Where are the Classy Girls? Also, Tips for Gentlemen

[Jessica4stacks]

Hello

[Missy Mariposa]

Originally Posted by TravelingGentleman

Where are all the high class girls?Classy gentlemen want classy girls. For my time spent surfing around the incredible number of providers who describe themselves as "elegant" or "upscale" or who are looking for upscale gentlemen, I haven't seen much to recommend...not that shopping in this proverbial store would do me any good because no one is newbie friendly.

1. If a girl isn't newbie friendly (truly), move on. Don't hesitate. There are plenty of us who are legitimately newbie friendly.

2. If you want a classy girl, stop thinking with just your dick. I don't mean you specifically, but you general. I write a relatively comprehensive website so that you know exactly what you are getting when you walk in the door. Many others do the same. READ the websites. If you meet with a girl and she's not as advertised? Write a review and say that.

That's right. A classy girl's value is not between her legs. It's between her ears. It's her ability to make a man feel special, and wanted by someone whom he finds desirable.

Sure, but you unfortunately have the reality of many men who get upset that you're "wasting their time". I've got a review where someone stated that you have to remind me "what you're actually there for". I responded to that with this: Someone recently chose for me to be part of their end of life experience as a paid companion. "What you're actually there for" varies from person to person.

-A graduate degree isn't required, but I daresay that literacy is. High-school level graduate ability to read, write, and construct a coherent sentence.
-Some basic understanding of current events, and a desire to explore and learn about the things their companion is interested in to enhance conversation.
-An understanding of what a social chameleon is, and how to be one. If you're attending a dinner party, you don't wear a hooker outfit. If the table is discussing subprime interest rates, you don't chime in to talk about your cat.
-The ability to role-play, and enough social grace to be able to pass the barest of scrutiny during introductions. Today your name might be Rebecca from Marketing. Tomorrow,you're Becky from GS - consulting on a merger with me. Why? Because personal companions don't belong at these functions, but I want to WANT you there anyway just to be in the presence of an intoxicatingly beautiful woman.

Agree with all of these.

-Your pictures. Good grief. I'm tired of looking at provider pictures showing pictures of their buttocks, breasts, and legs. If you don't have a professionally taken picture of yourself wearing something elegant that I want to see attached on my arm at a social function, you're not it.

And if women didn't have such pictures, they would lose a good portion of their business. Even the top HDHs have topless photos.

-Willingness to be a travel companion.

So "classy" and "having my own obligations and life" don't go hand in hand? Some women have children, or are in school, or have sick family. I spend 15 days a month travelling, not everyone has that luxury. Doesn't make me any better than them.

-Reasonable expectations for *being* a travel companion. If I want to fly you ($500) to a port to take you on a 7-day all expenses paid cruise in the Caribbean ($1500 for a balcony suite), and your rate is $500/hr...as much as the plane ticket...without some reasonable expectations, that's an $84,000 tab for your companionship. Um...nope. There's an endless list of women who would love to have an all-expenses paid trip to somewhere - ANYWHERE - and would ask for no compensation in return. Intimacy certainly isn't going to be part of the package, but a friendship certainly would be. Think about what the difference is worth.

It's very clear you're new. No one works like that. The price scales down the more you buy. What's $500/hr may only be $4000/day or $7,000/3 days or $10,000/7 days. See how that works? There's incentives to buying more time.

-Likewise for business trips. If I'm flying somewhere on business, and want to bring a companion to hang out with after a day of meetings....reasonable expectations.

Sorry, but same expectations generally. You're still removing her from her job for X days which is Y dollars lost. You want a discount because you're tired? Classy!

-Did I mention pictures? Why does everyone block out their faces? A classy girl understands that 75-90% of their time with a gentleman is fully clothed, and whether she's pleasant to look at during conversation is probably the biggest deciding factor for whether they're a potential companion.

Now I think you might actually just be trolling. Privacy, discretion. If a woman is ugly, you'll find it in the reviews. I don't really need Joe Blow at the grocery store to recognise me from ECCIE all while I have no idea who he is. I still have the right to a private life, despite being available for public consumption. I've got 16k twitter followers, a blog audience of 6,000 readers a month, and my website...no that's okay. I don't really want or need to show any more of my face than I already do.

[KeiraLeone]

great post missy! after hearing about that Olympian I just cant post my face ): I also have a somewhat serious modelling career and don't need people finding out my past!
I wish sugaring in my area was taken seriously to avoid all of this :P

[Mz.Booty]

IMHO a gentleman is not only first, gentle...but affectionate, considerate, generous, straight-forward, never condescending, always putting her safety first, upfront with his expectations and proclivities, never arrogant or over-bearing, but willing to explore her ideas through simple subtle interactions that not only gain trust but establish the connection that matters most...unfortunately to popular belief all men are not created with equal portions of these characteristics however a substantial blend is more than enough to woo the least of us ladies who enjoy good company all-together and assist a good guy in getting his companionship fix. Im just saying...

[Olivia Styles]

Good Evening Gentlemen

Xo Pamela Spade Isley
P174462

[TravelingGentleman]

Missy, apologies for my delinquent reply - I've been traveling, then got back and flew a provider to Houston for a week to paint the town red. To your points:

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

1. If a girl isn't newbie friendly (truly), move on. Don't hesitate. There are plenty of us who are legitimately newbie friendly.

I've said this before - this thread's OP was my very first post on ECCIE. In fact, I created an account on ECCIE solely for the reason of expressing my frustration with the misappropriated language that made it hard to navigate. Disregard the newbie portions - those problems are six months behind me, and hilariously - something almost every newbie complains about.

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

If you want a classy girl, stop thinking with just your dick. I don't mean you specifically, but you general. I write a relatively comprehensive website so that you know exactly what you are getting when you walk in the door. Many others do the same. READ the websites. If you meet with a girl and she's not as advertised? Write a review and say that.

A few thoughts here.

1. How many reviews on ECCIE do you think give a "yes" recommendation, and have comments on the reviews from other people that say something along the lines of, "Given all that you just said, why is that a yes?"

2. How many reviews on ECCIE do you think are falsely shaded to paint the interaction in a better light than reality to save face and embarrassment?

3. How many reviews on ECCIE do you think are written by men who's tastes and appetites are wildly different than other men who are looking at the same provider? There are some incredibly well-reviewed providers that are (in my opinion) so hideously distasteful that I don't think I would see them were I a gigolo commanding rates higher than most providers here.

Websites and reviews offer two things:
-a semi-useful description of body-type that is clouded by observer's bias.
-a useful description of menu selections, TCB skills, and professionalism.

They help answer things like, "Is this woman a waste of time?" "Will she NC/NS?" "Is she a clock-watcher?" "Does she up-sell services?"

This is Diamonds and Tuxedos. I DEMAND (whether I get it or not) that providers who bring themselves forth here already be a classy master of those unfortunate questions that should never need to come up in the first place.

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

you unfortunately have the reality of many men who get upset that you're "wasting their time". I've got a review where someone stated that you have to remind me "what you're actually there for". I responded to that with this: Someone recently chose for me to be part of their end of life experience as a paid companion. "What you're actually there for" varies from person to person.

I need the stars to align to meet with a provider. It's not nearly as simple as "If you don't like her, write a no review." A month ago, I got NC/NSed - I prefer multi-hour appointments (because I like to do things other than with my dick), and this was a 4-hour appointment. I have to establish alibis, clear calendar space - I have to be able to disappear from the world for a few hours on a WEEK DAY, which takes a herculean effort of planning and coordination, both personal and professional.

If there is a remote chance that I am going to get NC/NS, it's not worth my effort. If she's not enthusiastic about the prospect of hanging out with me, it's not worth my effort. And to the subject at hand; if I don't know what she LOOKS LIKE, it's not worth my effort.

Let me ask you this - would you pre-pay a non-refundable $600 for a dress located in a store 2 hours away from you, when you had a description of the dress, but didn't know what the dress actually looks like?

Abso-fucking-lutely not. You wouldn't buy that dress without trying it on first, let alone the rest of it - but that's not a safe hobbying discussion, so we'll simply leave it where I started it - I'm not wasting time or money without a reasonable expectation of satisfaction - and by satisfaction, I'm not talking about physical gratification, I'm talking about the actual "feeling" of satisfaction.

One of the meanest hookers on this board has the most gorgeous smile, and if I thought she could sit quietly and demurely and smile at me while making eyes at me without opening her mouth and screeching obscenities, I wouldn't just book an appointment, I would hire her in a professional capacity as a semi-functional assistant JUST for the pleasure of watching her smile.

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

And if women didn't have such pictures [sic] tits and ass [sic], they would lose a good portion of their business. Even the top HDHs have topless photos.

So "classy" and "having my own obligations and life" don't go hand in hand? Some women have children, or are in school, or have sick family. I spend 15 days a month travelling, not everyone has that luxury. Doesn't make me any better than them.

I've argued this at length, so I'll keep it simple: When you only advertise yourself from the neck down, your customers will only be interested in you from the neck down. That's fine; I just don't think it belongs in D&T, where I'd like to find professional courtesans who, not GPS or HDHs who are still part-time hookers with visions of grandeur.

That's what this whole picture thing devolves to: Professional courtesan vs. part time hooker.

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

It's very clear you're new. No one works like that. The price scales down the more you buy. What's $500/hr may only be $4000/day or $7,000/3 days or $10,000/7 days. See how that works? There's incentives to buying more time.

I think if you were to shop around profiles, you would find an alarming number of providers who don't offer package dea...you know what? I changed my mind. Given my shopping around here, I've found that the number of providers who actually *do* offer multi-hour specials, or packages is a tiny, tiny minority.

I'm not counting providers with offers like, "$350 for the first hour, $300 per hour after that" - that's not a multi-hour special. 8 hours later, I'm still $2450 down with an expectation of a tip, and YOU expect me to put my money down in advance and hire that nonsense without knowing what she even looks like.

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

Sorry, but same expectations generally. You're still removing her from her job for X days which is Y dollars lost. You want a discount because you're tired? Classy!

We're back to our basic disconnect. You have the mindset of a part-time hooker with a day job. I'm looking for professional courtesans - who's day job *is* being a companion.

Originally Posted by Missy Mariposa

Now I think you might actually just be trolling. Privacy, discretion. If a woman is ugly, you'll find it in the reviews. I don't really need Joe Blow at the grocery store to recognise me from ECCIE all while I have no idea who he is. I still have the right to a private life, despite being available for public consumption. I've got 16k twitter followers, a blog audience of 6,000 readers a month, and my website...no that's okay. I don't really want or need to show any more of my face than I already do.

Beating a dead horse here...that's fine for you to not show your face. You're selling your tits and ass, which I'm not shopping for. Those are inclusive offerings in what *I* am shopping for, which you don't sell.

You have a right to a private life - as do I. I certainly don't want MY face associated to me in any fashion. I'm relatively well-known (again, both personally and professionally), and common sense would dictate that I hide inside of discreet hotels with a hooker instead of going out and about with them - which requires alibis, cover stories, and elaborate planning; scandal would be ruinous, and I'm flirting with disaster every time.

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That was all aggressive, so let's scale back to the point.

Diamonds and Tuxedos should be for ladies and gentlemen, both of which are in incredibly short supply - and my particular rant is that I'm not willing to make a non-refundable deposit on a garment with no pictures that I have to drive hours to pick up.

[essence]

Some input. TG, in some ways I don't think you are a gentleman. You have said some derogatory words about some ladies (I may agree with you, but I would never say it) and you mustn't confuse being a gentleman with being a snob.

A gentleman is content in any walk of life, and attempts to put any lady at their ease. I happen to like younger ebony ladies, and I like them in jeans and sneakers and a nice top, no make-up. I am not after paint jobs. I am pleased when they enjoy a nice meal rather than churches chicken. If they order fried chicken, I know the relationship will not last.

The most important thing in life is to explore and be open to new pleasures.

So what is a gentleman? Somebody who seeks the best and encourages the best. Who listens, not talks. What is a gentle lady? Somebody who listens and is willing to learn and smiles.

A gentleman also has many different interests.

Anybody who can write hundreds of words on some hooker site is not a gentleman (or lady), far too pre occupied.

I find lovely girls on seeking arrangement, but I tell them up front i am not a sugar daddy, that is a wrong power relationship, and I always meet in public for lunch first. I have found many friendships this way, but I have been very discriminatory.

Sex is only good when it is not first. Friendship comes first. There are many lovely girls who need some help and are willing to be exclusive and affectionate, but every side realises it will not lead to happy families. It is a temporary thing.

Sorry, too many words. I posted some lovely ladies I know on the ebony thread on this forum.

[essence]

ps. diamonds and tuxedos? What has that got to do with class or being a gentleman or lady? Sounds more like tawdry trash to me.

Sensible shoes, thick jumper, headscarf, and a good walk in the rain with the dogs, that makes a country woman. Brings a glow to the thighs.

[Bettie_mae]

The lady has a point.

[Bettie_mae]

Travelinggentleman, would you pass the grey coupon?

You sound very judgmental. This website expects you to post our naughty bits.

Also, you just described class as a totally surface quality. You could dress an ape well and train it to pretend it is a diplomat.

Inside the ape still wants to scratch his ass and reverts to being what he is.

Class is an inner quality. It's self love, Ito's in the way we carry ourselves. Also, class is displayed in the way we treat others.

A lady can be trained to exist well in a different environment. It's not about priviledge and being better than someone else.

Being judgmental, and your writing was pretentious. It was full of ego, a highly unattractive quality. It makes you sound small. Phony. Mean.

If somebody doesn't want to provide me with verification before they come near me, I am classy and value my safety enough to tell him, "No. Thank you. Good day sir."

[Bettie_mae]

Originally Posted by TravelingGentleman

Missy, apologies for my delinquent reply - I've been traveling, then got back and flew a provider to Houston for a week to paint the town red. To your points:



I've said this before - this thread's OP was my very first post on ECCIE. In fact, I created an account on ECCIE solely for the reason of expressing my frustration with the misappropriated language that made it hard to navigate. Disregard the newbie portions - those problems are six months behind me, and hilariously - something almost every newbie complains about.




A few thoughts here.

1. How many reviews on ECCIE do you think give a "yes" recommendation, and have comments on the reviews from other people that say something along the lines of, "Given all that you just said, why is that a yes?"

2. How many reviews on ECCIE do you think are falsely shaded to paint the interaction in a better light than reality to save face and embarrassment?

3. How many reviews on ECCIE do you think are written by men who's tastes and appetites are wildly different than other men who are looking at the same provider? There are some incredibly well-reviewed providers that are (in my opinion) so hideously distasteful that I don't think I would see them were I a gigolo commanding rates higher than most providers here.

Websites and reviews offer two things:
-a semi-useful description of body-type that is clouded by observer's bias.
-a useful description of menu selections, TCB skills, and professionalism.

They help answer things like, "Is this woman a waste of time?" "Will she NC/NS?" "Is she a clock-watcher?" "Does she up-sell services?"

This is Diamonds and Tuxedos. I DEMAND (whether I get it or not) that providers who bring themselves forth here already be a classy master of those unfortunate questions that should never need to come up in the first place.




I need the stars to align to meet with a provider. It's not nearly as simple as "If you don't like her, write a no review." A month ago, I got NC/NSed - I prefer multi-hour appointments (because I like to do things other than with my dick), and this was a 4-hour appointment. I have to establish alibis, clear calendar space - I have to be able to disappear from the world for a few hours on a WEEK DAY, which takes a herculean effort of planning and coordination, both personal and professional.

If there is a remote chance that I am going to get NC/NS, it's not worth my effort. If she's not enthusiastic about the prospect of hanging out with me, it's not worth my effort. And to the subject at hand; if I don't know what she LOOKS LIKE, it's not worth my effort.

Let me ask you this - would you pre-pay a non-refundable $600 for a dress located in a store 2 hours away from you, when you had a description of the dress, but didn't know what the dress actually looks like?

Abso-fucking-lutely not. You wouldn't buy that dress without trying it on first, let alone the rest of it - but that's not a safe hobbying discussion, so we'll simply leave it where I started it - I'm not wasting time or money without a reasonable expectation of satisfaction - and by satisfaction, I'm not talking about physical gratification, I'm talking about the actual "feeling" of satisfaction.

One of the meanest hookers on this board has the most gorgeous smile, and if I thought she could sit quietly and demurely and smile at me while making eyes at me without opening her mouth and screeching obscenities, I wouldn't just book an appointment, I would hire her in a professional capacity as a semi-functional assistant JUST for the pleasure of watching her smile.




I've argued this at length, so I'll keep it simple: When you only advertise yourself from the neck down, your customers will only be interested in you from the neck down. That's fine; I just don't think it belongs in D&T, where I'd like to find professional courtesans who, not GPS or HDHs who are still part-time hookers with visions of grandeur.

That's what this whole picture thing devolves to: Professional courtesan vs. part time hooker.




I think if you were to shop around profiles, you would find an alarming number of providers who don't offer package dea...you know what? I changed my mind. Given my shopping around here, I've found that the number of providers who actually *do* offer multi-hour specials, or packages is a tiny, tiny minority.

I'm not counting providers with offers like, "$350 for the first hour, $300 per hour after that" - that's not a multi-hour special. 8 hours later, I'm still $2450 down with an expectation of a tip, and YOU expect me to put my money down in advance and hire that nonsense without knowing what she even looks like.




We're back to our basic disconnect. You have the mindset of a part-time hooker with a day job. I'm looking for professional courtesans - who's day job *is* being a companion.




Beating a dead horse here...that's fine for you to not show your face. You're selling your tits and ass, which I'm not shopping for. Those are inclusive offerings in what *I* am shopping for, which you don't sell.

You have a right to a private life - as do I. I certainly don't want MY face associated to me in any fashion. I'm relatively well-known (again, both personally and professionally), and common sense would dictate that I hide inside of discreet hotels with a hooker instead of going out and about with them - which requires alibis, cover stories, and elaborate planning; scandal would be ruinous, and I'm flirting with disaster every time.

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--------------

That was all aggressive, so let's scale back to the point.

Diamonds and Tuxedos should be for ladies and gentlemen, both of which are in incredibly short supply - and my particular rant is that I'm not willing to make a non-refundable deposit on a garment with no pictures that I have to drive hours to pick up.

Once again he demands.... there are other upscale communities online that train escorts how to walk talk dress and be high dollar. Why is he griping here? How do we learn skills to adapt to and succeed the loftier escort realm?

"Travelinggentleman" is confused. Instead of assisting ladies here with what they can do to become a more sophisticated escort meeting his DEMANDS.

He's pretty much ranting about how unclassy he thinks we are. He doesn't want to see our lovely tits and asses. Who doesn't like asses and breasts? He doesn't respect us enough to make us feel comfortable and safe by going through verification. And he wants us posed full face exposure in expensive evening wear.

No class. Thumbs down

I'm out.

[TravelingGentleman]

Originally Posted by Bettie_mae

He's pretty much ranting about how unclassy he thinks we are. He doesn't want to see our lovely tits and asses. Who doesn't like asses and breasts? He doesn't respect us enough to make us feel comfortable and safe by going through verification. And he wants us posed full face exposure in expensive evening wear.

No class. Thumbs down

I'm out.

If that's all you got from this, I agree with you on the "No class" comment. As I said in my OP, a graduate degree isn't required, but basic literacy is.

Don't let the door hit you on the way out.

[TravelingGentleman]

Originally Posted by essence

I find lovely girls on seeking arrangement, but I tell them up front i am not a sugar daddy, that is a wrong power relationship, and I always meet in public for lunch first. I have found many friendships this way, but I have been very discriminatory.

I briefly tried SA, and a few other sites - but they're not a good fit for a myriad of reasons, not least among them the prevalence of bots.

Here's an interesting read on the breakdown of actual users vs. chatbots and fembots on Ashley Madison - Reading Linky. I haven't seen better results at SA or elsewhere...so here we are on ECCIE.

Originally Posted by essence

ps. diamonds and tuxedos? What has that got to do with class or being a gentleman or lady? Sounds more like tawdry trash to me.

Really? This is the one sub-forum on ECCIE that gets a shake at conversations about glitz, glamour, and chatter about refined living. It is not a contextual fallacy to expect a forum named "Diamonds and Tuxedos" to be populated by the courtesan elite, nor their patrons.

Calling me names offends me not. I am not here to please you, befriend you, make your acquaintance, or impress you - your opinion has zero value to me. You're neither a stunning succubus whose attention I seek, nor a provider, nor an active reviewer, and scrolling through the 79 pages of your presence here on ECCIE...not noteworthy. What I *AM* here for is to find the courtesan elite, then to hire them, enjoy their companionship, and probably drink $300 wine while getting paired massages and gossiping about what a bunch of "tawdry trash" is around here.

And that that WIP mission has been quite successful - and promises to continue to be.

[essence]

Class is not about glitz.
Class is not about glamour.
Class is not about chatter.
Class is not about refined living.
Class is not about $300 bottles of wine.
Class is not about bitching how superior you are to others here.

The above is all about tawdry trash.

I gave up hourly escorts some time ago, although I had plenty of reviews on ASPD.

I think the reason you don't find classy ladies is because you have absolutely no class yourself.

Remember, a true gentleman is found in his garden, and is often mistaken for the gardener.

I think I remember a put down a few years ago 'do you know, he had to buy his own furniture'. I think it was about Clarke. No, it was the other way round.

http://news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/uk_politics/441028.stm

But I would never call Alan Clarke classy. Complete bounder.

Don't y'all love a heated debate!

[essence]

ps., I have an advantage in that I live in London mainly, where there is an abundance of charming beautiful girls from all over the world. But of those on SA:

- nine out of ten are not my type.
- of those, nine out of ten are not attractive or too old.
- of those, nine out of ten are obvious gold diggers (princess or GP syndrome).
- of those, five out of ten can't seem to make an arrangement to meet.
- of those, five out of ten rule themselves out by inability to engage in a text or telephone discussion, or their voice irritates.
- of those, five out of ten rule themselves out after a short lunch or coffee meeting. Maybe because they want to be kept, or have no job or don't study, or because their monthly desires (monetary) are too high. Maybe they are virgins and not sure what they want, or maybe they are clear they don't want sex, or want to wait 6 months. I am happy to wait a month, but not six.
- of the remainder, we have a great time and become friends. Sometimes after a couple more public meetings.

So, it can take a few months. Funnily enough, I have been talking to a girl since June, we still haven't slept together, mainly because of logistics, but we will soon.