Trump says Ukraine started the war

[1blackman1]

Trump and MAGA think Ukraine should have surrendered to Russia rather than fight for their continued independence.

What idiots Trump and MAGA folks are.

[CPT Savajo]

It started on Obama's watch in 2014 when Russia took Crimea. The war is clearly not going well for Ukraine as they cannot take back the land they've lost. What's even sadder is that conservatively 1.7 million poor souls have perished so that rich people can split up resources to enrich themselves. The war could have been avoided but puppets don't think rationally.

[The_Waco_Kid]

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Trump and MAGA think Ukraine should have surrendered to Russia rather than fight for their continued independence.

What idiots Trump and MAGA folks are.

got anything to back up this?


you might want to consider what happened in 2014 where Ukraine agreed to a referendum for the Donbas to join Russia. this was before Zelenskyy and with a known pro-Russia president. the Donbas identifies as Russian and would have voted overwhelmingly to join Russia. the leftist media will tell you it was the Russians who prevented any cease fire for a vote but that isn't so simple when you consider Ukraine had everything to lose .. the Donbas, to Russia. so who had the real incentive to keep the scrimmages going? Zelenskyy and Ukraine.


to say this conflict is entirely on Russia is to ignore the history of the region and American/NATO promises we reneged on to get us here in the first place.

[bb1961]

He started this thread with nothing to back up his claim...it called trolling...

[Jacuzzme]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

got anything to back up this?


you might want to consider what happened in 2014 where Ukraine agreed to a referendum for the Donbas to join Russia. this was before Zelenskyy and with a known pro-Russia president. the Donbas identifies as Russian and would have voted overwhelmingly to join Russia. the leftist media will tell you it was the Russians who prevented any cease fire for a vote but that isn't so simple when you consider Ukraine had everything to lose .. the Donbas, to Russia. so who had the real incentive to keep the scrimmages going? Zelenskyy and Ukraine.


to say this conflict is entirely on Russia is to ignore the history of the region and American/NATO promises we reneged on to get us here in the first place.

100% this. The American government does not want, and has fought with every available resource to obstruct, the Ukrainian people’s right to self determination.

[Lucas McCain]

Can any of you Trump jock sniffers follow a topic without going all over the damn place when VP Trump is mentioned in a negative light?

The topic is basically stupid ass Trump placing blame on Ukraine for their war and its continuation. That is the damn topic.

If someone breaks into your damn house to take it, would you broker a deal to give them a valuable part of it so that they will leave, or would you try to blow their fucking head off to make them leave even though they are stronger than you? According to Trump, you should negotiate with those unwanted and uninvited intruders.

https://www.bbc.com/news/articles/cd0n5e1pdz9o

Donald Trump has taken aim at Ukraine after its president, Volodymyr Zelensky, said it was a "surprise" that his country was not invited to peace talks in Saudi Arabia to end the Ukraine war.

Trump said he was "disappointed" by Ukraine's reaction and appeared to blame Ukraine for starting the war - saying the country "could have made a deal".

The war in Ukraine was sparked by a full-scale Russian invasion almost three years ago.



By the way, he is also filmed talking about this. I just wanted to give an FYI before some of you old Trump loving simpletons try to discredit the source of the link I provided.

[RX792P]

Originally Posted by bb1961

He started this thread with nothing to back up his claim...it called trolling...

Well, there is what Donald Trump said regarding Zelensky and the Ukraine war.

“You should have never started it. You could have made a deal. I could have made a deal for Ukraine that would have given them almost all of the land, and no people would have been killed, and no city would have been demolished and not one dome would have been knocked down. But they chose not to do it that way.”

[Salty Again]

Originally Posted by The_Waco_Kid

got anything to back up this?


you might want to consider what happened in 2014 where Ukraine agreed to a referendum for the Donbas to join Russia. this was before Zelenskyy and with a known pro-Russia president. the Donbas identifies as Russian and would have voted overwhelmingly to join Russia. the leftist media will tell you it was the Russians who prevented any cease fire for a vote but that isn't so simple when you consider Ukraine had everything to lose .. the Donbas, to Russia. so who had the real incentive to keep the scrimmages going? Zelenskyy and Ukraine.


to say this conflict is entirely on Russia is to ignore the history of the region and American/NATO promises we reneged on to get us here in the first place.

... And not to mention all the MONEY $$$$ the war
has cost the United States... As it went on and on and on...

##### Salty

[HDGristle]

I love the Donbas referendum bullshit spewed ny the usual suspects.

Like Donnyboy you know the ink was still wet on the rubles to pay for those talking points. From the irregularities to the utter lack of international recognition, not to mention failing to follow the Ukrainian constitution.

But by all means let's ignore that. Donny did. And the U.S and U.K. agreed to protect Ukraine far before those referendums in exchange for their nukes.

[biomed1]

To Return to, and Remain on the Original Topic . . .

#6 - Respect the topics presented by those who start a thread. Attempts to derail a thread or change it's direction is referred to as thread hijack and will be discouraged. Attempts to guide a thread in the right direction are appreciated, while responses to posts which hijack a thread are not.

[1blackman1]

For those Trumpys that remain uninformed. Trump talking about Ukraine said that they had 3 years to end the war and “never should have started it.” His actual words. Not implication. He said that Ukraine should have never started the war.

Im not surprised that the likes of Salty, BB, Cuzzi and Waco would be spouting Russian propaganda and misinformation.

[Jacuzzme]

Only misinformation is from those whose historical perspective began last week.

[Tiny]

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Trump says Ukraine started the war

Trump actually said Ukraine "never should have started it." It's hard to know what that means. As is often the case for elderly people who are declining, he's hard to understand, unless expressing something simple, like "I wet my pants."

I agree, Ukraine did not start the war. There's a case to be made though that politicians, military leaders, and diplomats in the West created conditions that led to war. For enlightenment, read this piece from the National Security Archive at George Washington University, which predates 2022:

https://nsarchive.gwu.edu/briefing-b...-leaders-early

Originally Posted by 1blackman1

Trump and MAGA think Ukraine should have surrendered to Russia rather than fight for their continued independence.

What idiots Trump and MAGA folks are.

I don't think that's what he/they mean. Russia and Ukraine almost settled this in April, 2022. They had an agreement but at the last minute, Russia wanted veto power over the West sending troops into Ukraine in the event of a future invasion. If the two sides had kept talking, they might have come to an agreement early on.

Except for small gains Russia has been making in recent months, the front lines in this war haven't moved since November of 2022. It's like World War I trench warfare, with tens of thousands of people dying. If Ukraine had been willing to give up the territory occupied by Russia, perhaps a peace agreement could have been negotiated. You may say that's not right or fair, but the reality is that Ukraine is not going to win this war. That would require NATO troops. And would assume Russia doesn't get medieval. If the Russians were to start targeting civilians like the USA and Britain did at Dresden or Hiroshima, this war would come to an end in a hurry, with a Russian victory. If its back is to a wall, then Russia probably would do that, and NATO wouldn't do anything to stop it.

Something like this was probably going through Trump's mind, but given his diminished mental capacity, he wasn't able to express it.

[1blackman1]

You give Trump too much credit. Always the rightie pleaser you are. Trump listens to Russian propaganda and like many on the right and Tulsi, believe that and repeat it. You are close to that in the past year sadly.

Trump and Trumpys repeat the Russian company line over and over. The fact is that Russia invaded. Ukraine has no incentive to do anything except continuing to fight. Russia needs an off-ramp but doesn’t want to lose anything they’ve gained. It’s a stalemate for them that’s far more costly than it is for Ukraine.

Were Ukraine to make any deal with Russia, there’s zero assurance Russia would abide it once they’ve gotten the benefit of the deal - time to recuperate and lifting of sanctions. We’d revisit this in a few years. Ukraine knows that without actual protection from NATO there’s nothing to keep Russia from returning. Trump is a simpleton and actually believes Putin, which no other world leader would do.

Don’t be a Trumpy Tiny. You’re better than that, kinda, or at least slightly.

[Salty Again]

Originally Posted by RX792P

Well, there is what Donald Trump said regarding Zelensky and the Ukraine war.

Hmmmmm... Ok, maybe that is what 1blackman1 meant.
Fair enough.

... Still not sure what the issue is and why we're
all havin' a barney about it.

##### Salty