Grade inflation

[oden]

Does it worry anyone else that in our High Schools and Universities that more A's and B's are given out than any other grades ? It is more prominent in our "Elite" Universities than anywhere. AP has replaced College Prep and if you are in many Gifted and Talented programs in many school districts you cannot qualify for quality State Schools.

On top of that, our immigration policy, or lack thereof, is favoring illiterate manual laborers as opposed to gifted individuals that could keep us supplied with the innovation and entrepreneurial spirit that drove this country to be the pinnacle of civilization.

We have some great schools on all levels but it seems that the trend is to dumb down our education at the expense of our great minds to be in the name of political correctness.

[atlcomedy]

I'm really less worried about the fancy names for programs and "grade inflation" and more concerned with the overall quality of education.

A real simple way to fix this would be to standardize grading systems and definitions...but of course this would cede local control over education to the Feds, which I don't support.

For the most part I think admissions directors and employers do a pretty good job of sifting thru all the bullshit and calibrating candidates.

That said, the message to parents out there should be to get calibrated with current standards yourself so you can steer your children appropriately. Competition is fierce. What was "good enough" in your day to get into/get a scholarship to/etc/ probably isn't.

[atlcomedy]

Some of the verbage is kind of funny though....

I have a niece that is younger than 2 that is enrolled in "Early Childhood Education for the Exceptional and Gifted"

It is over-priced daycare for God's sake...but it sounds damn important

[Marcus Aurelius]

I believe that it started in the early 60's.
Dumb down the middle class.
Humanist teaching. Model a citizen over education.

[Laurentius]

I've been in college from the age of 14 to the present in various combinations of student, teacher, etc. I know the environment well.

Let me give you a real-life example of grade inflation from a class I took a couple of years ago.

In this class, grades were assigned based on a group project. The instructor gave me two partners -- one of whom was a lazy bum and the other was functionally illiterate. Literally.

Obviously, I wanted a good grade so I did the projects. Got an A. So did the lazy bum and the functional illiterate.

If you have ever wondered how absolute idiots end up with paper on their walls, that's one way that it is done.

In Massachusetts, graduates with BS degrees from their teaching programs have to take a test to make sure they are sufficiently competent to be teachers.

The test requires a TENTH GRADE level of reading/writing proficiency. Every year, at least a THIRD of these COLLEGE GRADUATES flunk the 10th grade reading/writing.

It's a disgrace.

[OneHotMale]

Originally Posted by atlcomedy

Some of the verbage is kind of funny though....

I have a niece that is younger than 2 that is enrolled in "Early Childhood Education for the Exceptional and Gifted"

It is over-priced daycare for God's sake...but it sounds damn important

She must be enrolled in the WTF School of links.

[charlestudor2005]

Well, when I was in school, the bell curve was in vogue. What idiocy!!! It discounted the fact that all students could get A's or fail.

I think standardized tests don't test anything except the ability to take a standardized test. For instance, I test poorly on standardized tests, while my brother tests very well. And they are still multiple guess tests.

Because we have gone to standardized tests and to "No child left behind" tests (another standardized test), no child learns to think analytically any longer. Teachers teach only to the test. Instead of being able to write a paragraph on why an Italian ship captain worked for a Spanish monarch in trying to find the Orient, and instead finding a "New World," the kids are asked what year the new world was discovered. (Hint: Columbus in 1492).

It is why some countries' students are outpacing our students in education. But, most of those countries don't offer education to all students, just those that excel.

So, I guess the question is: should we do that in the U.S.?

[Guest0812112]

Originally Posted by Marcus Aurelius

I believe that it started in the early 60's.
Dumb down the middle class.
Humanist teaching. Model a citizen over education.

I know in some poster's opinions I'm way to young to have any viable input on this subject, but for the biggest part is not the math, english, science, history and other fundamental courses the same as they were 10-20-??? years ago. If so why are the students having such a hard time getting a grip on what was standard for previous generations. Are we on a path that has been and is being followed by many third world countrys as well as some with goverments of a type other than a democratic form of rule. You know those places that believe keep the masses uneducated their easier to control?

[Guest050715-1]

Originally Posted by chelsea simms

......... If so why are the students having such a hard time getting a grip on what was standard for previous generations........

Because the schools assign ridiculous amounts of homework half of which is busy work that really accomplishes nothing just so they can demonstrate they are doing something or to encourage sometimes non-existent family interaction. Parents end up doing the “projects” or whatever just so the kids can get into bed before 10:00. The projects assigned to my child had scopes of work that were far beyond the ability of the children to do alone or at all.

I kid you not, when my child was in the third grade, she had three to four hours of homework EVERYDAY! Myself and many other parents had to meet with her principal to get some of the homework reduced so we could either have lives with our kids or let them stay up late.

That and schools are literally stopping regular sensible, curriculum education to study and take practice tests a month before the state’s standardized test. It’s madding to have a teacher write when your child is making A’s and B’s and with tips on how to take a standarized test and be told they are about to fail the 4th grade. It’s nonsense.

When I was a child we had several layers of difficulty for any given grade: accelerated classes, regular classes and remedial classes. There was also latitude for strong and weak areas. I remember, many of the kids went to Reading Classes to get help with their reading. I went to Math lab because I didn’t get it. This way teachers, knew who they were teaching. Now there is just GT classes with no room for error and the masses are stuck together.

[charlestudor2005]

Originally Posted by chelsea simms

I know in some poster's opinions I'm way to young to have any viable input on this subject, but for the biggest part is not the math, english, science, history and other fundamental courses the same as they were 10-20-??? years ago. If so why are the students having such a hard time getting a grip on what was standard for previous generations. Are we on a path that has been and is being followed by many third world countrys as well as some with goverments of a type other than a democratic form of rule. You know those places that believe keep the masses uneducated their easier to control?

In some ways it is the same, in other ways, quite different. The algebra I had in 11th grade is now taught in 9th. The "current" history I studied (the 60s) is now seen through quite a different lens a generation later. When I studied WWII, it was the previous generation. Now, it is 2 generations ago. There is much more history, and quite a few more lenses to look through. Just look at the thread about Texas (http://eccie.net/showthread.php?t=41418) and the discussion of Texas controlling student textbooks therein.

Yes, there is still the basic reading, 'riting, and 'rithmatic. The problem is that students now misunderstand reading and writing because of texting. And arithmetic has become more advanced. Like I said, in some ways the same, in some, quite different.

[Mr. Smith111]

There is a big push for all kids to get advanced in math, but what
happens is they move past there level . If a kid can't add or subtract
you can't teach them algebra. There are alot of other problems,
that's just one I've seen several times.

[discreetgent]

Originally Posted by charlestudor2005

In some ways it is the same, in other ways, quite different. The algebra I had in 11th grade is now taught in 9th. The "current" history I studied (the 60s) is now seen through quite a different lens a generation later. When I studied WWII, it was the previous generation. Now, it is 2 generations ago. There is much more history, and quite a few more lenses to look through. Just look at the thread about Texas (http://eccie.net/showthread.php?t=41418) and the discussion of Texas controlling student textbooks therein.

Yes, there is still the basic reading, 'riting, and 'rithmatic. The problem is that students now misunderstand reading and writing because of texting. And arithmetic has become more advanced. Like I said, in some ways the same, in some, quite different.

It goes further than that. In many schools reading is now taught in kindergarten, not in first grade. The math I see kids doing in 4th grade is math I didn't do until 6th grade. High schools now often teach calculus in 11th or 12th grade, we had it mostly as freshmen in college. Some physics that high schoolers study today is stuff that in the 1950s was only done in advanced level college or PhD programs. And so forth.

[atlcomedy]

Originally Posted by chelsea simms

I know in some poster's opinions I'm way to young to have any viable input on this subject,

I think you and any member should feel free to share your opinion on this or any topic.

Some topics, like this one and the honor topic, are fundamentally about changes over the course of decades. Honor didn't die between your 18th and 20th birthdays . There is something invaluable about the perspective of those that have actually witnessed those changes (vs. just hearing about it from Grandpappy or his golf buddies).

That's not to say there aren't other ways of learning about what happened years ago (or what is going on today in other parts of the world). In fact in this case you probably are much closer to the current situation than many others here because of your age.

[TexTushHog]

Originally Posted by Laurentius

I've been in college from the age of 14 to the present in various combinations of student, teacher, etc. I know the environment well.

Let me give you a real-life example of grade inflation from a class I took a couple of years ago.

In this class, grades were assigned based on a group project. The instructor gave me two partners -- one of whom was a lazy bum and the other was functionally illiterate. Literally.

Obviously, I wanted a good grade so I did the projects. Got an A. So did the lazy bum and the functional illiterate.

If you have ever wondered how absolute idiots end up with paper on their walls, that's one way that it is done.

In Massachusetts, graduates with BS degrees from their teaching programs have to take a test to make sure they are sufficiently competent to be teachers.

The test requires a TENTH GRADE level of reading/writing proficiency. Every year, at least a THIRD of these COLLEGE GRADUATES flunk the 10th grade reading/writing.

It's a disgrace.

Group projects are to education as collective punishment is to justice. An abomination. Period. No exceptions.

[China Doll]

Originally Posted by TexTushHog

Group projects are to education as collective punishment is to justice. An abomination. Period. No exceptions.

I don't know about that, TTH. Group projects taught me better than anything else could that I hate working with people.

I have been in school for a long time. I started college at 16 and I'm still goin'. In the last eight years, I have had ample opportunity to observe the work of other students. It still boggles my mind how well some of them have done in college considering their degree of illiteracy. Many of my classes required written essays for both assignments and on examinations, but many of them did not. I have taken classes in which the final grade was based solely on performance on multiple choice exams.
I was very good friends with one professor, and I asked him how the students were able to get decent grades when they had no real grasp on the English language. He told me that it is very simple. Most of the professors have either given up because the majority of what they see is garbage, or the professors themselves don't have as solid a grasp on the language as they should. I can't tell you how many times I saw shoddy writing/spelling in e-mails, examination questions, etc. written by professors.

Oden, you're absolutely right on the idea that education is being "dumbed down at the expense of our great minds." People like me, who have something to offer, have to work our way through college without help from anyone. Boo hoo, I know, but there's a point. Did you know that full scholarships are given to students whose grades would never allow them to enter any respectable college? These scholarships are offered to give them a chance. Now, that would be fine, but do we really have to specifically target the kids with the worst grades? Why not focus on underprivileged kids who worked their butts off?
I roomed with a girl with this type of scholarship who apparently needed to waste thousands of dollars of the scholarship money to realize that she wasn't cut out for school. Duh.

PS: I text quite a bit, but I text in the same way that I write. None of this "c u l8r" or "OMGLOLZZZ imma git all up in his koolaid wen we git bak 2 da hizzouse" nonsense.