do we not deserve respect?

[CuteOldGuy]

Well, I, for one, am convinced. Facechair, your arguments are irrefutable. You certainly have more intelligence and rational logic than anyone else on this board. The way you reacted was at least as appropriate as necessary for the humiliation you had to endure. I think we have all learned something today. We thank you, and are forever in your debt.

[Martyoo7]

I think someone just needs a hug.

[MsElena]

Originally Posted by herfacechair

MsElena: Any man who has tact would never call/PM/email/text, etc....using language like that.

Again, that language has given me many successes in this hobby. So what constitutes "tact" is subject to opinion. Tact involves diplomacy. Anybody familiar with history, as well as current events, would know that this isn't the same, or consistent, across the board. But since we're on the subject, I'm not surprised that you're not going to address the lack of tact that lead to the statements that I made, and eventually my returning fire with fire.

MsElena: When I receive something like that, I disregard it.

Had the OP done that, I wouldn't be here dismantling posts like yours.

MsElena: You're going to end up using the wrong language with a lady and that lady is going to end up being a cop.

You mean a cop with a track record of being a provider, especially one with legitimate reviews and a website? Got you. This is another example of commenting on an issue without having all the facts.

There's always three sides to every story, your side, her side and the truth. Are we getting the full truth? Who knows. I made my comments based upon the language you admitted to using.

Also, there's no facts needed when making the statement I did previously, "You're going to end up using the wrong language with a lady and that lady is going to end up being a cop." You already admitted to the language you used. Are you that clueless to realize that using that language can and will get your ass arrested? Use common sense.

Flame me, I'll flame back....blah blah blah. Those are words that a child would use. Are we back in grade school? The mentality behind that. Be a man and let it go.

[Sooper Lover]

Herfacechair: If that human being fails to act like an adult, I'm not going to treat him/her like an adult. It's that simple. Respect isn't deserved, it's earned. You don't deserve respect simply because you're a woman. If a woman expects to be respected, she needs to show that to those that she wants respect from. If a woman fails to respect me, I'm going to withdraw the respect that I initially extended to her, and I'm going to replace it with disrespect.

What a lost person you are....So using your line of thought, (I use "thought" very loosely here), I have license to be rude to anyone I just happen to meet, because they haven't "earned" my respect?? Utter lunacy!!

"Sooper Lover: I don't want to sound cliche`, but I find the nicer I treat a lady, the nicer I get treated."

herfacechair: So, did your "the nicer I treat a lady, the nicer I get treated" philosophy get you somewhere with the following incident that you talk about here?

"I gave it a no as long as she brings along her sister. She also need to learn to focus on the customer and not carry on a conversation with her sister while she's supposed to be servicing me. IMHO, when I walk away from a dream and still have a load in my sack, it is a "No" recommendation. As always, YMMV. But I say buyer beware..." - Sooper Lover

herfacechair: It didn't look like they responded to your "niceness" with respect for the effort and time you invested in this. However; if what you say is true, perhaps you weren't nice to these women, resulting in you walking away from your dream without expending any ammo. BUT! If you insist that you WERE nice to these women, then your statement isn't always applicable."

Yepper, you get me here....NOT. I treated them both with respect, and yes I walked away with a full load, but I also walked away knowing I did the right thing. Sure I could have screamed and yelled....maybe even called her names. But what point is that? Here is what my respect got me: A phone call about a week later where she apologized and offered to see me again without her sister present. That was her first trip into the hobby ever as a provider. The second dream was much better and really GFE....all because I treated her with respect.

You know, my post really wasn't intended to be a personal slam on you. It was simply an open offering of my opinion to the original person who started this thread. But you made it personal to me. Obviously, since my post seemed to strike a chord with you, maybe you need to look in the mirror and ask yourself, "Would I take money for an hour of fun from that guy staring back at me?" That is of course, if you can stomach the image of the person staring back at you. I would be willing to say there is a long list of providers who will take a pass when they hear who you are, and that list probably grows each time you see someone. Enjoy your lonely bitter life.

[herfacechair]

MsElena: There's always three sides to every story, your side, her side and the truth. Are we getting the full truth?

That's the kind of nonsense I get from people holding the weak end of the argument. I'm presenting the complete set of facts. You could take my posts, and create a timeline of what happened, from the time she vented to me, to my response, to her response with the flaming smiley, to this thread.

MsElena: Who knows. I made my comments based upon the language you admitted to using.

You made your comments based on not knowing the facts surrounding the comments that I admitted to using. All you heard was that I used that language to increase my success. What you didn't hear was the criteria that I used before using that language. Without that information, you went ahead and made an assumption, fueled by your bias in this exchange, and made an erroneous projection. I called you out on it.

MsElena: Also, there's no facts needed when making the statement I did previously, "You're going to end up using the wrong language with a lady and that lady is going to end up being a cop." You already admitted to the language you used.

WRONG. You need additional facts when trying to get a complete picture of everything that I do. You made the assumption that I just go out and say certain things, to just about any post that is supposedly from a woman. What I didn't say spoke volumes, had you known those facts, you wouldn't have made that assumption, or made a post about things you know little about. The complete facts are always needed when addressing something that I do. Period.

MsElena: Are you that clueless to realize that using that language can and will get your ass arrested? Use common sense.

What part of the following comment didn't you understand?

"You mean a cop with a track record of being a provider, especially one with legitimate reviews and a website? Got you." --herfacechair

OK, let me break this down for you.

"track record of being a provider"

"one with legitimate reviews and a website"

Hmmm, what could these mean? That I could find something that indicates that she's an actual provider maybe? Things like, say, a series of reviews? A series of advertisements to go with those reviews? Reviews by hobbyists who have also reviewed other providers on here, you know, providers with P411, escort.com, and other accounts? Escort participation on other escort type sites in this country?

Are you starting to see a trend? Is something clicking up there? Common sense would dictate that if it looks like a duck, walks like a duck, quacks like a duck… well, you get the picture… hopefully.

For your statement to be applicable, a cop would have to double as legitimate provider on these escort related boards, with complete immunity from prosecution. Yeah… let's see how well that flies with the public.

Oh, and speaking of common sense, about doing things that could get ones ass busted, guess what? The mere fact that women have a website, and are posting here, puts them at risk of that. Same thing with the hobbyists with reviews posted on here, and on other escort websites.

MsElena: Flame me, I'll flame back....blah blah blah. Those are words that a child would use. Are we back in grade school? The mentality behind that.

WRONG. It's human nature. Matter of fact, it's even in the Old Testament, again:

'I will punish what Amelek did to Israel, how he ambushed him on the way when he came up from Egypt 'Now go and attack Amalek, and utterly destroy all that they have, and do not spare them. But kill both man and woman, infant and nursing child, ox and sheep, camel and donkey.'" --Samuel relaying God's orders to King Soul

One main concept in that is this, "they attacked us, we'll attack back."

This type of, "attack me and I'll attack back," theme has played throughout human history. It plays from international levels down to inter personal levels. We're familiar with one offshoot to that behavior: "An eye for an eye."

I highly doubt that you wouldn't do anything to a woman that walks up to you and knocks you on your ass. You'd either fight her back, or get her details and report her to LE. You're more than likely not going to let this go without a response.

Or, you could end up saying, "fighting is grade school mentality," and just walk away from her, with a smile on your face. If you're willing to walk away in this scenario, then I might, just might, think that you're not one of those, "do as I say, not as I do," types.

MsElena: Be a man and let it go.

That's completely out of the question. It's like I said earlier in this thread:

"Three, I handle these cases the way I handle a combat operation. When someone flames me, no matter how minor, I have a tendency to unleash "overwhelming" "firepower" on them. If they engage me back, I keep engaging them until they're neutralized." --herfacechair

And this:

I have a right to defend myself, to include countering every post that speaks against me. You of all people should know that I'll refute the opposition's counterpoints. I'm going to treat these debates/flames/arguments the same way that I treat a combat operation. One doesn't stop shooting, after taking one hostile down, when there are other hostiles in the engagement area. --herfacechair

Do you honestly think that because you said that, I'll abandon one of my off duty hobbies?

After years of getting involved with flames and debates where:

* One spanned over 200 pages…

* One debate thread ending up having posts that measured 90 + MS pages (mine) as the reply…

* Going on websites, dominated by liberals, and engaging those threads, one against many, like I'm doing here…

* Getting involved in flame wars on forums where the moderators would tell whiners to F off… and so on…

You think I'm just going to drop my philosophy and walk off? Not happening.

I'd have to be a doormat to do what you want me to do here. That's not going to happen.

[herfacechair]

Sooper Lover: What a lost person you are....

Don't mistake my handle on things, and accurately pointing things out, as my being a "lost" person. This is just your ego setting stress shields up in the face of my reply to you.

Sooper Lover: So using your line of thought, (I use "thought" very loosely here),

This sounds like teenage reaction to their parent's line of reasoning. You know, the line of reasoning they latter realize was right on the money. My line of thought helped me get a masters degree, come back in one piece from the combat zone, and to do things like expose the fallacy of your reasoning.

Sooper Lover: I have license to be rude to anyone I just happen to meet, because they haven't "earned" my respect?? Utter lunacy!!

What part of the following statement didn't you understand?

Remember, you flipped me off with a smiley showing anger. You forfeited any kind of "fair" treatment from the moment you fired that message back at me. -- herfacechair to stacy in kc

And this:

"Venting to me, when I'm not even one of your friends, or confidants, lovers, etc, was disrespectful; lamenting an ongoing problem that could've been resolved by a clever name change, disrespects the efforts of the administrators that are trying to work this issue with you." -- herfacechair to stacy in kc

The only "lunacy" going on here is your failure to read the entire thread with the intentions of understanding what's going on. Obviously, you've entered this discussion with a biased mindset. Like huge horse-blinders, your bias prevented you from seeing what caused me to turn around and return the disrespect.

Piece of advice, never assume what my line of reasoning is if you're going to ignore what I've spelled out in the thread. Like the others that I've debated with, online, for almost 8 years, you're automatically going to be wrong.

Sooper Lover: Yepper, you get me here....NOT.

Actually, I did get you with that one. That one incident proved your statement wrong.

Sooper Lover: I treated them both with respect, and yes I walked away with a full load, but I also walked away knowing I did the right thing.

I don't count, being taken for granted, and not giving feedback to that effect, as doing the right thing.

Sooper Lover: Sure I could have screamed and yelled....maybe even called her names.

Another point that you're missing, something that wouldn't happen if you bothered to read this thread without bias. They didn't do anything that warranted you doing such. Unless you just crawled from beneath a rock, and had just discovered what human civilization and urban culture is, anybody would see a hostile intent icon for what it is. A flame. In the online world, flame begets more flames. That's precisely what happened.

Sooper Lover: But what point is that?

The question should be, what point is there in arguing in a thread if you're not going to pay attention to what you're reading, and ultimately going to respond to?

Sooper Lover: Here is what my respect got me: A phone call about a week later where she apologized and offered to see me again without her sister present. That was her first trip into the hobby ever as a provider. The second dream was much better and really GFE....all because I treated her with respect.

Again, your statement:

"I don't want to sound cliche`, but I find the nicer I treat a lady, the nicer I get treated." -- Sooper Lover

There's an immediate relation here, an "if, then" type of statement. If you treat them with respect, you get treated nicer. Well, you treated them with respect during that first session, and you didn't receive that "niceness" during that first session. That's what counts, that's what you have to use. It's that simple. For your statement to be applicable, it'd have to have an immediate effect.

The mere fact that one got back with you, to apologize, and offered a better session the next time, had everything to do with her building a business… and offsetting her past disrespect to you to help aid her business… than it did with your respect gaining points with her.

I've contacted ladies on here, who had received bad reviews, and offered to give them a chance to counter that. Many were more than willing to prove a bad review wrong. They were enthusiastic about the idea of giving me a session that I'd remember for the rest of my life. Had our schedules placed us in Kansas City during the same days, I would've been able to counter their negative reviews with positive ones.

It was more about the business than it was about you.

Sooper Lover: You know, my post really wasn't intended to be a personal slam on you. It was simply an open offering of my opinion to the original person who started this thread. But you made it personal to me. Obviously, since my post seemed to strike a chord with you,

You made points that amounted to counterpoints to my arguments as well as support for the OP. It's like I told other posters here, I treat this like a combat operation. I'll go after all hostiles, not just the original one. You should've known that had you read the thread to see if anybody had said the same thing you were about to say. You would've also seen my responses to see if you'd end up with the same fate as the others. Fire at my direction, I'll fire back. Congratulations, we're in a "fire fight," you're a part of the opposition.

Sooper Lover: maybe you need to look in the mirror and ask yourself, "Would I take money for an hour of fun from that guy staring back at me?" That is of course, if you can stomach the image of the person staring back at you.

I just did. If I were a woman, and knowing what most of these women go through, both through 20+ years of interacting with providers, as well as reading, hearing women complaints about us men, my answer would be FUCK YEAH! That reflects the vast majority of the providers I contacted.

Sooper Lover: I would be willing to say there is a long list of providers who will take a pass when they hear who you are, and that list probably grows each time you see someone. Enjoy your lonely bitter life.

WRONG. For every provider that doesn't see me, there are 10 to 20 that are willing to see me. And get this, my travels to other states, as well as other countries, opens the provider list, or women that want to see me, up exponentially. This isn't the first time that I've gotten into debates like this on an escort message board.

In fact, my debate here is nothing compared to the one I had on a couple of local message boards, where I lacerated many of the providers and their supporters. I've since had sessions with some of those providers.

That should tell you something, not just that you've just made an assumption about me… again.

[JS42]

After this little nugget:

"After years of getting involved with flames and debates where:

* One spanned over 200 pages…

* One debate thread ending up having posts that measured 90 + MS pages (mine) as the reply…"

I hereby put forth the first nomination to please, pretty please, with freaking sugar on top, Lock this ridiculous thread before it goes on into infinity.

Herface, I'm quite impressed, I really am. I never thought in a million yrs I would ever say what I'm about to say. I never thought I would ever run into anyone more a blowhard, full of hot air and self importance as much as Longer. I stand corrected, as you have disproved that in one damn thread. Bravo!! Now please mods, put this guy out of his misery because it's obvious he isn't going to STFU, so do it for him!!

[mojoworkin]

I hope no one cuts this guy off in traffic. He would probably equate that to a combat operation too.

[herfacechair]

JS42: I hereby put forth the first nomination to please, pretty please, with freaking sugar on top, Lock this ridiculous thread before it goes on into infinity.

I have a better idea. Simply resist the urge to click this thread open, if you can't do that, then resist the urge to read, or respond to it. You're a contributing factor to this.

JS42: Herface, I'm quite impressed, I really am. I never thought in a million yrs I would ever say what I'm about to say.

I highly doubt that you're the "saint" that you're trying to portray yourself as here. Deep down inside, you want me to give up… you'd have a better chance to finding a cure for cancer… When you realize that I'm not going to give up, you try to get this thread locked up.

JS42: I never thought I would ever run into anyone more a blowhard, full of hot air and self importance as much as Longer. I stand corrected, as you have disproved that in one damn thread. Bravo!!

So says the guy that types as if he's possessed by a retarded ghost.

Let's face it. You took a swipe at me on this forum. I responded with facts that you weren't aware off prior to making your previous post, and you remain silent… until now. Don't mistake my pointing the facts out, to my standing up against deceptions against me, to exposing the flaws in yours, and everybody else's arguments, as my being a "blowhard, full of hot air and self importance." I use those quotations strongly.

Pardon me if I'm able to rub your face in the colossal mess that you call your reasoning and arguments.

JS42: Now please mods, put this guy out of his misery

I take sadistic pleasure in engaging in these debates. There's no "misery" involved.

JS42: because it's obvious he isn't going to STFU, so do it for him!!

You do realize that something causes me to come back and reply, do you? It boils down to an "If X, then Y," statement. The folks in the national forums figured that out. The question is, are you capable of figuring out what to do.

Remember, no moderator intervention is needed to end this.

The posters in the national forum figured out the "If X, then Y," pattern that caused the thread to keep growing. Could you figure that out? Your next course of action will answer that question.

[Kaboom]

Wow....just wow.

[herfacechair]

Originally Posted by mojoworkin

I hope no one cuts this guy off in traffic. He would probably equate that to a combat operation too.

That didn't bother me. Not an issue when you give yourself plenty of time to get to your destination. As usual, your mojo on this thread doesn't work.

[raedy4funn45]

Yes the ladies on this site deserve some respect. Get to know them fiirst, then maybe you can make some comments or suggestive remarks.

As for the definition of gentleman, most young people have no clue. Being in my 40’s, I was raised to be a gentleman.

A gentleman will hold the door for a lady, have manners, and be courteous for starters. I was raised to respect other people and their property. Yes respect is earned, but I am at least courteous until I have a reason not to respect you.

I really could care less how society judges my hobby choices, but at the end of the day I still have the values of a gentleman that I was raised with.

[JS42]

Dude, I am a contributing member here also, and with that, I also have every right to state my opinion. Unlike you, I don't feel the need to make a spectacle of myself. You made your point clear back on the first page, the rest of this is just silly and immature, and will continue to be because YOU bring nothing new to this thread other than continuing your rants. I never considered myself a "saint" there genius, as I'm posting on a freaking escort board..duh!

And you are right, this thread isn't misery for you, but you live in it. Anyone who puts on a different persona online, or resorts to this childish behavior, where they need the last word no matter what, has serious issues in their real life. And it doesn't take a shrink to figure that out, just common sense. Whether you act like this in real life or it's your online persona is irrevelant, you got issues.

Now go ahead and flame away at me. I'm done with this ridiculous thread you made out of it. Sooner or later, the mods will close this thread, just a matter of time, so have your fun while you can. Although the best way to let this thread die out is for people to quit responding, like I will do now.

[jaybee]

i wish there was a fireman to put all the flames out...

[simplyme]

THE ONLY REASON I'M HERE IS, I JUST WANA HAVE A NICE DREAM WITH A NICE WOMAN........PM ME LADIES.....I LOVE YOU I THINK YOUR THE BEST!!!!!!!!!!!!!

ANYTHING ELSE IS JUST DRAMA DRAMA DRAMA.