An amusing analogy for America

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

I think we ought to bring the troops home and post them along the Mexican border. Mexico has lots of oil. (So do we, but that is another rant.)

Or put them on the Gulf cleaning the oil out of the beaches. Bill BP for the cost of doing so.

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

I was not there but have a decent idea of the venue for the talk and it would have been an invited lecture but certainly would not qualify as off-the-record.

Former ambassadors have the leeway to say many things; current ambassadors should be toeing the administration's line when they make comments.

Originally Posted by WTF

Well it seemed to have been presented in a different light.
Private and the US Ambassador were empathized, if inadvertently , had they not been so, I am sure this point of contention would be moot.
Lauren may need to be a bit more careful in her presentation of events next time, before personally starting WWIII.








Yes agreed...and knowing an Ambassadors credentials that is commenting is also critical. What with some being career diplomats and others being figure head political favors to large donors it is important to know who said what about matters. So far it appears, if what you say is true, that Lauren inadvertently has presented things in a misleading light and and left out any info that could help us better understand just where this former Ambassador stands on the political spectrum. I can get that same spin on MSNBC and at least know who said what! LOL

Yeah, the context given wasn't perfect, but I took it like DG suggested. Most functions government officials or, anyone else for that matter, attend are "private" -- not that what anyone says will necessarily be treated as private or confidential.

I mean when was the last time you were in a hotel conference center and the meeting room or ballroom next to yours had a nice sign outside that said, "Florida Prosecutors Annual Meeting, Public Welcome!" or "IBM Americas 1st Quarter Sales Meeting, Join Us!"

[WTF]

Originally Posted by pjorourke

I think we ought to bring the troops home and post them along the Mexican border. Mexico has lots of oil. (So do we, but that is another rant.)

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

Or put them on the Gulf cleaning the oil out of the beaches. Bill BP for the cost of doing so.

What about this one....we could bring our troops home and have them do in Mexico what they are doing in Iraq and Afghanistan, which is building roads and schools and infrastructure. The Mexicans can then come over here and clean up that oil spill ( and mow my lawn!) for pennies on the dollar until their economy passes ours, then we can swim the border and return the favor.

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

I mean when was the last time you were in a hotel conference center and the meeting room or ballroom next to yours had a nice sign outside that said, "Florida Prosecutors Annual Meeting, Public Welcome!" or "IBM Americas 1st Quarter Sales Meeting, Join Us!"

Well then when was the last time you presented one of those piss off functions as private talk!?

Say you paid big bucks to hear Sara Palin speak... would you then come on here and say, "I was at a private talk discussing the problem of a nuclear armed Iran...with Sara Palin" and expect me not to give you three kinds of chit!

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by WTF

Well then when was the last time you presented one of those piss off functions as private talk!?

Say you paid big bucks to hear Sara Palin speak... would you then come on here and say, "I was at a private talk discussing the problem of a nuclear armed Iran...with Sara Palin" and expect me not to give you three kinds of chit!

see what I had to say yesterday, below...

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

I too do not know the context of this "private" conversation/talk/meeting, but if it truly was private can I suggest posting its contents on an internet message board may not be prudent.

I hear a lot of funny/provocative things, as I'm sure most of us do, but discretion doesn't permit me sharing here with all my friends.

In this case I don't think discretion is warranted because candidly I've heard the same reference/analogy about US Foreign Policy and a baby lab more than once. I have no idea who the real originator is of the line but I doubt it was the Ambassador.

but it is cute...kinda like a puppy....how excited LS got about thinking she was privy to some top secret breaking news thinking

[WTF]

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

see what I had to say yesterday, below...

Maybe Lauren can come on here and clear up all this speculation!

[John Bull]

I'm waiting for Charles to go down to the beaches and help pick up all the oil balls. Oh right! They're gone!!

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by John Bull

I'm waiting for Charles to go down to the beaches and help pick up all the oil balls. Oh right! They're gone!!

I don't pick up any balls but my own. lol

[Big Juan]

Ladies and Gents,

Almost none of us are truly 'fit' to debate our foreign policy. Mainly dealing with sheep herders, mud-ball throwing, wiping their asses with their hands (reason for non-handshake), goat frigggers (no offense to providers who have seen GOAT or myself) lends itself to an undiplomatic agenda of force to accomplish the mission. We protect our own best interests first, as any household wanting a 'comfortable' future should do.

The banter bashing our use of force to protect our money and our citizens, calling us bullies, putting our noses in other people's business etc. when we DO NOT KNOW the circumstances involved is reckless at best.

We gather opinions from the internet or media outletsof people who cannot handle the true facts. We want to be able to be diplomatic, sit and sup and become friends with people who believe with their own and their children's lives they will go to heaven if we all die. It is not reality. Evil threatens and you are sometimes forced to use unpopular means of self preservation

It will never be politically correct how we police the world to strengthen and protect ourselves. But I find it almost sickening that we have the ability to eat, drink & fuck Mary (for money) and criticize the provider by the means that lifestyle is achieved. (Trying not to quote A Few Good Men)

I gracefully respect your opinions, but when they are presented on the reaching media vehicles we have today, a majority of 'esoteric pie-in-the-sky philosophers' in their cattle-like reasoning will begin to believe it to be gospel. Whole political parties will base themselves upon the hatred of these people who provide their jobs and healthcare to gain power. Absolutely disgusting.

The current war in Afganistan is being run for money and by a group who believe their superiority calls for them to sacrifice soldiers for monetary gain. They own it as being their destiny and they are giving the soldiers what they truly want, death with honor. (Not my opinion) Look at the terms of engagement and sanity will tell you they want this prolonged, as no other military would think to fight a war this way. Ask any recent Halliburton employee losing their job since the war is focused on Afganistan. The Congress has cancelled their construction/ security contracts to give to another large firm that has ties to their party's coffers, wherein Halliburton had too many conservative ties. (Not speculation rather verbatim from numerous recently ex-employees)

Lina, they would love to bring them home to prove they need the government to take care of them at an even greater level, but the money is too good.

My opinions surely are conservative leaning, because I fortunately have prospered by those values and I have lived long enough to see the antithesis and I choose the former. I do not like everytnig that is done by them, but it is a far better cry than chasing a kumbiatic (PJ is that a word?) dream that is not self-sustainable.

Stop the dialogue of hatred towards conservative governing and make change that is fiscally responsible and sustainable. To not do so easily sways to a side that cannot improve our country and freedoms. You have been misled and misinformed and I know you will see the light.

Please don't banter about how in the past so and so did this and they were no better. That will only show the shallowness of your argument, as it does not address the CURRENT SERIES OF EVENTS IN FRONT OF US ALL.

Jeesh.....I have to go now and see how many more of my family I can get over that friggin' fence Jorge Bush built. We just want to work and take Texas back where jew steeld it froms our peoples. For reals.

Sorry about the last para.

[Sisyphus]

[In my best Joe Pantliano in his role as Guido, the Killer Pimp]

"Time of your life, eh...kid??"

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

I was at a private talk discussing the problem of a nuclear armed Iran, and the delicacies surrounding it's prevention.

She explained that Europe was terrified of how America would handle this. Europe looks at America like a Lab puppy in a crowded room: they get an idea that excites them, wagging their tail, obliviously knocking things over and annoying people around them. The enthusiasm makes everyone nervous, as they think decisions should be carefully thought over, and action taken in increments.

Whether true or not, I thought it was pretty funny.

I don't doubt for an instant that's the European perception of the American reaction to the Iranian situation. Having read through all of this, I'm not exactly sure what struck you as funny about the analogy. I'm not a dog owner myself, but I do find Labs...Lab puppies, in particular...funny. If that's what you meant, with you there.

If it's the characterization of American foreign policy vis-a-vis Iran...I can also find the characterization funny...even if I don't find it accurate.

If it's the idea of an American taking a cheap shot at the American government..eh...maybe it's funny...in a biting-the-hand-that-feeds-you kinda way.

But, as you've witnessed from the tempest in this here teapot....lots of folk don't share that sense of humor...

Nothing wrong with being an "outlier" when it comes to one's sense of humor. As your countrymen put it,

I'm the kinda guy who would laugh at a funeral
Don't understand what I mean? You soon will...

But, you gotta stand up & own it. Suffer those slings & arrows, if that's what the situation calls for...

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

?
The per[s]on making this comment was a US ambassador. I made no comment about my opinion of the US or the Iranian situation. Only the I heard a funny metaphor.

That changes things...a bit. Again, I don't doubt that it's an accurate representation of the view of American policy in Europe. I want my policy makers to accurate understand how they are perceived in the world. Can't work at changing the perception if you don't understand the perception.

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

For all the bickering in this thread - those upset seem to forget that it was one if YOUR own citizens that created the analogy - and agreed with it. An ambassador stationed in the middle east no less.

Again, depends upon what you mean by agreed. It seems a useful analogy for understanding how America is perceived. I want that it in a policy maker/implementer. OTOH, if the ambassador who gave this talk actually agrees with the perception, that's a completely different story. NOT at all what I want in that role.

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

I heard on NPR that Germany just paid the last war payment about a month or two ago. As I recall, the final payment was an interest payment. Took a while.

Honestly, the reactions so far are about on par with what you should have expected. It pissed me off too. Camille is right. It should never have been said. If the American Ambasador said that, he clearly has an inferiority complex and was just trying to suck up to the European community he, I assumes, idolizes. At the very least, he should have his hand slapped. And for the record, the initial post didn’t [reference] the American ambassador making such an absurd claim

There you go! Basically, that's why this person should not be in their role if they agree with the European view of American policy towards Iran.

Originally Posted by WTF

Maybe Lauren can come on here and clear up all this speculation!

T'would be nice...but that would be tough...& getting tougher by the day. The thread started off shaky & quickly took on a "Give us Barabbas" tone.

I think I inadvertently chopped one positive comment of Lauren's that I did want to use for a shameless plug. Her comment about the solidarity of view between the US & Canadian military. I suspect it has it's origins in the creation of the First Special Service Force during WW2. This commando unit was 50% Canadian, 50% American, & 100% badass!! Functioning as a tip-of-the-spear, this unit did things most thought couldn't be done & did with a uniquely North American swagger. The FSSF suffered the highest officer casualty rate of any unit in the Italian campaign.

But all of that isn't what made me want to shill here for learning more about them. Rather, it was the way they managed to evolve from initial suspicion...bordering on hate....to complete integration.

When the unit was disbanded towards the end of the war, the Canadians were ordered to fall out and board transport for return to Canadian "regular" units. They...grudgingly...did as they were ordered. The Americans were subsequently order to "close ranks" to prepare for the final disbanding & return to "regular" American units. They refused. Not only did they refuse, they broke ranks & ran along behind the transports, bidding farewell to their fellow Forcemen. As many stated,

"We had been together so long...endured so much...become so close...that we simply forgot who was American & who was Canadian."

Perhaps there's a lesson for us all in there somewhere....

[..]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

I was not there but have a decent idea of the venue for the talk and it would have been an invited lecture but certainly would not qualify as off-the-record.

Thanks for the clarification. Given this I'm actually shocked what she said, fully agree with Camille now: epic fail.

[gnadfly]

The ambassador was only reflecting the belief held by the 'apologizer in chief'. Did the ambassador go on to say 'Obamacare...its got what plants need. Its got electrolytes?'

[discreetgent]

Originally Posted by ..

Thanks for the clarification. Given this I'm actually shocked what she said, fully agree with Camille now: epic fail.

Sort of, but you missed my second supposition that it was almost certainly a former ambassador.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Big Juan

My opinions surely are conservative leaning, ...


...Please don't banter about how in the past so and so did this and they were no better.

Please support my ''conservative leaning'' political friends!

Do not pay attention to their past behavior. It is not an indication of their future behavior. Just because they have put into place a mentality of tax cuts that pay for themselves so we (conservatives) can spend more on war and Defense and drive up huge deficits....well disregard that past behavior. We new conservative are going to cut earmarks first. Well that is of course unless we decide that isn't such a bad idea. We will get back to you on that.

Yes Big Juan , your plea to support ''conservative leaning'' folks for is awe-inspiring. Sounds like you should end your next ad with "I'm Halliburton and I approve this message'' LoL

[WTF]

Originally Posted by discreetgent

Sort of, but you missed my second supposition that it was almost certainly a former ambassador.

Which is it dg, a current or former ambassador?

Its hard to tell, Lauren did not say former, she said: ''An ambassador stationed in the middle east no less.''

This is beginning to feel like an episode of ''Dancing with the Stars'' with so much toe tapping going on!

Where the hell is the lovely Lauren Summerhill btw? She defect to Iran and set up an obedience school for overgrown Lab puppies?

Originally Posted by Lauren Summerhill

For all the bickering in this thread - those upset seem to forget that it was one if YOUR own citizens that created the analogy - and agreed with it. An ambassador stationed in the middle east no less.

.

[discreetgent]

I think it would be former; but it really is losing the forest from the trees at this point.