Dammit, tbonetas

[TransAm]

I've changed my mind. OH, you know I usually agree with you. Not this time, and for two reasons:
1). I agree that the overall theme of mosts of your posts here is that BP is a douchebag for negotiating. I respect your right to have that opinion. I just don't share it. If a guy wants a BJ only session, I have no problem with him negotiating to see if that will result in a lesser price than a full GFE deal. I also have no problem with a provider telling the guy to get lost. Both are acceptable.
2). This bit about a social event: First, is there some reason you're the advocate here? Is the lady not capable of speaking up for herself? Secondly, you seem to make the point yourself that she was so concerned with staying on the list, that she passively kept doing something she didn't want to do. That's a choice on her part. She could have said "Screw this guy, and screw his list", and been done with it. She CHOSE not to, for what I can only assume are her own reasons. Blaming BP and BP alone strikes me as very unfair.

Still love ya OH, but on this one, I respectfully disagree.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by TransAm

2). This bit about a social event: First, is there some reason you're the advocate here? Is the lady not capable of speaking up for herself? Secondly, you seem to make the point yourself that she was so concerned with staying on the list, that she passively kept doing something she didn't want to do. That's a choice on her part. She could have said "Screw this guy, and screw his list", and been done with it. She CHOSE not to, for what I can only assume are her own reasons. Blaming BP and BP alone strikes me as very unfair.

.

Agreed.

Olivia, Coming out with second hand info is total bullshit.

You are losing any momentum you might have had by using this underhand tactic. If there was a problem it should have came out at that time! This could be turned around to look like someone is covering their social ass.

I've been to socials, where drinks were flowing....much can get lost in translation. For the man to get all the blame is total bullshit. Some dumb cunt drops to her knees at a social and you defend that shows some kinda nerve. It better have been for free as p4p is banned at those things!



Three sides should jump in with some comment right about now.

[Guest050715-1]

I hear ya, but let me clarify:

Originally Posted by TransAm

I've changed my mind. OH, you know I usually agree with you. Not this time, and for two reasons:
1). I agree that the overall theme of mosts of your posts here is that BP is a douchebag for negotiating. I respect your right to have that opinion. I just don't share it. If a guy wants a BJ only session, I have no problem with him negotiating to see if that will result in a lesser price than a full GFE deal. I also have no problem with a provider telling the guy to get lost. Both are acceptable.

There's a three pronged issue with the negotiation:

One: He wanted to know whey people were so down on him. The WOMEN re down on him because he is a notorious negotiator. You're right the lady doesn't have to take the offer of a reduced rate. But nonetheless, I perfer to not deal with someone one that negotiates my rates. But that in and of itself isn't a reason to dislike him, and it isn't the grift.

Two: My concern is WHERE THE FUCK DOES HE FIND ALL THESE WOMEN NEEDING EUPHEMISTIC HELP. Do they just come out of the woodwork? Is there a network of ladies needing help with their car notes? What and where does he come up with them?

Three: The grift is convoluted and ever evolving.

1 - Does he make it clear from the get go that it's an hour of staying down on him? No. He doesn't.
2 - The perpetual Number 10 Slot Open.
3 - The advertisements that for a reduced rate you MAY have a slot on my list, but you gotta stay down like FORever. Notice no ladies are coming forward to deny this.

Originally Posted by TransAm

2). This bit about a social event: First, is there some reason you're the advocate here? Is the lady not capable of speaking up for herself? Secondly, you seem to make the point yourself that she was so concerned with staying on the list, that she passively kept doing something she didn't want to do. That's a choice on her part. She could have said "Screw this guy, and screw his list", and been done with it. She CHOSE not to, for what I can only assume are her own reasons. Blaming BP and BP alone strikes me as very unfair.

Still love ya OH, but on this one, I respectfully disagree.

1 - She's retired now and has moved on. She never really needed someone to speak up for her, I'm just using that incident to demonstrate a pattern of grifting and using the code of a gentleman to hide his nature in plain site.
2 - No, I've made no point about her trying to stay on the list. I don't know that any of the ladies on the list make a point of it. The point I'm beating home is - does he or does he not re-interview the ladies that he continually leaves on the list. The list is hopelessly flawed. To start with some of them are retired or moved on.
3 - She didn't have the opertunity to say screw this guy. The second point I'm driving home is that he says he's such a fucking gentleman. If he was such a gentleman, he'd have clarified BEFORE the famous forfeit blowjob that it was on her not fucking after. Now he comes up with the lame, but I didn't cum.
4 - I'll go on record, and I'm sure I'm right, that she never offered a repeat blowjob to him.

Originally Posted by TransAm

Still love ya OH, but on this one, I respectfully disagree.

I hear ya, but I hope I've cleared up what the circumstances are.

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by WTF

.....................It better have been for free as p4p is banned at those things!

And as good looking as you are so I'll bet a lot of ladies have offered, I'll bet you've never taken what was kinda on the table and then not paid. You don't do things like that. Know why? You're a decent guy that's why.

Let's take a poll on how many guys here shoplifted, excuse me, didn't clarify what was the dealio was, before they received any real sexual favors. I'm not talking about some chick poll dancing on some guys neck or copping a feel I'm talking about full-blown sexual favors.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

And as good looking as you are so I'll bet a lot of ladies have offered, I'll bet you've never taken what was kinda on the table and then not paid. You don't do things like that. Know why? You're a decent guy that's why.

Let's take a poll on how many guys here shoplifted, excuse me, didn't clarify what was the dealio was, before they received any real sexual favors. I'm not talking about some chick poll dancing on some guys neck or copping a feel I'm talking about full-blown sexual favors.

I was going to SD Ca. and some provider overheard me and wanted to go, in fact asked me to go. I bought her a ticket and went and played golf like I planned. I later heard that I did not pay her for her time. SHE ASKED ME TO GO. To tell you the truth I did't want to take anyone. I was going to play golf. She said no problem , she had never been and wanted to go. It was not a weekend fuckfest.

So things do get lost in translation from time to time. I learned my lesson. Hopefully she learned hers.

Shit happens....this second hand way after the fact is really bullshit. It does not matter if I like blowpop or not.

People could make shit up about anyone if that was the rules we went by around here. What is I said some poster that died, say diamondjohn told me such and such negative about you. How would you feel about that?

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by WTF

I was going to SD Ca. and some provider overheard me and wanted to go, in fact asked me to go. I bought her a ticket and went and played golf like I planned. I later heard that I did not pay her for her time. SHE ASKED ME TO GO. To tell you the truth I did't want to take anyone. I was going to play golf. She said no problem , she had never been and wanted to go. It was not a weekend fuckfest.

So things do get lost in translation from time to time. I learned my lesson. Hopefully she learned hers.

Well we'll never know will we whether she asked to suck his exhausted dick will we? Bottom line is this, either Blowpapi's fulla shit or his list is. A half finished blow job does not a Top Nine make. Or, he could be saying I never finished, so there! I still retain my gentleman status.

Originally Posted by WTF

People could make shit up about anyone if that was the rules we went by around here.

People do that all the time anyway. If you notice, Blowpapi didn't deny it. He just tried to mitigate it by saying, "Ya, well, I didn't cum." Back to why is she on the list. One, he didn't cum and two, she's been retired forEVER now.

Originally Posted by WTF

What is I said some poster that died, say diamondjohn told me such and such negative about you. How would you feel about that?

Pfft, everyone knew dj liked me!

My point's been made. CAN'T WAIT FOR THE NEXT LIST.

[dearhunter]

Originally Posted by OliviaHoward

CAN'T WAIT FOR THE NEXT LIST.

heh

[blowpop]

Originally Posted by TransAm

I've changed my mind. OH, you know I usually agree with you. Not this time, and for two reasons:
1). I agree that the overall theme of mosts of your posts here is that BP is a douchebag for negotiating. I respect your right to have that opinion. I just don't share it. If a guy wants a BJ only session, I have no problem with him negotiating to see if that will result in a lesser price than a full GFE deal. I also have no problem with a provider telling the guy to get lost. Both are acceptable.

I've never understood the huge taboo about negotiating in the hobby, but I realize it's there, and respect it.

(My personal opinion is that providers who are hugely offended by the concept of negotiation either have too much of their self-worth tied up in their rate, or else it's simply a smart technique to keep their rates as high as possible. Every business would prefer you simply paid the rack rate for their offering, but most realize that negotiation happens all the time. Most business owners would rather rent a hotel room for less than rack rate than to have it sit empty for the night and earn zero. But I'm not the first guy to be perplexed by the incredible sensitivity surrounding the economic side of the hobby.)

That being said, I do understand the sensitivity to negotiation. So I don't negotiate.

OH seems to think that I call up providers and say "Well, sweetie, your rate is too high. How about cutting me a deal?"

I don't do that. Ever. When I seek out a provider, I pay her rate. If her rate isn't something I'm willing to pay her, I don't contact her at all.

It may chap OH's derriere, but many providers do offer french-only rates, and since that's the kind of session I enjoy, that's what I choose, if they're offered. If I don't know her rate, I ask for it, and if she's someone I know to be a legitimate provider, I tell her what I'm looking for (duration, incall) and what I'm not looking for (Greek, intercourse.) Having hobbied for over a decade, I realize that some providers have one rate, others have several, so I give her as much information as I can about what I'm looking for.

It's up to her to set the rate. I either accept it or I don't.

Originally Posted by TransAm

2). This bit about a social event: First, is there some reason you're the advocate here? Is the lady not capable of speaking up for herself? Secondly, you seem to make the point yourself that she was so concerned with staying on the list, that she passively kept doing something she didn't want to do. That's a choice on her part. She could have said "Screw this guy, and screw his list", and been done with it. She CHOSE not to, for what I can only assume are her own reasons. Blaming BP and BP alone strikes me as very unfair.

I'm kinda curious why I never heard a peep from the provider about this if she felt like I ripped her off.

And it's amazing how both OH's fury about my list and this supposed upset provider both materialized during the same week.

Years after I started sharing my list. And years after this party.

I wouldn't call OH a liar, even though she has no problem calling me all sorts of names.

But something doesn't add up.

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by blowpop

I don't do that. Ever. When I seek out a provider, I pay her rate. If her rate isn't something I'm willing to pay her, I don't contact her at all.

Originally Posted by blowpop

But the reality that I've observed over my years as a participant is that many providers offer different rates

Originally Posted by blowpop

When I contact a provider, I ask her what her current rates are. Because they're often not fixed.

Originally Posted by blowpop

I want to pay the provider what she wants to earn, as long as it's within my budget. (If it's not, I don't see her.)

This is where I stopped. What were you saying?

[Liliana Vess]

Regardless of what side you fall on the negotiation issue, people need to stop comparing it to hotel rooms and light fixtures.

It is NOT the same thing. It is a personal service, not an item sitting on a showroom floor or an empty room. Someone is spending their personal time performing physical and/or emotional labour and in this particular field, potentially risking their safety. It makes sense that it is valued and rated on a different scale.

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Liliana Vess

Regardless of what side you fall on the negotiation issue, people need to stop comparing it to hotel rooms and light fixtures.

It is NOT the same thing. It is a personal service, not an item sitting on a showroom floor or an empty room. Someone is spending their personal time performing physical and/or emotional labour and in this particular field, potentially risking their safety. It makes sense that it is valued and rated on a different scale.

I beg to differ... I'd rate a 17k dollar light fixture gotten at half price over a blowjob!

[Dorian Gray]

Originally Posted by Liliana Vess

Regardless of what side you fall on the negotiation issue, people need to stop comparing it to hotel rooms and light fixtures.

It is NOT the same thing. It is a personal service, not an item sitting on a showroom floor or an empty room. Someone is spending their personal time performing physical and/or emotional labour and in this particular field, potentially risking their safety. It makes sense that it is valued and rated on a different scale.

Speaking of light fixtures. Best $40 I've ever spent.

[Hot to Trot Daphne]

Originally Posted by Liliana Vess

Regardless of what side you fall on the negotiation issue, people need to stop comparing it to hotel rooms and light fixtures.

It is NOT the same thing. It is a personal service, not an item sitting on a showroom floor or an empty room. Someone is spending their personal time performing physical and/or emotional labour and in this particular field, potentially risking their safety. It makes sense that it is valued and rated on a different scale.

Someone gets it. Thank you.

[BatteriesNotIncluded]

Grift... Shoplift... Need a dictionary (and occasional spell) check.

Sounds like a lawyer is needed. Oh wait, it's not legal so that won't quite work

Ok, the thread has turned humorous for this individual.

Negotiation is key to business in all industries. Some have legal recourse. Others just have SOMB threads.

[DEAR_JOHN]

blowpop has every rite to post his list, Olivia has every rite to bitch about it. Guys will try to get a discount. Girls have the rite to have specials, guys have the rite to wait for a special. Some girls may give samples or the full meal deal at a social without going to Olivia or anybody else for permission, and guys will accept what is offered. If someone tries to get a lady alone at a social for some off the clock lovin, all she has to do is say no.

All this shit is simply hobby 101. This thread can go on for another another 100 postings and nothing will change.

Trying to inject some humor.