Thread Locking. What to do when you disagree with Moderation - Lesson 1

[Whispers]

For you ladies and gents that feel that you can't freely post your hobby related information, whether it be informative or entertaining.....



JJ locked ur_mom's thread on request. ur_Mom's Thread

One contributing factor in training a community to be silent lies in a Mod's ability to end conversations. A favorite out is "the OP requests the thread be closed" which usually happens when an OP opens a can of worms.

Here we have a thread where a Provider is getting feedback from not just hobbyists but her peers as well..... You can discuss the merits of it in the new thread I opened.
The subject matter Reopened

This is a common complaint I hear from people in regards to why they remain silent. Noone likes having things they are interested in locked.

So how do you handle it?

One way it to RTM the final post made by JJ. A problem here lies in that Mods usually work together and try to be supportive of each other and Mods from other cities tend to have their own problems. You will seldom get a Response to your complaint but I would suggest, based on complaints that this happens way too often, that you RTM it with the following

San Antonio has yet another thread locked. Why? Why are we not allowed the freedom to discuss topics at will? Please reopen the thread.


I am betting it still gets ignored. Do it consistently for a few months and maybe a pattern will get seen by the Admins and Owners..


The 2nd way to deal with it and take some control of your right to discuss a topic is to reopen a discussion...


You need to do a little cut and paste but quoting the most recent responses as you see I did in the above example and then having your say is totally allowed. The 2nd thread is not as effective as the original in some cases but it does give you a way to have your say within the guidelines of the board.


When a Mod feels he may have erred in his decision to close a thread he has told that will let him easily "merge" your thread into the original so that he does not end up with 4 threads on the same topic.


This is especially effective in threads derailed for some reason where a Mod has the choice of spending an hour editing and issuing warnings and points, or closing the thread.


If you see a Mod close a thread for this reason..... Do the same thing I demonstrated above.... select a few parts of the topic to be discussed and quote those things and then repost the new thread and have your say.... Remember to RTM the original closing with the statement



San Antonio has yet another thread locked. Why? Why are we not allowed the freedom to discuss topics at will? Please reopen the thread.



More examples to come.

[Precious_b]

Without checking, I remember I *think* I remember Mods inviting people to start their own thread. Just like you did with the subject of this one. OP has always had right of invoking closing thread. Doesn't mean they have the right to stop further discussions.

*I* see no problem.

If other threads are shut down immediately and they don't blatantly go against *accepted* policy THEN there is a problem.

BTW still waiting for that silent group to chime in.

[dearhunter]

Precious is incorrect as to the interpretation of the guideline concerning an OP request to lock a thread.

An OP does not have a "right" to have a thread locked. An OP is only entitled to "consideration" when making a request for a thread lock

There are rare occasions when a thread should be locked (it has become a breeding ground for points and bans, it is a rebuttal to a he said/she said and both sides have had their say).

Ownership has made it very clear that edits should be rare and locks should be the action of last resort. When a moderator does otherwise, he has left the reservation.

I call it going "Injun Joe"

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by Precious_b

Without checking, I remember I *think* I remember Mods inviting people to start their own thread. Just like you did with the subject of this one. OP has always had right of invoking closing thread.

No Sir..... And Mods should not honor that request without serious consideration to the other people posting in the thread. When they do so they are showing little to no regard for the other people in the thread that contribute as members to the board. In the example provided here, I do not think any Austin Mod would have honored the request. The best Mods let the community go in the directions they desire and only get involved in extreme cases.... where clearly they are needed. Here in San Antonio you have the worst extreme in my opinion for steering threads, locking threads and moving threads..

Doesn't mean they have the right to stop further discussions.

*I* see no problem. Of course you don't. Mainly though because you do not have the benefit of understanding how it is supposed to work. But we will help expose you to the information.

If other threads are shut down immediately and they don't blatantly go against *accepted* policy THEN there is a problem. very few threads should EVER be shut down....

BTW still waiting for that silent group to chime in.

Keep waiting..... You are months away..... Here is a paraphrased PM from a SA Provider

"I read a lot of what you write. It makes me curious to know more about you. But when I ask others what they think I'm told you do not like providers and think we are nothing but objects.

Normally I listen and it has not really done me much good because these "others" are typically the same ones who tell me to shut up and not voice anything on the board."

It's a process Precious.....

A few weeks of exposure to new ideas and seeing things done differently....

A month of concentrated effort by a small group of people that will come to help....

a few weeks of observation to see if anything is learned......

another few weeks of concentrated effort.....

In time Precious... I know you are excited....

Right now there are a lot of people sitting back and scratching their heads.... Wondering how we get away with it all.... Not understanding that they could do the same.


Give me an honest answer Precious......

If it was you posting what I posted a few weeks ago..... If each and ever comment I had made had carried your name..... or the name of any other San Antonio Hobbyist....

Tell me what would have happened and why?


Stick around buddy. There is a lot to do and it doesn't get done fast.

[Precious_b]

Answering to your points on my previous comment:

1. As I said, *I* think. Didn't look back at it. But know something like that has been invited in the past. Would have to look. Meq Culpa.
Who are the "best mods?"

2. Who is "we"?

3. In an ideal world.


Still waiting for the silent ones myself. Do see one or two posting though.

Shouldn't paraphrase without giving a link to what you are quoting. I already read it on the thread you pulled that from. Don't try to even let a hint of disinformation cloud what you want to do. You will lose ALL creditibility. Read about Col. John Boyd to see where I am coming from on the credibility and integrity bit.


To give you an honest answer, I wouldn't have posted what you did. You'd have to do the process another way that would have stimulated my interest.

Keep on track here and you will have me stimulated. I think this thread will bear some good fruits. I haven't even looked at the other one SL posted after hanging out my shingle on that thread.

Attitudes aside everyone. Please.

[Precious_b]

oh. nothing ever gets done fast.

[Precious_b]

Originally Posted by dearhunter

Precious is incorrect as to the interpretation of the guideline concerning an OP request to lock a thread.

An OP does not have a "right" to have a thread locked. An OP is only entitled to "consideration" when making a request for a thread lock

There are rare occasions when a thread should be locked (it has become a breeding ground for points and bans, it is a rebuttal to a he said/she said and both sides have had their say).

Ownership has made it very clear that edits should be rare and locks should be the action of last resort. When a moderator does otherwise, he has left the reservation.

I call it going "Injun Joe"

Thanks.

I'll take that at face value and possibly look into it in the future.
Lord knows i've made a couple of bad assumptions this last day or two.

[Guest032716]

So whispers - who gives a fuck? As SKF asked in another thread - are you just pandering wares? It seems so by your signature line! I say STFU!

[Whispers]

Originally Posted by Louigi

So whispers - who gives a fuck? As SKF asked in another thread - are you just pandering wares? It seems so by your signature line! I say STFU!

LOL....

That works with a lot here.... not me......

Obviously a number of people give a fuck.... I'm not the only one that has something well thought out to say on either side of the fence.

Thank-you for displaying what so many think the problem is.....

[Still Looking]

Originally Posted by Louigi

So whispers - who gives a fuck? As SKF asked in another thread - are you just pandering wares? It seems so by your signature line! I say STFU!

Why are you posting in his threAD?

[Still Looking]

Originally Posted by dearhunter

Precious is incorrect as to the interpretation of the guideline concerning an OP request to lock a thread.

An OP does not have a "right" to have a thread locked. An OP is only entitled to "consideration" when making a request for a thread lock

There are rare occasions when a thread should be locked (it has become a breeding ground for points and bans, it is a rebuttal to a he said/she said and both sides have had their say).

Ownership has made it very clear that edits should be rare and locks should be the action of last resort. When a moderator does otherwise, he has left the reservation.

I call it going "Injun Joe"

Imagine that?

[Laz]

The approach whispers is taking in this thread and the one asking people to speak up is interesting. I hope he continues in raising questions in a way that is not simply an attack.

I see that the thread was unlocked and am happy the rules on that have been clarified. I agree that someone should not be able to throw a bomb and then cut of the responses.

Like precious b I am waiting for and hoping those with issues to address will speak up. If they don't they have no right to complain.

[lasvegas]

awesome.

[Guest032716]

Originally Posted by Still Looking

Why are you posting in his threAD?

Do you know a compelling reason I shouldn't? And what business is it of yours to ask, are you a pseudo mod?

[Whispers]

For those of you that are unaware...... The thread closing that prompted this issue to be presented was recently revered and the thread opened with the following explanation.

Originally Posted by JJ

After a discussion with the senior staff members, it has been brought to my attention that we are not to close threads just because the OP requests for it to be so.

I was not aware of this until today. I will not close threads from this point on if they are requested to be closed by the OP. It will have to ride its course and die off once people stop posting on it.

So long as the thread is not seriously derailed, it will remain open. Please remember to stay on topic.

... and before you ask, you may not blame Whispers or the members that post with him for this.

Reopened.

I would hope that rather than blame any of us people would appreciate the effort.

I think that we just proved the assumption San Antonio HAS in fact been experiencing Moderation outside of the Guidelines intended by the owners.

In this case we have a Mod that does not know? Not new and possibly not JJ to blame. Mods are often trained by their predecessors or whomever is still on the button when they join the team.

Here you have a Mod taking actions that he should not because he does not know any better and a community accepting of that on the surface.....

Under the surface you have people afraid to speak up or participate because of the actions Mods take.

Things that make ya go Huh?