Welcome to ECCIE, become a part of the fastest growing adult community. Take a minute & sign up!

Welcome to ECCIE - Sign up today!

Become a part of one of the fastest growing adult communities online. We have something for you, whether you’re a male member seeking out new friends or a new lady on the scene looking to take advantage of our many opportunities to network, make new friends, or connect with people. Join today & take part in lively discussions, take advantage of all the great features that attract hundreds of new daily members!

Go Premium

Go Back   ECCIE Worldwide > General Interest > The Sandbox - National
test
The Sandbox - National The Sandbox is a collection of off-topic discussions. Humorous threads, Sports talk, and a wide variety of other topics can be found here.

Most Favorited Images
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
Most Liked Images
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
  • Thumb
Top Reviewers
cockalatte 646
MoneyManMatt 490
Still Looking 399
samcruz 399
Jon Bon 396
Harley Diablo 377
honest_abe 362
DFW_Ladies_Man 313
Chung Tran 288
lupegarland 287
nicemusic 285
You&Me 281
Starscream66 279
George Spelvin 265
sharkman29 255
Top Posters
DallasRain70795
biomed163272
Yssup Rider61003
gman4453295
LexusLover51038
offshoredrilling48665
WTF48267
pyramider46370
bambino42671
CryptKicker37220
The_Waco_Kid37067
Mokoa36496
Chung Tran36100
Still Looking35944
Mojojo33117

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old 02-17-2013, 09:33 PM   #1
SEE3772
Valued Poster
 
SEE3772's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 14, 2011
Location: Key Largo
Posts: 1,384
Encounters: 7
Default More Workers Raiding 401(k) Plans ( To Pay Bills) Long Before Retirement

The number of people tapping retirement plans to pay their bills is raising questions about the effectiveness of vehicles like 401(k) plans.

WASHINGTON — A large and growing share of American workers are tapping their retirement savings accounts for nonretirement needs, raising broad questions about the effectiveness of one of the most important savings vehicles for old age.

More than one in four American workers with 401(k) and other retirement savings accounts use them to pay current expenses, new data show. The withdrawals, cash-outs, and loans drain nearly a quarter of the $293 billion that workers and employers deposit into the accounts each year, undermining already shaky retirement security for millions of Americans.

With policy makers eyeing cuts to Social Security benefits and Medicare to rein in the soaring federal deficit, and traditional pensions in long decline, retirement savings experts say the drain from the accounts has dire implications for future retirees.

‘‘We’re going from bad to worse,’’ said Diane Oakley, executive director of the National Institute on Retirement Security. ‘‘Already, fewer private-sector workers have access to stable pension plans. And the savings in individual retirement savings accounts like 401(k) plans — which already are severely underfunded — continue to leak out at a high rate.’’


A report due this week from the financial advisory firm HelloWallet found that more than one in four workers dip into retirement funds to pay mortgages, credit card debt, or other bills. Those in their 40s have been the most likely culprits; one-third are turning to such accounts for relief.

Fresh data from Vanguard, one of the nation’s largest 401(k) managers, show a 12 percent increase in the number of workers who took loans against their retirement accounts or withdrew money outright since 2008.

The most common way Americans tap their retirement funds is through loans, which must be repaid with interest. Those who withdraw money face hefty penalties. In most cases, they not only incur a 10 percent federal tax penalty but also pay capital gains taxes. The costs are financially harmful to families, but money-management firms reap massive fees.

In addition, employers often are subsidizing the accounts with matching contributions on the assumption the money is helping to secure their employees’ retirements.

“I don’t think this can be ignored. Employers are dramatically overpaying for retirement, but it is not benefiting the employee,’’ said Matt Fellowes, a former Brookings Institution researcher who is now chief executive of HelloWallet. ‘‘In many cases, the only one benefiting is the vendor.’’

Since 401(k)s were created by Congress in 1978, concern about the pervasive use of retirement funds for other expenses has grown as other means of retirement security have dwindled.

In 1980, four of five private-sector workers were covered by traditional pensions that paid a fixed benefit based on salary and length of service. Now, just one in five workers has a pension, leaving 401(k)s and similar retirement savings accounts as the primary vehicles for retirees to supplement Social Security benefits.

‘‘Encouraging or enabling people to spend down retirement money in anything other than the most severe circumstances is a terrible mistake,’’ said David John, a senior fellow at the Heritage Foundation.

But millions of Americans, caught between flat wages and high expenses for everything from sending children to college to making home repairs, feel as though they have little choice.

In 2010, 28 percent of participants reported having an outstanding loan against their retirement accounts, a record high, according to a survey of 110 large employers by Aon Hewitt, a human resources consultancy. And nearly 7 percent of employees took hardship withdrawals that year — roughly a 40 percent increase since the recession — while 42 percent of workers cashed out their plans, rather than roll them over, when they changed jobs.

Overall, about a third of American households participate in 401(k)-type accounts, which hold a combined $3.5 trillion in assets. But a large portion of that money does not make it to retirement. A recent study by Boston College’s Center for Retirement Research found the typical household approaching retirement age has an average of $120,000 in retirement savings, enough for roughly a $7,000-a-year annuity.

‘‘401(k)s are not being used for retirement by a large and growing share of workers because they are misaligned with the very basic financial problems most workers face and must address,’’ said Fellowes, of HelloWallet.

Federal policy makers and employer retirement managers have focused little on the threat to retirement security posed by premature withdrawals and instead have worked to devise ways to get workers to put more money into the accounts at an earlier age.

In 2006, employers were given broader latitude to enroll employees in 401(k)-type plans unless workers asked not to participate. Just this year, the annual limit for 401(k)-type contributions increased from $17,000 to $17,500 for workers under age 50, and from $22,500 to $23,000 for those who are older. Meanwhile, the Saver’s Tax Credit provides up to $1,000 to help low-income workers build retirement savings.

Many employers have embraced 401(k) and other defined-contribution accounts as a way of helping workers save for retirement while relieving themselves of the financial risks that come with managing a traditional pension plan. In theory, 401(k) accounts are better suited to an economy in which workers are changing jobs more frequently than ever, because they can be rolled over from previous employers. But their success depends on workers consistently contributing to them and allowing the money to stay in place throughout their careers, allowing their investment returns to compound.

Generally, workers are allowed to tap their retirement accounts for loans up to $50,000, or half their account’s value, whichever is smaller. They also can ‘‘cash out’’ the money when they change jobs or they can take ‘‘hardship’’ withdrawals, which often go to pay for housing, overdue bills, or educational expenses. The cash outs and hardship withdrawals subject account holders to taxes on the money they put into the accounts, any investment gains, and if they are under 59½ years old, a 10 percent tax penalty.

Retirement experts warn that when workers draw on their retirement accounts to pay current bills, they put themselves at greater risk of descending into poverty upon retirement.

The widespread breaching of retirement accounts has led some advocates to conclude that policy makers and employers should expand their vision when thinking about their workers’ retirement needs.

Fellowes said workers would be better served by establishing emergency savings accounts that steered clear of the potential tax penalties, investment fees, and other risks and costs associated with having money in retirement accounts. Only after establishing an emergency savings fund, he said, should workers plow their money into retirement savings.

Soon In America, Retirement Will Be As Rare As A Single Income Household

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UJVMWjTQh_Y
SEE3772 is offline   Quote
Old 02-17-2013, 10:16 PM   #2
Old-T
Valued Poster
 
Old-T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 20, 2010
Location: From hotel to hotel
Posts: 9,058
Encounters: 15
Default

And your solution is.....?
Old-T is offline   Quote
Old 02-17-2013, 11:19 PM   #3
Chica Chaser
Premium Access
 
Chica Chaser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 18, 2009
Location: Mesaba
Posts: 31,149
Encounters: 7
Default

I lot of people had no choice but to tap their 401k accounts when they were laid off back in 2008-2009. Its hard to live off $200/wk unemployment and maintain any sort of life.
Chica Chaser is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 02:13 PM   #4
Jewish Lawyer
Valued Poster
 
Jewish Lawyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 28, 2012
Location: Tel Aviv
Posts: 6,287
Encounters: 22
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Chica Chaser View Post
I lot of people had no choice but to tap their 401k accounts when they were laid off back in 2008-2009. Its hard to live off $200/wk unemployment and maintain any sort of life.
Especially when that will only get you one AMP session per week...who can live with just one visit to a provider?
Jewish Lawyer is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 02:19 PM   #5
joe bloe
Valued Poster
 
joe bloe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 10, 2010
Location: Houston
Posts: 5,740
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old-T View Post
And your solution is.....?
Limited government. Abide by the Constitution. Keep the dollar strong.
joe bloe is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 02:48 PM   #6
Old-T
Valued Poster
 
Old-T's Avatar
 
Join Date: Aug 20, 2010
Location: From hotel to hotel
Posts: 9,058
Encounters: 15
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe bloe View Post
Limited government. Abide by the Constitution. Keep the dollar strong.
How, pray tell, does that fix the problem of dipping into 401Ks, etc?

It doesn't.
Old-T is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 03:01 PM   #7
joe bloe
Valued Poster
 
joe bloe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 10, 2010
Location: Houston
Posts: 5,740
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Old-T View Post
How, pray tell, does that fix the problem of dipping into 401Ks, etc?

It doesn't.
Do I have to explain everything? People are being forced to dip into their retirement accounts because the economy is in the toilet. The economy is in the toilet because of too many government regulations and high taxes. The economy will rebound if we reign in the size of the federal government to it's Constitutional boundaries and let people keep more of the money they earn.

Pretty soon the government will be raiding the 401Ks. They're going to force people to accept government backed annuities in place of their life savings. We are headed for desperate times. At some point, it may make sense to burn the Steinway instead of freezing to death.
joe bloe is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 04:41 PM   #8
jbravo_123
Verified Member
 
jbravo_123's Avatar
 
Join Date: Feb 7, 2012
Location: Houston
Posts: 2,548
Encounters: 15
Default

Doesn't surprise me. People are notoriously bad at managing their money in general. Look how much credit card debt the average American racks up buying crap like replacing their huge screen TV / furniture every 3 years. Their 401k is just another source to scavenge to get more crap they don't need.
jbravo_123 is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 04:54 PM   #9
joe bloe
Valued Poster
 
joe bloe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 10, 2010
Location: Houston
Posts: 5,740
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by jbravo_123 View Post
Doesn't surprise me. People are notoriously bad at managing their money in general. Look how much credit card debt the average American racks up buying crap like replacing their huge screen TV / furniture every 3 years. Their 401k is just another source to scavenge to get more crap they don't need.

"working jobs we hate so we can buy shit we don’t need"
Tyler Durden

joe bloe is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 05:28 PM   #10
Jewish Lawyer
Valued Poster
 
Jewish Lawyer's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 28, 2012
Location: Tel Aviv
Posts: 6,287
Encounters: 22
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe bloe View Post
Limited government. Abide by the Constitution. Keep the dollar strong.
I'm afraid the constitution is a dead dog, ignored by the liberals except when they need it to beat us up.
Jewish Lawyer is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 05:42 PM   #11
joe bloe
Valued Poster
 
joe bloe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 10, 2010
Location: Houston
Posts: 5,740
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jewish Lawyer View Post
I'm afraid the constitution is a dead dog, ignored by the liberals except when they need it to beat us up.
You're probably right. If constitutional government is ever restored, it won't be in our lifetimes.

At this point, I think we conservatives have an obligation just to keep the spark of liberty alive, so that, at some point it may be restored, sort of like the characters in "Fahrenheit 451" that memorized an entire book, the government had burned. We should probably start memorizing the Federalist Papers.
joe bloe is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 06:12 PM   #12
Guest040616
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Dec 23, 2009
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 15,047
Encounters: 8
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe bloe View Post
We should probably start memorizing the Federalist Papers.
Joe the Bloehard, I will check back next week and see how you're progressing!
Guest040616 is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 06:32 PM   #13
Chica Chaser
Premium Access
 
Chica Chaser's Avatar
 
Join Date: Dec 18, 2009
Location: Mesaba
Posts: 31,149
Encounters: 7
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by Jewish Lawyer View Post
Especially when that will only get you one AMP session per week...who can live with just one visit to a provider?
Like those clowns getting cash on their food stamp card from the ATM in the strip club.
Chica Chaser is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 06:39 PM   #14
joe bloe
Valued Poster
 
joe bloe's Avatar
 
Join Date: Mar 10, 2010
Location: Houston
Posts: 5,740
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by bigtex View Post
Joe the Bloehard, I will check back next week and see how you're progressing!
I'm trying to find the Cliff Notes version.
joe bloe is offline   Quote
Old 02-18-2013, 06:42 PM   #15
Guest040616
Account Disabled
 
Join Date: Dec 23, 2009
Location: Central Texas
Posts: 15,047
Encounters: 8
Default

Quote:
Originally Posted by joe bloe View Post
I'm trying to find the Cliff Notes version.

Lazy cocksucker
Guest040616 is offline   Quote
Reply



AMPReviews.net
Find Ladies
Hot Women

Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright © 2009 - 2016, ECCIE Worldwide, All Rights Reserved