docdave

Instead, if i may suggest this, it is our responsibility to ask the lady if she is ok with us posting a review of our session if that is you intention. Again, it goes to the respect issue IMHO.

DD, I believe that we all agree with you.
I have always asked politely if I may write a review about our meeting with the ladies. I have also always asked if there is anything that should not be mentioned and what can be mentioned. Some ladies like the reviews to "not tell you much", I respect that and the review style is in accordance with her wishes. Other ladies like the detailed and steamy reviews and do not have an issue with me writing what happened. Some simply have a no review request, and I honor that. In addition, not every date ends up with a review. There are many moments that are special between us and can not and will not be shared. The bottom line , as you have stated previously, is RESPECT. I view the ladies as my friends and lovers and not as a one time "bang, thank you mam" date. There might be some guys out there that do not respect the ladies, that is there problem. Mutual respect is very critical in my hobby life. The "premium" ladies that I see become an important part of my intimate life and deserve a lot of respect. That does not mean that every SP deserves my respect, they loose it very quickly, well some .......... "ahem" ............ depends on their attitude or lack thereof.

[jackfengshui]

Each of us may have different motivations for writing reviews. As I mentioned before, these are mine:

http://www.eccie.net/showthread.php?t=23558

[offshoredrilling]

Originally Posted by Docdave

Gentlemen,
this is alomost hitting my point on the head. I dont belive that we have an inherent right to do a review, in any style we choose, without letting the lady know that we will be doing so. I dont belive that it is the ladies responsibility to tell the client after each session what kind of review to do. Instead, if i may suggest this, it is our responsibility to ask the lady if she is ok with us posting a review of our session if that is you intention. Again, it goes to the respect issue IMHO.

Originally Posted by cnym

DD, I believe that we all agree with you.
I have always asked politely if I may write a review about our meeting with the ladies. I have also always asked if there is anything that should not be mentioned and what can be mentioned.

nope do not agree. This board and others are review boards. You found her on a reveiw board, you can review. You can ask but the answer is all ready there "its a review board" MHO

[jackfengshui]

Originally Posted by offshoredrilling

nope do not agree. This board and others are review boards. You found her on a reveiw board, you can review. You can ask but the answer is all ready there "its a review board" MHO

Here is my personal opinion. In the name of free speech, a hobbyist has the "right" to review a provider who has agreed to see him. The question is whether and how to exercise that right.

If the experience is negative, I think it will be a public service to inform the community.

Even when the experience is positive, if the provider has reservations about any review or about a review that is too graphic, then the hobbyist has to decide whether or not to honor the provider's wishes (which may affect their future relationship).

[offshoredrilling]

Thanks jack. You always say things better, if we agree or not. On this we agree.