None of us in the world might even see January 20th, 2025

[Yssup Rider]

More often than not, I bet.

Ssssnick

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by texassapper

Yeah her's the thing... NATO was formed as a DEFENSIVE alliance against the Soviet led Warsaw Pact forces. Neither of which have existed for over 30 years. Its a wee bit difficult explaining how any member state was attacked by Russia to justify expansion of the conflict to include ALL of NATO.

I hope you understand where this is headed.

There will be a nuke exchange if we're not careful. Is there a fucking thing in Europe worth nuking the planet for? I mean I love it and all, but they haven't exactly done us any favors in the last 100 years or so... What exactly is our strategic interest there when we've got a storm brewing in the Western Pacific?

Yes, nothing like killing 20-30 thousand more Ukrainains to put a shine on our democracy!!

Sometimes I'm simply too astonished...

exactly.

[TravelingHere]

Originally Posted by txdot-guy

You just don’t get it. Europe realizes that allowing Putin to take over Ukraine will do nothing but give him the incentive to do it again elsewhere. The EU and NATO will go to war before that happens.

It’s to our benefit to support Ukraine as long as possible.

All the more reason for diplomacy.
Trying to incorporate Ukraine into NATO was provocative, as others have mentioned. It's like China or Russia establishing a military presence in Mexico or Canada.
When the Warsaw pact dissolved it was established that NATO would not expand "1 inch to the East". And yet it did, and Russia was patient. Now it's come to this.
It's strange that leftists are pushing confrontation when peace is possible.
If the US gets into a war with Russia, life is finished. 6000 nukes on each side.
Ukraine is their sphere of influence. And they will have it.

[Jacuzzme]

Originally Posted by txdot-guy

You just don’t get it. Europe realizes that allowing Putin to take over Ukraine will do nothing but give him the incentive to do it again elsewhere. The EU and NATO will go to war before that happens.

It’s to our benefit to support Ukraine as long as possible.

Straight up horseshit. Russia did nothing as nato welched on its deal and took in members directly to their west. Estonia and Latvia have relatively small borders but Ukraine is what, 500 miles worth of nearly impossible to defend border? We almost went to war when Russian parked missiles in Cuba, imagine them being in Juarez or Niagara. I’d 100% support the military going in and wiping out or annexing the area. This is exactly how Russians see it.

[Jacky S]

There is always the possibility that if Putin did authorize the use of any type of nuclear weapon, there would be a “9 mm election”.

[texassapper]

Putin did not invade my country and he didn’t invade an ally to my country and he didn’t invade a NATO country. So if Americans end up fighting Russians, it can hardly be blamed on Putin.

maybe the warmongers on here can explain why we should risk nuclear war for Ukraine and how it benefits the United States?

[Yssup Rider]

Amazing how many folks here have such deep insights into how Russia sees the world.

Please inform the Russian people because they don’t know shitsky.

[Jacuzzme]

I lived with a Russian couple for nearly 6 months in Sevastopol, with 2 other guys renting their basement apartment. She was a housewife and he was a retired Soviet submariner now working in a shipyard. Nicest people you’d ever run across and Russian through and through, as was the entire city. I’d say over 80% of the city considered themselves Russian. I couldn’t say how they feel about the current conflict, although I’d guess they support Russia, but the media propaganda in the US about the Russian “annexation” of the area is nothing even close to what the people living their experienced.

[Yssup Rider]

Crimea River?

I spent time nearby just after the fall of the wall.

The entire population is on a need to know basis.

[Jacuzzme]

All they needed to know was that the Obama administration installed a hostile, Naziesque puppet regime in Kyiv.

[Yssup Rider]

You obviously were watching the state news as well.

Obama wasn't president at the time, it was Clinton. But I'm sure you'll find them to have been hostile and Naziesque anyway.

LOLLING.

[TravelingHere]

Originally Posted by Yssup Rider

You obviously were watching the state news as well.

Obama wasn't president at the time, it was Clinton. But I'm sure you'll find them to have been hostile and Naziesque anyway.

LOLLING.

He's talking about the overthrow of Yanukovich