Are providers influenced to change or not change rates because of perceived pressure from hobbyists?

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by Carl

I'd put you and Maddie the Co-Ed in the same general body-type. She also at times mentions that she's a bigger girl and not a spinner, and I can understand putting the "no spinner" disclaimer since a spinner is especially petite.

Maddie needs to update her pics and showcase.... She's slimmed down a bit..... Comparing her to DecemberLove would not currently be accurate....

[Abc123ddd]

Just to play devil's advocate, this isn't directed at anyone, just a general argument.

The more hostile or less open this board is, the worse it is for everyone. Lets face a concrete fact, eccie is not the only avenue for a provider to advertise and gain business. I'm not talking bp or anything like that either. There are other very popular boards that serve as an alternative to this place.

Rightly or wrongly, the more shit a provider has to deal with here, the less likely she'll stick around. Common sense says if she can earn the same income with less drama, guess what she'll do? That's bad for everyone. For providers who stay, they have to tip toe around to avoid being put in the cross-hairs. Not the most inviting work environment.

For the 'hobbiest'- think supply and demand. The more providers who run off, the less supply, though we have a constant and even growing demand. So while it may be nice thinking you have a place where everyone is on your wavelength, you're giving providers reason to raise their rates. I don't care what industry. Less competition+ less supply+ constant demand= higher prices, period. Wonder why we're seeing so many 250+ rates with the local economy still shedding jobs?

Don't get me wrong, I'm no WK. To be completely honest some providers here (in general, not specifically any active in this thread or forum) ask for some down right laughable rates. And some providers have such horrid tcb its not even worth pursuing what may be a fair rate. Personally, I WORK for my money. I make more than enough to keep me happy, but I work hard for it. So even the thought a provider would ask for more of that money than she's really worth, or even the hint she wouldn't deliver 100% on that time and investment gets under my skin sometimes, just like everyone else. If someone isn't working as hard at earning it from me as I did to earn it, why should they get it?

But the difference is, I vote with my wallet. I don't need to say a word on any forum, I just don't give them my money. If a provider still has enough income at a specific rate, more power to her, regardless of what I think. If her rates really are too high, then she can a) quit or b) lower them. Let the market take care of it.

To tie that back into the original topic, you don't need a 'lynch mob' or any wanna be group of pseudo internet pimps to keep rates in line, the forum in line, or any provider in line. That approach has proven to run off providers and I'd be willing to bet has prevented new ones from entering the market. All that is needed is a little common sense and common decency for every one around here to get a fair shake at this game.

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by Abc123ddd

The more hostile or less open this board is, the worse it is for everyone. Lets face a concrete fact, eccie is not the only avenue for a provider to advertise and gain business. I'm not talking bp or anything like that either. There are other very popular boards that serve as an alternative to this place.

Rightly or wrongly, the more shit a provider has to deal with here, the less likely she'll stick around. Common sense says if she can earn the same income with less drama, guess what she'll do? That's bad for everyone. For providers who stay, they have to tip toe around to avoid being put in the cross-hairs. Not the most inviting work environment.

Some providers may have quit posting their flirt threads and threADs but they keep running their ads. They are still around....

If a Provider is going to advertise in Texas, to those that review quality matters, then there is no medium with more potential customers for her then ECCIE.

This forum has developed into far more of a "community" and grown in numbers although some of the "old" faces have fallen by the wayside over the last year than it was at anytime in the last 4-5 years....

Originally Posted by Abc123ddd

Wonder why we're seeing so many 250+ rates with the local economy still shedding jobs?

It is a knee jerk reaction by ladies not properly understanding the market and trying to raise rates to replace lost revenue. I imagine they will have additional problems as they realize more and more men are shopping and voting with their wallet...

All those ladies are doing is driving the guys to new sources... Of the first 22 reviews in the Indy section only 3 are at or above the $250 mark

$180
$200
$100
$280
$200
$80
$100
$160
$80
$200
$160
$250
$260
$100
$200
$200
$125
$125
$220
$50
$150
$100

One thing the economy IS doing is driving more and more ladies into the oldest profession in the world....

There will always be a few that will spend more for the perception of quality. However if the quality is not there, in the long run, those ladies will fail.....

A lot of guys though are proving themselves willing to compromise a little, take a few more chances and look at less expensive alternatives....

[Rand Al'Thor]

Originally Posted by Abc123ddd

Just to play devil's advocate, this isn't directed at anyone, just a general argument.

The more hostile or less open this board is, the worse it is for everyone. Lets face a concrete fact, eccie is not the only avenue for a provider to advertise and gain business. I'm not talking bp or anything like that either. There are other very popular boards that serve as an alternative to this place.

There are other boards, but they tend to be regional. If you travel, it would be PERB, TERB, TER, or any number of other boards that are popular for those areas. If you're in Texas, ECCIE is king. There are, of course, other avenues of advertising, but you might be surprised how much opinions expressed on ECCIE might affect potential clients that find providers in other places.

Also, I'm not sure I understand "the more hostile or less open this board is", are you seeing a correlation to hostility and open exchange of information here?

Rightly or wrongly, the more shit a provider has to deal with here, the less likely she'll stick around. Common sense says if she can earn the same income with less drama, guess what she'll do? That's bad for everyone. For providers who stay, they have to tip toe around to avoid being put in the cross-hairs. Not the most inviting work environment.

Providers can stay (and post or not post), retire from hobby completely, or they can not be here and still provide. When they either stop posting here or close/disable their account, it does not mean they go away.

For the 'hobbiest'- think supply and demand. The more providers who run off, the less supply, though we have a constant and even growing demand. So while it may be nice thinking you have a place where everyone is on your wavelength, you're giving providers reason to raise their rates. I don't care what industry. Less competition+ less supply+ constant demand= higher prices, period. Wonder why we're seeing so many 250+ rates with the local economy still shedding jobs?

If you make ECCIE a closed economic system, sure. However, that simply is not true. If providers retire, that does subtract from supply, if they simply go away, they are still in the equation. You can't make the argument in the first part of your post that providers have plenty of places to advertise outside of ECCIE, then come back and say that visible number of providers on ECCIE is the determinant of supply side. If they are advertising on other boards and sites, they are still part of the supply side of the equation.

Don't get me wrong, I'm no WK. To be completely honest some providers here (in general, not specifically any active in this thread or forum) ask for some down right laughable rates. And some providers have such horrid tcb its not even worth pursuing what may be a fair rate. Personally, I WORK for my money. I make more than enough to keep me happy, but I work hard for it. So even the thought a provider would ask for more of that money than she's really worth, or even the hint she wouldn't deliver 100% on that time and investment gets under my skin sometimes, just like everyone else. If someone isn't working as hard at earning it from me as I did to earn it, why should they get it?

But the difference is, I vote with my wallet. I don't need to say a word on any forum, I just don't give them my money. If a provider still has enough income at a specific rate, more power to her, regardless of what I think. If her rates really are too high, then she can a) quit or b) lower them. Let the market take care of it.

To tie that back into the original topic, you don't need a 'lynch mob' or any wanna be group of pseudo internet pimps to keep rates in line, the forum in line, or any provider in line. That approach has proven to run off providers and I'd be willing to bet has prevented new ones from entering the market. All that is needed is a little common sense and common decency for every one around here to get a fair shake at this game.

There simply isn’t a “lynch mob” or “attack pack” or any other groups that I’m aware of. I have met many who might be considered one of these groups, and there is not the motivation, energy, or the organization for something like this to exist. Truly, they are busy getting or trying to get laid. There has been a change of information exchange. It is becoming more accepted to broadcast information that some providers feel is insulting or an attack, and many men here feel that any post that isn’t some suck-up, flirting, worship to anyone with a vagina isn’t worth posting. If you think that an atmosphere that is conducive to speaking out on both positive and negative opinions will run providers off, spend a little time reading the Houston boards.

[sixxbach]

Originally Posted by Abc123ddd

Lets face a concrete fact, eccie is not the only avenue for a provider to advertise and gain business. I'm not talking bp or anything like that either. There are other very popular boards that serve as an alternative to this place.

Like others have stated in Texas at least, ECCIE is king. Have you taken a look at ERAPS and a few other sites lately? I have yet to see one of the more vocal providers who complain about this board, guest their handle. Why is that? I think we all know why...

Rightly or wrongly, the more shit a provider has to deal with here, the less likely she'll stick around. Common sense says if she can earn the same income with less drama, guess what she'll do? That's bad for everyone. For providers who stay, they have to tip toe around to avoid being put in the cross-hairs. Not the most inviting work environment.

There are plenty of providers who know how to work this board. Ever heard of babydollsnow, London Rayne, Naomi4u, Natalie Reign, Hannah Heresy, etc? There are a few others out there too that I didn't mention.


To tie that back into the original topic, you don't need a 'lynch mob' or any wanna be group of pseudo internet pimps to keep rates in line, the forum in line, or any provider in line. That approach has proven to run off providers and I'd be willing to bet has prevented new ones from entering the market. All that is needed is a little common sense and common decency for every one around here to get a fair shake at this game.

Lynch mobs? Damn, I still want to know if that provider meant these guys....



sixx

[Sensual Sophia]

Sixx, why don't you stop being so mysterious? I think everyone knows "that provider" is me.

I originally started that thread to

1) notify people of my rate change

2) explain why I had changed them

3) encourage those who wanted to scoff or talk shit to do so to my face rather than hiding in the locker room

I honestly was unaware you weren't allowed to discuss rates in even veiled form in co-ed. So I moved my post to the ad section as Whispers suggested. Thankfully Sixx decided to start a thread about me so we can talk about this subject after all.

Ladies, if you, like me, were afraid to change your rates due to the fear of badmouthing from the gents, don't be. Really, what is the worst they can do? The fact is that most of the loudest posters have probably never seen you and probably never will.

It feels WONDERFUL to finally be in control of my time and rate. If I want more biz I can run a special. I control the spigot. I can't tell you how freeing this is!

[missi hart]

Originally Posted by Sensual Sophia

Sixx, why don't you stop being so mysterious? I think everyone knows "that provider" is me.

I originally started that thread to

1) notify people of my rate change

2) explain why I had changed them

3) encourage those who wanted to scoff or talk shit to do so to my face rather than hiding in the locker room

I honestly was unaware you weren't allowed to discuss rates in even veiled form in co-ed. So I moved my post to the ad section as Whispers suggested. Thankfully Sixx decided to start a thread about me so we can talk about this subject after all.

Ladies, if you, like me, were afraid to change your rates due to the fear of badmouthing from the gents, don't be. Really, what is the worst they can do? The fact is that most of the loudest posters have probably never seen you and probably never will.

It feels WONDERFUL to finally be in control of my time and rate. If I want more biz I can run a special. I control the spigot. I can't tell you how freeing this is!

sophia, i applaud your efforts and i'm truly glad that it has had a freeing effect on you. my main surprise is that you hadn't felt that way previously---i mean that as a compliment to your moxie. better late than never, though!

[Yssup Rider]

You GO girl!

[Carl]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

You GO girl!

If you want her to actually GO on you, I think that qualifies as a fetish and usually costs extra.

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by Carl

If you want her to actually GO on you, I think that qualifies as a fetish and usually costs extra.

I thought his asking ANYTHING of Missi ALLREADY counted as a fetish?

So that's TWO fetishes.... Does one cancel the other and make it normal or do they both combine to be something else?

[Yssup Rider]

Originally Posted by Whispers

I thought his asking ANYTHING of Missi ALLREADY counted as a fetish?

So that's TWO fetishes.... Does one cancel the other and make it normal or do they both combine to be something else?

Actually HE was referring to Sophia's post. So HE guesses from now on HE'LL need to quote everything so the spinmeisters out there (and the spun) will know to whom HE refers. (Interesting how suddenly Whispers 2.0 is back and baiting the water again)

HE really have no fetishes. But HIS fingers are quicker than HIS tongue for the most part.



sigh ... another day, another chingaso... God grant them the serenity...

[78704]

Originally Posted by Sensual Sophia

I control the spigot.

I can't stop giggling at this. Sophia, you're wonderful.

[MOCHAakaMOCHA]

Originally Posted by sixxbach

I was looking at an ad and noticed that a provider was hesitant to increase her rates because of "the lynch mob in the locker room".

Is this particular provider the only one who has felt this? I know providers change rates all the time with little or no fanfare.

Providers, have you ever been influenced to raise or not raise your rates because of perceived pressure from hobbyists?

sixx

I raised mine after actually being convinced by regulars to do so. I sort of think thought providers are influenced to raise or lower by other providers. I've seen many drop rates to 50 60 bucks to undercut others.

[Ms Francisca]

Originally Posted by Sensual Sophia

Ladies, if you, like me, were afraid to change your rates due to the fear of badmouthing from the gents, don't be. Really, what is the worst they can do? The fact is that most of the loudest posters have probably never seen you and probably never will.

These words need to be in the provider bible, 1st commandment, golden rule book, sacred hooker tips.....
Ladies, this is the best advice you can ever get from a fellow provider.

Whispers is a perfect example of a loud poster that does not spend $ on "advertising providers" . Obviously, what he does spend, is the majority of his day on eccie complaining about providers, threADDS, rates, etc and at the same time admitting he will not spend $ on providers regardless.

I do not know how to do the quote thing & do not feel like figuring it out at this moment.
Whispers said:

"It is a knee jerk reaction by ladies not properly understanding the market and trying to raise rates to replace lost revenue. I imagine they will have additional problems as they realize more and more men are shopping and voting with their wallet..."

Whispers, you must have a large booty because you seem to pull a lot of information from it. Providers raise rates when they have more business than time. Providers run specials to make up lost revenue. I imagine loud posters are going to have problems when they realize they will have to use their wallet if they want their vote to be heard.
If ladies include hobbyist like whispers into their market, then I agree, they do not properly understand the market. Loud posters is not where the money is.
In Austin about 65% of hobbyist are guests looking at the adds/reviews. Meaning 65% of a Ladies income comes from guests not members.
A guest cannot see the BCD comments of the review. All the good, bad, big penis, exaggerated details are BCD... A guest looks at Pics, BBBJ, GFE, recommendation & Rates. They do not have the I am a "frequent poster" "well known" "my review will make you or break you" attitude. They actually expect to pay a little more than the "member hobbyist" and appreciate any sort of "special" offered by a lady. Again, these are 65% of the hobbyist in Austin.
Only 35% of a ladies income comes from eccie members
Out of those, 90% are the lurkers, 9% are gentlemen/white knight posters and1% are loud posters (rude, disrespectful, argumentative towards providers).

Ladies, in the past 10 years I have seen many "whispers", men with mommy issues (which BTW are extremely more traumatizing for men than daddy issues are for females) come and go. Do not let these men make the hobby a bad experience because their opinions honestly do not matter and will not affect your business.
Today eccie might be the King hobby board in Texas and a few years ago it was aspd and we do not know who will wear the crown 5 years from now. Do not depend on the board. Depend on the hobbyist. Take care of them & they will take care of you. I promise.

[sixxbach]

Originally Posted by Ms Francisca

In Austin about 65% of hobbyist are guests looking at the adds/reviews. Meaning 65% of a Ladies income comes from guests not members.
A guest cannot see the BCD comments of the review. All the good, bad, big penis, exaggerated details are BCD... A guest looks at Pics, BBBJ, GFE, recommendation & Rates. They do not have the I am a "frequent poster" "well known" "my review will make you or break you" attitude. They actually expect to pay a little more than the "member hobbyist" and appreciate any sort of "special" offered by a lady. Again, these are 65% of the hobbyist in Austin.
Only 35% of a ladies income comes from eccie members
Out of those, 90% are the lurkers, 9% are gentlemen/white knight posters and1% are loud posters (rude, disrespectful, argumentative towards providers).


Where are you getting your numbers from? I will say that when I first discovered ASPD back in 2005, I had no clue about BCD tags, etc. I basically had about 30 minutes a day to look at the site so all I could see were the comments after the reviews and the almighty yes or no recommendation. I would base my hobbying at that time on the comments posted and the yes or no. I also looked at how many reviews the reviewer had under their handle.

35% is a pretty significant number IMO. Take away 35% of my pay and I will have to look for another job. I would be considered a loud poster etc but I get PM's every week asking my recommendations on gals. Hell, I even had a provider ask me what pics should she use on her showcase because she knew I would give her an honest opinion. Hobbyists like Whispers, etc have credibility regardless if you agree with their opinions or not because they are not afraid to speak out.

sixx