True GFE

[guest040711-1]

To expand on a coffee conversation where we discussed True GFE vs just doing all the acronyms. I used to use the term "Illusion of Passion" to describe True GFE, now maybe "Mattress Actress" is more appropriate.

Those that have experienced it will understand when I say some special women can connect mentally/emotionally as well as physically, some can just allow you to go through the alphabet.

I have a list of those that can, and they are the ones I've seen more than once.

Any thoughts from others?

[guest041110]

I will be a little specific SP in that I draw a line between a mattress actress and a GFE lady providing the “illusion of passion”. I view the former being a trap, a lie and a thing to avoid while the latter is just a great thing to have whenever you can.

To wit, I once believed a provider in Houston was telling me the truth about how she felt since she was so insistent on telling me. However, I was always thinking… “naaaawwww… she doesn’t feel that way towards me” even though she claimed she did. The reason why I thought what I did was her actions showed she was lying ergo, in my book, she is a mattress actress and NOT a GFE like she claims to be.

I have been with other providers who really are the GFE “illusion of passion” and are a delight to be with like a member who joined today, Michelle Sandra Bell. When I have seen Sandra, our time together was the definition of what the GFE illusion is supposed to be without the false pretense and leading on like the one I was seeing back in 2005, referenced above, who is a total mattress actress and a risk to any hobbyist because of her lies. Sandra is a delight to be with and takes GFE where it is supposed to be while that other provider took GFE to a new low and caused me to create some serious boundaries due to her lying to me/about me to others, so live and learn.

From my first hand perspective, I can tell you there is a huge difference between being with a GFE “illusion of passion” which Sandra is versus being with a “mattress actress” who gives the part her all because she has ulterior motives which can be used against a hobbyist like it was done to me. The former is to be treasured while the latter is to be avoided at all costs unless you want that kind of attention, trouble and risk of things like being outted or banned from a site due to her actions.

Just my dos centavous on the subject.

[YSD]

Guys, I guess I have become jaded. I think mattress actress is a really good description. The jaded part is that I do not/will not/cannot get into the GFE---as I always seem to think it to be an act or an illusion. I guess that is why I have tended to seek out PSE.

My feeling is that with PSE, what you see is what you get. There is no illusion of romance, it is just pedal to the metal and full blown sex without the hiccups of emotion if you will. I know it is so jaded I do not even like writing it, but it is what it is. It is hard to come to grips with this from a personal level. I guess that is why I try to keep my feet planted both in the real world (for the GFE) and in the fantasy world for the PSE. Dating ladies not in the profession keeps me grounded. Seeing ladies in the profession lets me scratch the wild itch when needed.

So to sum up: real world chicks for GFE and staying grounded; providers for PSE and scratching severe and serious itches. And oh yeah, I love girls who are into the PSE thing. For me personally, it is the best experience one can possible have in "that other" world.

[fubar]

I personally like a provider that starts GFE then turns into a PSE hellion. That is what I am talking about.
Weeeeeeeeeelllllllllllll.

[Introuble]

I always looked at the GFE experience as "mind fucking" and not a checklist of activities.

When each person removes a single brick in their protective walls to let the other person reach inside and feel their soul, when there is a little something personal put into it by each person, it creates a synergy of emotions and passions. Passion is personal, and unless one can gently touch the other through that wall, it simply is not GFE (to me).

Without that connection, I add you to the list of one-timers and almosts.

[Clouddancer]

The illusion of passion is a good description and so is mattress actress but there are a few ladies I've met that genuinely enjoy the session and go well beyond the illusion.
I think Introuble described it best.
These are the ladies that can connect emotionally and I think GFE is not really an adequate term, maybe courtesan?
Of course this is a business, but these ladies love what they do, and I think, care for their gentleman friends.
I know I always leave feeling a little bit more than the usual hot session.

[guest041110]

I understand what you guys have written and I am not necessarily in disagreement with you especially with what you wrote Jericho but let me be clear in what I wrote.

I view a mattress actress in the pejorative sense while a real GFE is closer to being a Courtesan than an escort in my opinion. I have a real world friend who is also a provider and I know she is a Courtesan, not an escort, because she can do what Introuble wrote about being able to break through and connect emotionally but with secure boundaries.

I have had GFE as well as PSE experiences in my time in the P4P world but I wanted to be clear that not all escorts who write that they are GFE or have reviews that indicate they are GFE really are, hence my definition of mattress actress in a pejorative context. I now view the provider I was involved with a couple of years ago as being a mattress actress and nothing more. Her reviews are based upon the checklist of activities that Introuble mentioned in his post above which means in her case that the mechanics are in place for a GFE experience but what makes a GFE is something 99% of the women don’t, or can’t, do.

Like Jericho, I no longer allow myself to be sucked into this world’s definition, or fantasy, of a GFE escort because I reserve that for the real world women I have, or hope to have, in my life. This realm is a place to get your freak on without any entanglements and I have seen a so-called GFE escort turn sour and become a real hazard to hobbyist because she does not follow the rules while having her ulterior motives in what she does. What I am looking for is a pleasant woman to be around and have sex with, not be with some damn drama queen who has major personal issues.

To say I am jaded would be the understatement of the year, no doubt. However, Jericho I don’t view what you wrote as being jaded, just rooted in the real world which is where I choose to be as well.

[guest040711-1]

Further explanation of my use of Mattress Actress, after over four decades of being around strippers and providers I've formulated in my own mind that many deep down have a distaste for the activity they do. They seem to disconnect in order to perform, some I know actually experience nausea.

The providers that IMO are able to make that extra connection that is both mental/emotional as well as physical are the cream of the crop and are what we talk about being True GFE.

Hope this makes sense.

[Chevalier]

Originally Posted by LonesomeDove

I wanted to be clear that not all escorts who write that they are GFE or have reviews that indicate they are GFE really are

Similarly, some of the ladies who say they are really hot . . . really aren't. Shocking, isn't it? No, not really. Normal advertising "fluff." I don't consider it evil deception but neither do I rely on it, any more than I would with other products or services that are advertised. No reason to be any more offended (or cynical) about it in P4P than in the civilian world.

Although a lady who advertises herself as GFE may want to convey that she makes that connection with most of her clients . . . and some of them really are GFE . . . about all that you can be fairly sure of (and there are exceptions even there) is that she offers the standard menu we associate with "GFE."

With respect to whether she'll connect with you, it's mostly a matter of trial and error. Reviews? They rarely give me a good sense of whether there was a real connection, especially since the reviewer may define "connection" quite differently than I do. And even if she connected with him, there's no guarantee that she'll connect with me. *shrug* Awhile back I discussed with another client a couple of ladies we'd both seen; we agreed that there was a noticeably stronger connection with one lady than with the other -- but disagreed about which was which.

[caddyman]

From my perspective Introuble and SP have nailed the idea of GFE. GFE is about the courtesan level of attention of a woman devoting herself to you. For the woman it is mental thing. It is stressful and demanding. It is the ultimate form of acting, role playing and immersion in the persona. It is uncommon, almost rare, to find. For the hobbyist it is an experience that leaves one wanting more. It is the reason one sees providers. It is the reason we are here.

I see the almost constant refrain of GFE being about a list of acronyms, a series of physical activities. That is not what the GFE experience is about. That is an experience one walks away from momentarily physically satisfied but almost immediately mentally disappointed. It is an experience after which one truly asks himself if masturbation is not a more efficient means to an end.

People say that one only remembers the good stuff. But, memory can also be a bitch. Because once you have experienced the true GFE you never forget. And that is what drives one to continue to search, hunt, seeing endless numbers of women just for that one fleeting moment, in that one hour. It is the reason one can not walk away. They say that caffeine is the reason people drink coffee and nicotine is the reason people smoke. Well, if that is true then true GFE is the reason that men are in the hobby.

[Guest030911]

Originally Posted by LonesomeDove

...
I view a mattress actress in the pejorative sense while a real GFE is closer to being a Courtesan than an escort in my opinion. I have a real world friend who is also a provider and I know she is a Courtesan, not an escort, because she can do what Introuble wrote about being able to break through and connect emotionally but with secure boundaries.......

quick segue:
My vocabulary has improved over the last several years because of message boards and the desire to be succinct, not to sound smart. Thanks for bringing pejorative to my conscious mind again..

Back on topic: I think expecting to leave a session with the feeling that she really was attracted to me is unrealistic. However, I have seen some ladies who had such a skill of "charm on tap" that made me admire their mastery of their craft. Generally speaking, I use the term "illusion of passion" to mean that if the gal I was seeing at the time had any disdain for me or doing the session, they completely hid it and made me feel like I was a preferred client they like spending time with.

When they just turn their head to the side and close their eyes and "go off into space", I realize that component is missing. However, I may still list them as GFE if the check list of activities are available. I chalk up the lack of passion to YMMV, a bad day, lacking the enthusiasm for their work, or some other intangible. I don't hold it against them. I could not do their job enthusiastically if I had to see a bunch of fat old women or women with some serious issues.



Just some quick thoughts I thought I would toss out there so others would know what I am talking about when I talk about the "illusion of passion" and GFE.

[Introuble]

Originally Posted by LonesomeDove

I view a _mattress actress_ in the pejorative sense while a real GFE is closer to being a Courtesan than an escort in my opinion. I have a real world friend who is also a provider and I know she is a Courtesan, not an escort, because she can do what Introuble wrote about being able to break through and connect emotionally but with secure boundaries.


Her reviews are based upon the checklist of activities that Introuble mentioned in his post above which means in her case that the mechanics are in place for a GFE experience but what makes a GFE is something 99% of the women don’t, or can’t, do.

Providers are better at removing the brick and putting it back when done than clients are. Clients tend to want to not only leave the brick out, but remove more bricks. Some providers do too, but overall from that perspective, providers do a better job of protecting and using that wall. I only fall in love with the one provider I saw today. Imagine falling in love with 5 guys a day. Providers are to be commended for doing as well as they do. Of course, we the clients are not as good looking as they are so I guess maybe that is a bad comparison.

TRUE GFE is a concept and experience that many are unfamiliar with and quite honestly, many would have problems with if they did. While many of us run around and beat our chest and say "GFE, GFE, GFE", many of us including myself struggle sometimes when we do find it. So that everyone is clear, it is the passion side of the equation that we are talking about, not the DFK/BBBJ/DATY/CF stuff. I can teach my dog to do that.

Because a true Courtesian is so believable, the connection and emotion during the session become something that most people need and crave or we would not be there to begin with.......the feeling of being wanted. Even providers need it sometimes and an aware client can pick up on this (and hopefully not take advantage of it - another thread maybe). Some clients say that they just want a fuck, a nut, or as SP states, its all about the hunt. True, without the hunt, you cannot explore new relationships. This is an attrition sport and the hunt in and of itself is the second best thing in the hobby next to finding that special person. Many will say that they only desire to get a nut but I believe that feeling is rooted in your deepest desires to be with someone via a connection emotionally. Otherwise go get a magazine and get connected in the bathroom.

Lonesome Dove is correct , and I believe that most cannot deal with true GFE, whether client or provider. GFE is not a sport for the weak, many will fall victim to the emotional drain it will bestow upon them, and unless they are a glutton for punishment, it is probably best most providers are not quite true GFE.......at least in the capacity LD and myself are describing.

Most hobbyists simply need a GOOD mattress actress. I myself look continuously for the holy grail of providers, the one that allows me to be part of her life for an hour at a time, the one that makes me feel like she should be paying me, the one that makes me feel as if the 1,000 men before me didn't matter......only I matter.

GFE to me as I described it to a provider the other day - I have to get inside your head (mind fucking) to enjoy you. I want to know how your week is going, the kids names, what you do for fun, your thoughts and feelings on issues, what you like sexually (in real life)....I want to know you as a person. I do not need to know where you live, your last name, or what your husband does for a living. But in order to get that connection, it takes getting personal in some way. Some can do it totally sexually with expressions and touching, others you need to talk to in order to develop the connection. I want to be with the REAL natural person....not the provider personality. ISN'T THAT WHAT THE GIRL FRIEND EXPERIENCE IS ABOUT? That is why I like providers in Blue Jeans, skirt, blouses, T-Shirts. Nothing is more of a turn off to me than a provider opening the door looking like some Victoria Secret Ad. I want the REAL person, not a fantasy girl. Naked is good too at the door.....very natural. The real fantasy is with the REAL person, not her provider identity she has developed.

I would be curious as to what other people's definition is of GFE. Not the physical things ie DFK, BBJ etc. but rather the connection, emotional side we call "Illusion of Passion"

Most providers are not capable of that even though they might get close. I have met two people in 10 years of hobbying that were capable of giving me what I need. The others were enjoyable for the most part, but the ellusive courtesian (GFE) is hiding.

[guest041110]

Introuble, you hit it on what my definition of a GFE is and those are the reasons why I do not allow it to occur in this realm for me. Since I need the emotional connection to really enjoy a woman, at the GFE level, I have learned from my bad experience with another provider that I was involved with not to go there again in this realm.

That is why I look, like Jericho, for the GFE in the women I see in the real world and just get my freak on in this realm every so often with someone who is pleasant to be with, who is good in bed and is fun. Whomever I am with in this world allows me to scratch that itch for sex which then allows me to approach real world women without them having to be on guard about whether they need to worry that I am trying to get into their panties. That allows for a level of trust to form which is the beginning of a friendship. From there, the rest is up to how each handles life.

I once had the feeling that someone wanted me, both here and in the real world, and I know I will have that again but not here. Been there, done that and don't want that here again.

[YSD]

This thread has been really cool. The responses for the most part are all somewhat different. Without being a goober, thanks guys because the responses really did make me look at some things a bit differently---still jaded---but differently.

[Introuble]

There is no one more jaded than myself. However I think for me a better word is cynical. It is unfortunate for some providers, but I simply cut to the chase and bottom line faster than they are prepared for sometimes. Most of it is games and I don't do games. You either have it or you don't as far as GFE as it is not something you acquire.