Debt limit

[Jacuzzme]

Originally Posted by Little Monster

So you're that fascist propaganda doesn't involve lying, making stuff up (usually about a certain race or political group of people), twistingfacts in order to get people to follow their agenda?

Damn, your reading comprehension needs work, lots of it. Maybe you’d like to point out where I stated Fascists didn’t rely on propaganda. Good luck with that.

Twisting facts to coerce a populous towards a certain point of view doesn’t make one a Fascist, it makes them a politician. It matters not if they’re Fascist, Communist, Socialist, Capitalist or any other ist, it’s how politics has been done since Nebuchadnezzar. Perhaps you’d like to voir dire into a million different anti-President Trump narratives that have been proven to be 100% false. Not likely, as that would require critical thinking, not blind devotion.

You need to get yourself a history book, you have no idea what you are talking about. Doesn't matter where the article came from it is true, but you display your fascism by denying and deflecting. Just like with this whole debt ceiling thing.

Again, your poor comprehension skills are on full display. I criticized an article, not the publication. I did find the comparison of the burning of The Reichstag particularly amusing. If there’s anything in modern politics that parallels that particular event to a T it’s the reaction to the January 6th protests.

[Strokey_McDingDong]

Originally Posted by Little Monster

No You're a fascist cause you lie, make shit up, and twist what is said about anything you don't agree with.

wtf are you taking about?

[Strokey_McDingDong]

This debt bullshit is the retarded government's fault. Who else is there to blame? The democrats try to blame the republicans and the republicans try to blame the democrats, and the idiot zealots go out and try to fight with other idiot zealots.

[oeb11]

So sad - that DPST brain-washed minions have no clue as to their diatribes against 'fascism' - which is the very foundation of their DPST marxist/racist political agenda.
Foolish , indoctrinated, unable to think fo rthemselves DPST sheeples.

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by NoirMan

Something can be a political stunt and still be smart political strategy. Those things are not mutually exclusive. I Suspect that the Republicans I understand that from a average Joe watching television standpoint, saying that the Democrats could’ve use some arcane political tool to pass the debt ceiling without them, doesn’t make good commercials.



In your opinion. It makes a great commercial to point out that if Democrats let the debt ceiling collapse without voting to save it, a power they have, they will be responsible and saying "we didn't want to use one of our reconciliation cards would make a very good commercial though".


What makes good commercials, is we have 50 votes, all Democrats, voting to avoid a Cataclysm, and all 50 Republicans voted to allow the debt ceiling catastrophe. Any Republican, that is up for election in 2022, will be hard-pressed to go on the campaign trail and explain their no vote. A Yes vote, is easy to explain.


Man, you really don't understand how this works. The vast majority of Republicans right now ( right or wrong ) are telling their Republican representatives "don't you do it, do not give the Democrats one more opportunity to use reconciliation to pass something, another tax hike, they aren't done yet. Simplest vote ever to explain. "We Republicans have watched as Democrats have told us time and time again, we will do this without you, so we told them go ahead, you have the power, do it without us and I guarantee you most Republicans and Independents, 60% of which think Biden is doing a horrible job in every single category will accept it.


Have the Republicans come to the table at all regarding additional spending for things like free childcare, expanded education benefits etc. If they have it, been claiming that they are not part of the spending process and claiming that Democrats don’t want their input is a bit disingenuous.


Republicans have come to the table and suggested using a whole lot of left over Covid money to do some of the things Democrats want. Right now, the message from Republicans is, we don't need any more money raised through taxes. Let's spend what we have already allocated and take a look at things after that money is allocated.


If you believe, which I know you know better than,


Ah, figured that was coming. I see you dropped the "should know better" and have joined 1BM1 in calling me a liar because if I know better but don't say it, then I'm a liar to you so why can't I apply the same theory to you and 1BM1 and say "I know you know better than what you are saying", in essence, calling you a liar. Why not just drop the condescending bullshit and make your case.


I'm still intrigued though as to why you first said "I should know better"? Is that because you recognize that I understand these issues and prove it everyday by providing the research I do in an attempt to better understand these issues? So you think I'm smart and I just lie, huh?


that McConnell and other Republicans vote is in someway principled, rather than partisan politics,



Like you said, could be both and if you are suggesting that Democrats aren't partisan, well then, we have a whole different discussion.


then you really are blind to republicans partisanship.


And you aren't blind to Democrat partisanship? There's that GOD complex again. Of course there is partisanship on both sides, only an idiot would say other wise and only an idiot would suggest that only one side does it.


I will say it again, this is just a political stunt, smart politics nonetheless, but a political stunt.


And I'll say it again, when Joe Biden and other Democrats pulled the same thing, not participating in the vote to raise the debt limit under a Republican President, was also a partition stunt. This is tit for tat. I don't know whether one should call that a principal but that's where we are at. Every single thing you are arguing that Republicans "shouldn't be doing" has been done by Democrats.


I can guarantee that if the Democrats waited until the last minute put a single piece of legislation up to raise the debt ceiling and left it on the table without any other option, the Republicans would vote for it.



We just may find out come December


The likes of Lindsey Graham, Mitch McConnell, even Ted Cruz, would not want to have the only default in history, on their watch, based on their vote. If they were truly principled, it wouldn’t matter and they would allow the default to go forward. But Lindsay has already hinted that he couldn’t allow it to happen.

What they really want, is to force the Democrats to use up one of their reconciliation processes, which would leave them only one remaining, which they feel like they can Use archaic maneuvering the delay, and possibly kill a last reconciliation bill. Simply politics.

Think of the time and words we could have both saved if you had said that from the very beginning and my only response would have been "I agree, simple politics, nothing new, nothing that hasn't been done before and will be done in the future.

[NoirMan]

There will be no default. In fact moving it to December helps the democrats. They are already using reconciliation for another spending and taxing bill so tacking the debt limit into that doesn’t hurt them.

This is all a political stunt. If you continue to think otherwise I don’t know what to tell ya. I already predicted correctly that Mitch and the other Republicans were gonna cave. The rest of the prognosticating is just fancy talk and an academic exercise. Straw man much. Between that and Whataboutism you’re a two trick pony. I’ve neither stated or argues that both sides don’t engage in politics or that either side shouldn’t be doing anything. I stated that it was a stunt. BecAuse it’s a stunt. I believe you argued (or seemed to argue) that Mitch and the Republicans were acting out of some principle which I stated was laughable.

No matter what either side says, no one will actually allow the US to default. Its like threatening to hold your breath until you die, not gonna happen.

[NoirMan]

Republicans are scrambling to provide The needed votes since their strategy seems to have failed. Guess it wasn’t and isn’t a matter of principle. Must be politics since they now admit they formed a strategy which is now failed.

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by NoirMan

There will be no default. In fact moving it to December helps the democrats. They are already using reconciliation for another spending and taxing bill so tacking the debt limit into that doesn’t hurt them.

This is all a political stunt. If you continue to think otherwise I don’t know what to tell ya. I already predicted correctly that Mitch and the other Republicans were gonna cave. The rest of the prognosticating is just fancy talk and an academic exercise. Straw man much. Between that and Whataboutism you’re a two trick pony. I’ve neither stated or argues that both sides don’t engage in politics or that either side shouldn’t be doing anything. I stated that it was a stunt. BecAuse it’s a stunt. I believe you argued (or seemed to argue) that Mitch and the Republicans were acting out of some principle which I stated was laughable.

No matter what either side says, no one will actually allow the US to default. Its like threatening to hold your breath until you die, not gonna happen.

I don't believe it will happen either. The question is, who will blink first.

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by NoirMan

Republicans are scrambling to provide The needed votes since their strategy seems to have failed. Guess it wasn’t and isn’t a matter of principle. Must be politics since they now admit they formed a strategy which is now failed.

Gee, did I miss the vote? Nope, don't think so. As a matter of fact, Democrats failed to get what they wanted and accepted defeat for another couple of months.

[oeb11]

HF - you are correct
but the DPST minions will no more believe in their failure -
than they do in the guilt of H.... - who purchased the fake evidence and planted teh Russia Hoax on America

[Jacuzzme]

Ah, figured that was coming. I see you dropped the "should know better" and have joined 1BM1 in calling me a liar because if I know better but don't say it, then I'm a liar to you so why can't I apply the same theory to you and 1BM1 and say "I know you know better than what you are saying", in essence, calling you a liar. Why not just drop the condescending bullshit and make your case.

It’s the same guy.

[NoirMan]

https://www.msn.com/en-us/news/polit...KBL?li=BBnb7Kz

With these 11 votes, I guess that principled stand died on the vine.

[HedonistForever]

Originally Posted by Jacuzzme

It’s the same guy.

Sure sounds like it, huh? The guy has been here 8 days corresponding to the banning of 1BM1 and seems to know every position I have ever taken and even more that I haven't but he decided to make up shit anyway. Yeah, 1BM1 or his clone.


Misrepresenting who he is says a lot about him but doesn't surprise me. Regardless who he is, I can debate rings around him countering every argument he makes and the best the one trick pony can do, just like 1BM1, is complain about "whataboutism" where people like him go when they have nothing else to offer. Literally 90% of everything discussed here, contains comparisons between people and parties. You can't have a reasonably intelligent conversation without comparisons. Some people, looks like NM is one of them, doesn't really understand the meaning of the word. You have engaged in "whataboutism" only when one refuses to address what the other person has said before making your comparison and I'll give an example. One person says Trump did this and without addressing that accusation, I or anybody else says "well, Biden did this". When one addresses what was said by Trump and then brings up Biden on the very same issue, comparing what the two men did differently, is a comparison not simple "whataboutism" but like race, Democrats think it is an auto out of a conversation they feel like they have lost and just feel like they can't compete as NM is probably feeling about now.

[NoirMan]

What position have you taken or not taken that I misrepresented?

And what every position you’ve ever taken are you referring to. I’m pretty sure my posts have been limited to what you wrote that I was responding to.

I guess people are free to see and write what they want though, no matter whether it’s true or not.

[oeb11]

Thank U - 1b1 - You fool No One.

you would not know Truth Facts, And Reality - because of DPST/LSM marxist racist indoctrination.

So sad