Detecting Coercion?

[irishlad]

Wanted to seek advice from the experienced mongers and providers on this topic.

By my way of thinking, a women has a fundamental right to profit from her willingness to share her body in whatever manner she and only she sees fit.

However if the women in question is being coerced by another person trying to profit, that's unacceptable.

So are there tells? I know there is no way to be sure. Do certain things tip you off as to the nature of the situation that a rookie might miss?

There are lots of L1 AMPS in town. Is there any basis for believing these places are free women enterprising or something more sinister? What about with independents?

[bottoms up]

So does it matter to you whether the coercion comes from life (i.e. need for money to live) or a pimp?
Seems to me they wouldn't really be wanting to do it either way.
It is what it is!

[Observing]

Originally Posted by bottoms up

So does it matter to you whether the coercion comes from life (i.e. need for money to live) or a pimp?
Seems to me they wouldn't really be wanting to do it either way.
It is what it is!

[The Infamous One]

http://www.texasmonthly.com/articles/the-lost-girls/

[The Infamous One]

Coercion from life is much different than being forced/trafficked. Even when a girl needs the money, she still has the power to choose to work 2 or 3 jobs or make different life decisions. Trafficked girls don't.

I really don't understand how any human being can knowingly partake in that shit. How can a man need to get off so bad that he doesn't give a fuck that a woman is trafficked? I'll never understand it.

[Irish Bob Parr]

Although new to ECCIE I'm not not new to life or it's experiences. In my previous job I traveled, routinely, across 5 continents and yes I believe there are "tells" to a traffic person. Generally they are younger, less educated, always chaperoned, coached in all activities, controlled, and yes I believe most AMP use these type of providers. Some start out younger but over the years because of their lifestyle they elect to remain during their older years and move up to supervisory positions.

I'm not here to judge, I strongly support a persons freedom to choose their life's path and make their own decisions. However in a "trafficked" environment they general are lied to, given false hope, and exploited as a commodity for profit and cheaply disposed of when worn out; where as a provider making their own choice can at least walk away when and if they want. In a traffic situation they experience harsh punishments if they try and leave.

My personal option is not to support the AMP scene for these reasons. Here the lifestyle and conditions are not so bad but when you see these providers lifestyles in other countries it will open your eyes and make you rethink; stuff and things.

PS. In 2012 human trafficking became #2 on the world wide most profitable crime list producing an estimated $32 billion a year.

[TittiesNBeer]

Nor should you understand it IFO; it's totally fucked up.

We all have to live with the decisions we make in life and choose our values. Personally I stay away from AMP's, all types of managed providers, and even the young ones who are lured by the prospect of easy money. I choose to see older, independent providers who understand the choices and feel empowered to engage in the hobby on their own terms.

[irishlad]

Originally Posted by bottoms up

So does it matter to you whether the coercion comes from life (i.e. need for money to live) or a pimp?
Seems to me they wouldn't really be wanting to do it either way.
It is what it is!

Of course it matters. This is in my opinion a ridiculous rationalization. We all make trade-offs like "I will do x and I will get y". Usually x is something for other people in return for something from other people (money is a proxy for this).

Of absolute critical importance, the choice of the x you will do for y is a voluntary exchange based upon your own strategy for making ends meet and getting what you want - whatever that might be (smart or not), you get to decide for yourself. That's a right I am not interested in helping erode.

When I say coercion I mean some interested party substitutes threats and force for the I will get "y" above. So for example I'd say the difference between a "partner" and a "pimp" is that you can end the former relationship at will without someone threatening to hurt you, even if you lose a bodyguard, marketer, scheduler and driver.

I get there is some grey. Grey like we need food, so we have to work to avoid the threat of starvation (but that's not someone controlling you and you have options)...Grey like "how can you ever really know for sure"...but my question is simply do the experienced folks here know "red flags" that might not be obvious to less experienced people?

[bottoms up]

The rationalization seems to be on your part.
Guarantee none of them as little girls said "I want to fuck fat old strange men for money when I grow up".
And you'd have to eliminate half of the providers because of pimps.

[bottoms up]

Not speaking or using broken English is a big red flag.
Do you mow your own lawn? Clean your own home?
You should stay away from AMPs, Home Depot, your favorite restaurants, and any hotels.
Profiting on someone else's bad luck is everywhere!

[irishlad]

Originally Posted by bottoms up

Not speaking or using broken English is a big red flag.
Do you mow your own lawn? Clean your own home?
You should stay away from AMPs, Home Depot, your favorite restaurants, and any hotels.
Profiting on someone else's bad luck is everywhere!

Got it. Giving money to some asshole who threatens to break a girls face if she doesn't fuck you is the moral equivalent of hiring someone to mow your lawn.

Not really the question though. Maybe there is no good answer. "Avoid AMPs" seems to be one good one. Pimp bad, sure...just not sure how you tell a Pimp from a driver/bodyguard/scheduler which seems like something a girl might be willing to pay for. I suppose any sign of a third party could be a red flag.