rule for runner to first base

[VitaMan]

The runner was called out for ball interference. But there was no explanation how this rule is supposed to work.


Is batter supposed to run in a certain area on the way to first base ? If he is in that area, is that a safe zone ? Or is it anytime there is a throw to the first baseman, if he is prevented from catching it by the batter, the batter is automatically out ?


If so, the batter clearly interfered - the glove was knocked off the first basemans hand.


Martinez went way overboard protesting this call. He looked foolish.

[tbone2u]

I thought it was pretty much explained last night

[Chung Tran]

Originally Posted by tbone2u

I thought it was pretty much explained last night

no it wasn't.. an attempt was made, but it was clear as mud.. the way it was read, both the runner and fielder looked like the call should have gone their way.

what I THINK is the rule, the runner can run outside the baseline, as long as he is "straight-on" with the bag as he hits it with his foot.. meaning he can start outside the line, as long as he rights the ship the final step. which Turner did.. but the Fielder gets a chance to catch the throw, without interference. I honestly can see both arguments, the call could have gone either way for me. if I was ruling, I would have called it similar to an NFL pass play, where a receiver and Safety collide while going for the ball.. shit happens, let the play stand. nobody deliberately interfered, both were "in the right".. but I would have made the guy on first base stop at second, not go to third base. that's just me, the rule book doesn't back me up

[DEAR_JOHN]

The fielder has the right to make the play, especially in a bunt situation at first base. The batter/runner knocked off the glove of the first baseman, therefore causing the rule to be enforced.


It's usually one of those calls that isn't made unless it's a problem or obvious, like last night.


Now, if the first baseman obstructs the base or is standing in the baseline, that's obstruction and the batter/runner can be called safe.


So it's a fine line on what to call. Obviously obstruction wasn't a part of the play.


This kind of call is an umpires nightmare and one they hate to make.

[romroos]

Huge Stros fan, but the umpire blew the call. The response from MLB was it is a judgement call and cannot be reviewed. So, if it can’t be reviewed why did they spend time with the headphones talking to NY and messing with the momentum of the game.
Regardless, we are talking about possibly altering the World Series. Common sense ...the play should have been reviewable and the runner called safe.
The runner is entitled to run down the line and not impede with the first baseman’s ability to catch the throw. In this case Turner hit the middle of the bag. Not a problem. Safe.

[Chung Tran]

Originally Posted by DEAR_JOHN

The batter/runner knocked off the glove of the first baseman, therefore causing the rule to be enforced.

Originally Posted by romroos

The runner is entitled to run down the line and not impede with the first baseman’s ability to catch the throw. In this case Turner hit the middle of the bag. Not a problem. Safe.

these statements appear contradictory, but I agree with the second. the runner has a right to go where he needs to go, to first base.. besides, if he knocks the glove of the first baseman, AND he was running properly in the baseline (nobody thinks he was not), ipso facto he arrived before the ball, so the proper call is safe at first base. as I said before, I would keep the other guy at second base, not allow him to reach third. anyone want to weigh in on that argument?

[VitaMan]

The ball was thrown to the first baseman, and all he did was attempt to catch it. When doing that, the batter knocked his glove off. When he knocked the glove off, he was not yet at the bag. Seems clear cut that umpires made the correct call......unless the batter has a safe zone he can be running in.

[boardman]

It's entirely a judgement call therefor it's not reviewable. The delay came because the Ump in NYC was explaining that to the Ump on the field. They said he actually read the rule verbatim.


Smoltz mentioned that fielders are coached in that situation to make the throw exactly where it was made in the hopes that if the runner has a 1/2 step on the throw you still have a chance of getting the call they got last night. It worked.
For the most part 150 years of baseball has defined the rules pretty well with few gray areas. This is one rule that still has some ambiguity.

[romroos]

Originally Posted by boardman

It's entirely a judgement call therefor it's not reviewable. The delay came because the Ump in NYC was explaining that to the Ump on the field. They said he actually read the rule verbatim.


Smoltz mentioned that fielders are coached in that situation to make the throw exactly where it was made in the hopes that if the runner has a 1/2 step on the throw you still have a chance of getting the call they got last night. It worked.
For the most part 150 years of baseball has defined the rules pretty well with few gray areas. This is one rule that still has some ambiguity.

Agree with you 💯

From a fan’s perspective, how long does it take for NY to read the rule? I didn’t time it but it seemed like a 5 minute delay. I think this looked bad for MLB.

[Chung Tran]

Originally Posted by VitaMan

The ball was thrown to the first baseman, and all he did was attempt to catch it. When doing that, the batter knocked his glove off. When he knocked the glove off, he was not yet at the bag. Seems clear cut that umpires made the correct call......unless the batter has a safe zone he can be running in.

I just watched the replay from every slow motion angle.. the batter was at the base, maybe not on it, but he was at it. the fielder was afraid of getting hit by the runner, and made a half-effort to glove the ball, thus his glove got clipped off.. but the runner beat the ball to the bag, which is why I would say "safe".. however, I'm still bugged a little by the runner's angle. yeah, he was "square" to the bad at the last step, but he came in from a slight "field angle" to the bag, which didn't give the fielder a REAL chance at catching the throw. in other words, I didn't learn a God Damn thing seeing the replay

Originally Posted by boardman

Smoltz mentioned that fielders are coached in that situation to make the throw exactly where it was made in the hopes that if the runner has a 1/2 step on the throw you still have a chance of getting the call they got last night. It worked.

I heard him say that, and it still seems murky to me. how could a fielder, from about 80 feet away, in a split second decision, have any idea that a runner might beat the throw by a half second? damn, just throw it and see if you get him out!

Originally Posted by romroos

Agree with you ��

From a fan’s perspective, how long does it take for NY to read the rule? I didn’t time it but it seemed like a 5 minute delay. I think this looked bad for MLB.

it looked very bad, and it was closer to 10 minutes.

the runner, Turner, could be heard on camera, bitching that Torre (Baseball Commissioner) was sitting "right over there", apparently thinking Torre should rule on the play at that moment. he accused Torre of "ducking his head", as if to avoid getting involved.. I thought that was classless as Hell, but that was not grounds to toss him from the game, like the Manager Martinez who kept yelling "fuck that"!