Lets Talk Welfare; Corporate Big Oil Welfare

[Rodram]

While rakhir talks about scary brown people:

http://www.eccie.net/showthread.php?t=284322

I'll tell you about the industry he advocates for, BIG OIL:

http://www.nytimes.com/2010/07/04/business/04bptax.html

http://switchboard.nrdc.org/blogs/bm...aged_by_e.html

http://thinkprogress.org/green/2011/...oil-subsidies/

http://thinkprogress.org/green/2011/...-oil-astrotur/

[Gladman]

So how many of your daily activities do not require "Big Oil"?
LOL thought so.

[Rodram]

Good question Gladman but before you celebrate with a Lol, shouldn't you wait until I respond?
I know, I know, your the guy that doesn't have to substantiate any claims he makes and gets to make pseudo-intellectual declarations and run away when queried but IOKIYAR.

So lets put this into perspective, with you know, a little factual info and percentages:

Home > Energy in Brief > How dependent are we on foreign oil?

Last Updated: June 24, 2011< All Energy in Brief Articles
How dependent are we on foreign oil?
The United States imported about 49% of the petroleum,1 which includes crude oil and refined petroleum products, that we consumed during 2010. About half of these imports came from the Western Hemisphere. Our dependence on foreign petroleum has declined since peaking in 2005.
Although we are the third largest crude oil producer, about half of the petroleum we use is imported.

Western Hemisphere nations provide about half of our imported petroleum.

Imports are an important source of U.S. supply

Did You Know?
Canada is the United States' leading crude oil supplier.
The United States consumed 19.1 million barrels per day (MMbd) of petroleum products during 2010, making us the world's largest petroleum consumer. The United States was third in crude oil production at 5.5 MMbd. But crude oil alone does not constitute all U.S. petroleum supplies. Significant gains occur, because crude oil expands in the refining process, liquid fuel is captured in the processing of natural gas, and we have other sources of liquid fuel, including biofuels. These additional supplies totaled 4.2 MMbd in 2010.
In 2010 the United States imported 11.8 million barrels per day (MMbd) of crude oil and refined petroleum products. We also exported 2.3 MMbd of crude oil and petroleum products during 2010, so our net imports (imports minus exports) equaled 9.4 MMbd.
Petroleum products imported by the United States during 2010 included gasoline, diesel fuel, heating oil, jet fuel, chemical feedstocks, asphalt, and other products. Still, most petroleum products consumed in the United States were refined here. Net imports of petroleum other than crude oil were 2% of the petroleum consumed in the United States during 2010.
About Half of U.S. Petroleum Imports Come from the Western Hemisphere
Some may be surprised to learn that 49% of U.S. crude oil and petroleum products imports came from the Western Hemisphere (North, South, and Central America, and the Caribbean including U.S. territories) during 2010. About 18% of our imports of crude oil and petroleum products come from the Persian Gulf countries of Bahrain, Iraq, Kuwait, Qatar, Saudi Arabia, and United Arab Emirates. Our largest sources of net crude oil and petroleum product imports were Canada and Saudi Arabia.
Sources of Net Crude Oil and Petroleum Product Imports:
Canada (25%)
Saudi Arabia (12%)
Nigeria (11%)
Venezuela (10%)
Mexico (9%)
It is usually impossible to tell whether the petroleum products you use came from domestic or imported sources of oil once they are refined.
Reliance on Petroleum Imports has Declined
U.S. dependence on imported oil has dramatically declined since peaking in 2005. This trend is the result of a variety of factors including a decline in consumption and shifts in supply patterns.2 The economic downturn after the financial crisis of 2008, improvements in efficiency, changes in consumer behavior and patterns of economic growth, all contributed to the decline in petroleum consumption. At the same time, increased use of domestic biofuels (ethanol and biodiesel), and strong gains in domestic production of crude oil and natural gas plant liquids expanded domestic supplies and reduced the need for imports.
Learn More
Oil Projections to 2035
Energy Explained: Oil Imports and Exports
Top 15 Oil Suppliers
This Week in Petroleum: Oil Import Dependence
Email this page
Share this page
See the EIA Glossary for comprehensive definitions of "petroleum," "oil," "petroleum products," and "crude oil."
U.S. Energy Information Administration, This Week in Petroleum (May 25, 2011).


Here's the link:
http://www.eia.gov/energy_in_brief/f...dependence.cfm

So what's the take? In essence, you're right; we use lots of oil and we import lots of oil, but that's not what my post was about, however, it was a fairly effective redirection on your part.

Why should we subsidize BIG OIL when it's raping the country with world record profit and most curiously, is able to do it when the entire world economy is reeling in a major downturn. Hmm....

CORPORATE WELFARE

So, as to your attempt at misdirection, I will ask you this Gladman:

What is your view on BIG OIL'S WELFARE and lack of oversight? What do you propose?

[Gladman]

RR, why should I attempt an answer that you'd like to your posed question when you didn't answer mine? My "LOL" refers to the fact that just about all of our daily activities rely--RELY--on "Big Oil," and that most people who decry that industry haven't a clue about life without petroleum and petrochemicals. In other words, although my question was ostensibly rhetorical, by "answering" it with more fluff, you've proved my point--thanks!

[Rodram]

Glad, I did answer your question.
I can't tell you what exactly doesn't require some type of petroleum product in my daily living with any kind of accuracy (That whole accuracy thing is important don't you agree?) but I do know that it is a high percentage.

Instead, I gave you what the percentages are for consumption on a nationwide scale and I even included how much we import and export and from who and where.

I even included the year of projection (2035) for these figures and where you could receive the same info I get here:

"U.S. dependence on imported oil has dramatically declined since peaking in 2005. This trend is the result of a variety of factors including a decline in consumption and shifts in supply patterns.2 The economic downturn after the financial crisis of 2008, improvements in efficiency, changes in consumer behavior and patterns of economic growth, all contributed to the decline in petroleum consumption. At the same time, increased use of domestic biofuels (ethanol and biodiesel), and strong gains in domestic production of crude oil and natural gas plant liquids expanded domestic supplies and reduced the need for imports.
Learn More
Oil Projections to 2035
Energy Explained: Oil Imports and Exports
Top 15 Oil Suppliers
This Week in Petroleum: Oil Import Dependence
Email this page
Share this page
See the EIA Glossary for comprehensive definitions of "petroleum," "oil," "petroleum products," and "crude oil."
U.S. Energy Information Administration, This Week in Petroleum (May 25, 2011).

Why not just admit that you can't defend the indefensible and get on the right side of this issue?

[Laz]

Some of the examples of oil company corporate welfare, that I have seen, are standard business deductions. Please list specific examples and I will happily comment on them. However, in general I am against all corprate welfare whether it is for oil companies or green energy boondoggles.

[xfin]

Rodram, I don't understand what your point is with all this? You have lots of links to this, that, and the other thing but what is your point?
Is it that we import too much foreign oil?
Is it that we give too much in tax subsidies to oil companies?

I agree that there are too many loopholes in the tax code which were put there by oil companies to benefit oil companies. But if we get rid of all 'Corporate Welfare' (leftie buz word to make us feel guilty) for Big Oil, what happens to:
1. The price of energy? (does it go up or down?)
2. Our dependence on foreign oil? (do we end up importing more or less?)

Again, what is your point with all this? If you want to help the little guy, then lets lower the price of oil, gas, and energy as much as possible since the poor spend a much higher percentage of their income on energy than the wealthy. Maybe then we would have fewer people in poverty and dependant on food stamps and other welfare programs.

These are simple questions for you to answer, I don’t need to know that you’re smarter than me (I’ll grant you that point) or links to more leftie propaganda sites.

[Rodram]

"Rodram, I don't understand what your point is with all this? You have lots of links to this, that, and the other thing but what is your point?
Is it that we import too much foreign oil?
Is it that we give too much in tax subsidies to oil companies?"

-xfin, your confusion is because the first links I posted pertained to the egregiousness of Big Oil, its irresponsibility to this country/ environment and the corporate welfare it receives in the form of government subsidies.

My second posting was in response to Gladman and that pertained to consumption.

"I agree that there are too many loopholes in the tax code which were put there by oil companies to benefit oil companies. But if we get rid of all 'Corporate Welfare' (leftie buz word to make us feel guilty) for Big Oil, what happens..."

-Good, we both agree on tax loopholes.

Allow me to clarify what I mean by "Big Oil" and the "corporate welfare" it receives.

These are the companies that I call "Big Oil":Exxon-Mobile, Shell, Chevron, B.P., Total S.A. and Conoco-Phillips.
Total profit for these 6? $78.3 billion in profits during the first half of 2011, and by comparison, in all of 2010 they profited $76.8 billion.
Doesn't this record setting profit margin strike you as peculiar considering the downturn of the global economy?

http://usgovinfo.about.com/b/2011/08...ies-remain.htm

Now let me separate the Big Oil subsidies from those that are for independent or start-up oil and gas companies. Oil and gas companies that are start up or are small and independent will continue to receive subsidies as well they should. I support that as well as most democrats and President Obama.

Now "what happens to:
1. The price of energy? (does it go up or down?)
2. Our dependence on foreign oil? (do we end up importing more or less?)"

This is a complex issue but to put it simply; no, oil and gas prices are not affected by these subsidies are lack there of; rather, gas and oil prices are set by the world market.
Our dependence on foreign oil would not be affected either and if you wish to have a more in-depth conversation about this we can.

"If you want to help the little guy, then lets lower the price of oil, gas, and energy as much as possible since the poor spend a much higher percentage of their income on energy than the wealthy"

This is a non-issue, the government cannot control the price of gas in that manner.

Any more questions or comments just holler!

[Gladman]

Fall sitcoms starting new soon, RR, better get in gear with your humor, I mean "facts" before the pros get my laughs.

[Rodram]

Originally Posted by Gladman

Fall sitcoms starting new soon, RR, better get in gear with your humor, I mean "facts" before the pros get my laughs.

Sure, I like entertaining you Gladman, and believe it or not, this serves a purpose for me also! So allow me to think THANK YOU for participating!!!