Possible Ebola case in NY City?

[WTF]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

You still haven't answered my question about taking a blood donation from any of the exposed people before they started showing symptoms.

Because it is only contagious once you can see symptoms, right?

If that how you think it is going to spread....blood transfusions? Do you understand just what a stretch you are having to grasp for?

You will not even take my bet that the doctor's girlfriend does not have Ebola.

Now you want me to answer some fantasy question about blood transfusion? Jesus NY'er you are better that that. Just admit this Ebola bullshit was way over blown, you got caught up in the hysteria and you've read up on this shit in reputable papers and realize you had been had.

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

First of all Ebola isn't just a virus that floats around in your system and just makes you sick. It damages tissue. If you or anyone else thinks that the so called treatment ZMAPP influences the body to produce antibodies to the virus to the extent that a blood transfusion into a person already suffering with Ebola will suffice as a treatment is simply dreaming, it just doesn't work that way. If you want to believe these Ebola patients are all legit go right ahead and do that. I know better. If they start pushing a vaccine for this virus and you opt to take it, the only thing I can say is good luck to ya.

You don't know anything except what you read on paranoid websites.

Ebola damages tissue. True. If it is left untreated long enough. But if you treat it right away, you can minimize the tissue damage and therefore the bleeding and therefore the weight loss. It is all connected.

The whole POINT of the transfusions and the donated antibodies is to knock the population of the viruses down to small numbers while your own body develops antibodies.

Did you not watch that video?

Can you cite ANYTHING that indicates that a blood transfusion from Brantley or any other survivor will NOT help fight the disease? Where do you come up with your assertions?

I remember hearing about the benefits of donations from people who had antibodies to various diseases when I was a kid - about 35-40 years ago. Was that part of the plot, too?

And what does this mean"

"If they start pushing a vaccine for this virus and you opt to take it, the only thing I can say is good luck to ya"

SPELL IT OUT. What exactly do you think will happen to us if we get a vaccine?

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WTF

If that how you think it is going to spread....blood transfusions? Do you understand just what a stretch you are having to grasp for?

No. I don't explain it to me.

You said that no one can spread the disease until they start to show symptoms - coughing, sneezing, fever, etc.

I called bullshit.

I said you can get it from bodily fluids before that. And clearly I am right. The disease can take up to 3 weeks to develop symptoms. But during that whole incubation period, the victim has Ebola viruses replicating in his blood. It is not until the virus population is large enough that the symptoms show.

So, if the virus is in the blood, and the blood is donated, what do you think will happen to the recipient?

Don't argue. You KNOW the recipient will get it too.

So the next question is, what about other bodily fluids that are exchanged prior to symptoms showing? Is it really a stretch to imagine that saliva and semen can transmit the virus before symptoms show up.

I have no idea whether or not the doctor and his GF had sex after he got back from Africa or, if they did, whether or not they used condoms. That is why I don't make any predictions about it.

Unlike you, who is giving guarantees.

If you are right, it is only by chance and the odds are probably in your favor since they might have used condoms, or she did not have any skins cuts or nicks, or they refrained from sex.

But you can't possible guarantee that. Some Ebola patient in Africa has probably already gotten it from a sex partner who wasn't showing symptoms yet. But we won't ever know that unless we get very lucky and learn all of the tracing contacts of that patient.

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by WTF

Just admit this Ebola bullshit was way over blown, you got caught up in the hysteria and you've read up on this shit in reputable papers and realize you had been had.

No, I never got caught up in the hysteria. I never thought this would break out in a US epidemic.

I posted the original US case links because I have been following it for months and am fascinated by the whole process.

But that doesn't mean I think the sky is falling. Don't confuse me with others posting in this thread.

That said, I do believe that we should have a limited travel ban from the affected West African countries to the US. We can send troops and medical personnel there and bring them back, but they cannot send people here, either for business or pleasure.

Eric Duncan got two people seriously sick and cost the US God only knows how much money because he wanted to see his GF and set up his wedding.

You know what? He could have stayed in Africa another few months until the epidemic breaks.

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

You don't know anything except what you read on paranoid websites.

Ebola damages tissue. True. If it is left untreated long enough. But if you treat it right away, you can minimize the tissue damage and therefore the bleeding and therefore the weight loss. It is all connected.

The whole POINT of the transfusions and the donated antibodies is to knock the population of the viruses down to small numbers while your own body develops antibodies.

Did you not watch that video?

Can you cite ANYTHING that indicates that a blood transfusion from Brantley or any other survivor will NOT help fight the disease? Where do you come up with your assertions?

I remember hearing about the benefits of donations from people who had antibodies to various diseases when I was a kid - about 35-40 years ago. Was that part of the plot, too?

And what does this mean"

"If they start pushing a vaccine for this virus and you opt to take it, the only thing I can say is good luck to ya"

SPELL IT OUT. What exactly do you think will happen to us if we get a vaccine?

I am not the one reading paranoid web sites. I think that claim belongs to you. First of all, you don't find it just a bit strange that in the last thirty eight years that this disease has been on record that the only incidents have been in four countries in West Africa. Liberia, Democratic Rep of Congo, Ghana, and Sierra Leone. No place else up until this year and with a huge spike in the incidents of this disease. Diseases don't have much incentive to mutate when the incident rate is low, the survival rate is relatively low and treatment is very basic. Now they have a serum that wasn't tested on humans until Dr. Brantley came along. Iam not buying this shit. As far as the vaccine. It takes a long time to perfect vaccines. To develop a vaccine to combat a disease you have to know a lot about the action of that disease. Since Ebola isn't endemic to America and other western Countries nobody is going to get me to believe they've put time and research into developing a reputable vaccine for the American population to prevent the spread of Ebola. If a vaccine is announced in the very near future the people who take it will most likely become very ill.

Jim

[gnadfly]

Originally Posted by WTF

Let's hope they don't get like you.

In fact you have a better chance of catching HIV after Magic but ducks you than I would of catching Ebola fucking the doctor's girlfriend is she were not symptomatic.

Piss into the wind harder and perhaps the blowback will miss you!



Really! Keep trying!



DUMBASS!

[Guest032516]

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

I am not the one reading paranoid web sites. I think that claim belongs to you.

Really? Name one that I read. I'm not the one spreading vaccine hysteria. That would be you. And Jenny McCarthy. See my point?

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

First of all, you don't find it just a bit strange that in the last thirty eight years that this disease has been on record that the only incidents have been in four countries in West Africa. Liberia, Democratic Rep of Congo, Ghana, and Sierra Leone. No place else up until this year and with a huge spike in the incidents of this disease.

Where do you get four? Look at the locations of outbreaks in this list:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ebola_outbreaks

Four of the viruses on this list cause Ebola disease (all except REST). So there are at least seven countries before the current outbreak, even if you discount the lab contamination cases.

And the huge spike can be attributed to increases populations and the arrival of mass transit in places that never had it before. In past years, there wasn't nearly as much mobility of populations in Africa. More intermingling of people means more incidents of disease. What is so difficult to understand about that?

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

Diseases don't have much incentive to mutate when the incident rate is low, the survival rate is relatively low and treatment is very basic.

Who says it has mutated? As I said above, maybe we are seeing more incidents of disease because of increased mobility of the population.

Incentive? What does that mean? Evolution doesn't need incentive. Mutations just happen. Some mutations will help a species survive in response to external pressure (adaptation). Others will not.

Flu viruses mutate EVERY year. The vaccines that are grown in eggs every flu season are the best guesses by the epidemiologists about what we will be hit with next. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

Now they have a serum that wasn't tested on humans until Dr. Brantley came along. I am not buying this shit.

And do you know why it wasn't tested? How do you get volunteers? And how often are there Ebola outbreaks? You don't get them every year. You get them only once every several years of so.

ZMAPP was tried on Brantley because they had NO CHOICE. If the odds of you dying are 60-70%, what do you have to lose by taking the antivirus.

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

To develop a vaccine to combat a disease you have to know a lot about the action of that disease.

They haven't developed a vaccine - not yet. The treatment they have got slows the disease down to allow your body to develop its own resistance. It blocks the receptors on the virus that allow it to attach to and penetrate blood cells.

A REAL vaccine will allow you to develop antibodies without actually getting the disease.

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

To develop a vaccine to combat a disease you have to know a lot about the action of that disease. Since Ebola isn't endemic to America and other western Countries nobody is going to get me to believe they've put time and research into developing a reputable vaccine for the American population to prevent the spread of Ebola.

Why won't "they" get you to believe it? Because you are ignorant and stubborn?

Medical researchers frrm many countries - not just the US - have been studying Ebola and other diseases (dengue fever, Hanta, etc.) for decades. Why don't you think they would not study it just because it is in Africa.

They/we don't have to look for cures for African disease for any altruistic reasons. We can do so for perfectly selfish ones. Any disease that occurs in Africa will eventually spread everywhere else.

Why wait for it to hit the US before you start looking for a cure? That would be just dumb. A decent sense of self-preservation would cause us to look for a cure before it reached us.

Your logic is ridiculous.

[Guest032516]

Well, the NY doctor lied:

http://nypost.com/2014/10/29/ebola-d...ravels-police/

The doctor lied about where he had been until the cops tracked his movements on his subway fare card.

Key quote:
--------------------------------------
The city’s first Ebola patient initially lied to authorities about his travels around the city following his return from treating disease victims in Africa, law-enforcement sources said.
Dr. Craig Spencer at first told officials that he isolated himself in his Harlem apartment — and didn’t admit he rode the subways, dined out and went bowling until cops looked at his MetroCard the sources said.
“He told the authorities that he self-quarantined. Detectives then reviewed his credit-card statement and MetroCard and found that he went over here, over there, up and down and all around,” a source said.
--------------------------------------


So, there is the question:

How do we do contact tracing to try to warn people who were possibly exposed if even the doctors who are supposed to know better are lying?

I can understand why an African villager who lives under a corrupt dictator might lie, but what it this asshat's excuse?

Most likely, he KNEW it would look bad if the word got out that he had gone bowling and eaten in restaurants within a week of treating Ebola patients.

So he lied to avoid public condemnation.

But he could have foreseen that before he ever left his apartment to go bowling or ride the subway.

So he did it anyway. Which tells me that he was convinced in his own mind that he did everything right and could not possibly have the disease.

He put his personal enjoyment and entertainment ahead of public safety because his ego convinced him he had done everything perfectly.

A sense of humility about his own capabilities would have made him stay home.

What do you expect from a doctor?

[Mr MojoRisin]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

Really? Name one that I read. I'm not the one spreading vaccine hysteria. That would be you. And Jenny McCarthy. See my point?


Where do you get four? Look at the locations of outbreaks in this list:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Ebola_outbreaks

Four of the viruses on this list cause Ebola disease (all except REST). So there are at least seven countries before the current outbreak, even if you discount the lab contamination cases.

And the huge spike can be attributed to increases populations and the arrival of mass transit in places that never had it before. In past years, there wasn't nearly as much mobility of populations in Africa. More intermingling of people means more incidents of disease. What is so difficult to understand about that?


Who says it has mutated? As I said above, maybe we are seeing more incidents of disease because of increased mobility of the population.

Incentive? What does that mean? Evolution doesn't need incentive. Mutations just happen. Some mutations will help a species survive in response to external pressure (adaptation). Others will not.

Flu viruses mutate EVERY year. The vaccines that are grown in eggs every flu season are the best guesses by the epidemiologists about what we will be hit with next. Sometimes it works, sometimes it doesn't.


And do you know why it wasn't tested? How do you get volunteers? And how often are there Ebola outbreaks? You don't get them every year. You get them only once every several years of so.

ZMAPP was tried on Brantley because they had NO CHOICE. If the odds of you dying are 60-70%, what do you have to lose by taking the antivirus.


They haven't developed a vaccine - not yet. The treatment they have got slows the disease down to allow your body to develop its own resistance. It blocks the receptors on the virus that allow it to attach to and penetrate blood cells.

A REAL vaccine will allow you to develop antibodies without actually getting the disease.


Why won't "they" get you to believe it? Because you are ignorant and stubborn?

Medical researchers frrm many countries - not just the US - have been studying Ebola and other diseases (dengue fever, Hanta, etc.) for decades. Why don't you think they would not study it just because it is in Africa.

They/we don't have to look for cures for African disease for any altruistic reasons. We can do so for perfectly selfish ones. Any disease that occurs in Africa will eventually spread everywhere else.

Why wait for it to hit the US before you start looking for a cure? That would be just dumb. A decent sense of self-preservation would cause us to look for a cure before it reached us.

Your logic is ridiculous.

You're trying to tote yourself as the expert here cause you've done a little research. Well your research is a bit flawed and your knowledge beforehand on infectious diseases is quite limited. If you can't see the hype in this Ebola outbreak maybe it's you who is ignorant and stubborn.


Jim

[WTF]

Originally Posted by ExNYer

No. I don't explain it to me.

You said that no one can spread the disease until they start to show symptoms - coughing, sneezing, fever, etc.

I called bullshit.

I said you can get it from bodily fluids before that. And clearly I am right. The disease can take up to 3 weeks to develop symptoms. But during that whole incubation period, the victim has Ebola viruses replicating in his blood. It is not until the virus population is large enough that the symptoms show.

So, if the virus is in the blood, and the blood is donated, what do you think will happen to the recipient?

Don't argue. You KNOW the recipient will get it too.

.

Please show me a place on earth where Ebola patients are giving blood.

Jesus H Christ you can get shocked by sticking your finger in a light socket , anybody dumb enough to do so deserves to get shocked.

Originally Posted by ExNYer

So the next question is, what about other bodily fluids that are exchanged prior to symptoms showing? Is it really a stretch to imagine that saliva and semen can transmit the virus before symptoms show up.

I have no idea whether or not the doctor and his GF had sex after he got back from Africa or, if they did, whether or not they used condoms. That is why I don't make any predictions about it.

Unlike you, who is giving guarantees.

If you are right, it is only by chance and the odds are probably in your favor since they might have used condoms, or she did not have any skins cuts or nicks, or they refrained from sex.

But you can't possible guarantee that. Some Ebola patient in Africa has probably already gotten it from a sex partner who wasn't showing symptoms yet. But we won't ever know that unless we get very lucky and learn all of the tracing contacts of that patient.

I am making bets based on probabilities. The probability being very low that the doctors girlfriend has Ebola.

You can not guarantee that you will be alive to see the sun rise tomorrow but you can do the next best thing , which is make an educated guess(bet) on the matter. That is all I am doing. If I'm wrong , I'll pay up if anyone will make me that bet.

Originally Posted by Mr MojoRisin

. If you can't see the hype in this Ebola outbreak maybe it's you who is ignorant and stubborn.


Jim

exNYer....I gotta agree with Jim on this one. This thing has been over hyped.

[Jewish Lawyer]

Originally Posted by WTF

Hey shit for brains...i never claimed to be an expert. I said I have read enough to be willing to bet you 5k that the doctor's girlfriend will not come down with Ebola.

How fucking hard is that to understand? If I do not know caca about Ebola then bet me. Should be an easy win for you. Or do you agree with me that the girl will not come down with it? Sounds like you and lustylad agree with me.



.

I advise against making any bets with WTFagboy - he lost a bet to me and didn't pay up!
(This was concerning the outcome of the Zimmerman trial - I bet that the white Mexican was not guilty)

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Jewish Lawyer

I advise against making any bets with WTFagboy - he lost a bet to me and didn't pay up!
(This was concerning the outcome of the Zimmerman trial - I bet that the white Mexican was not guilty)

You lying sack of caca....You asked me to go pay your bet at the Holocaust Museum. I paid it under ''Slave fucking Jewish Lawyer''.

Hell I will pay it again if you pm me your name.

[Jewish Lawyer]

Originally Posted by WTF

You lying sack of caca....You asked me to go pay your bet at the Holocaust Museum. I paid it under ''Slave fucking Jewish Lawyer''.

Hell I will pay it again if you pm me your name.

WTFagboy, why do you lie?
I checked the donor rolls - no one by that name is listed.

[Yssup Rider]

Originally Posted by Jewish Lawyer

I advise against making any bets with WTFagboy - he lost a bet to me and didn't pay up!
(This was concerning the outcome of the Zimmerman trial - I bet that the white Mexican was not guilty)

And you stood me up at Love Field TWICE, Fraud Flintstone!

[WTF]

Originally Posted by Jewish Lawyer

WTFagboy, why do you lie?
I checked the donor rolls - no one by that name is listed.

If you don't believe me send me your address and I'll pay you again!


btw...what is the Ebola count up to in this country?